Reactions from the Pro Peloton to #USPSConspiracy (USADA) - post here

[spetsa]

Vaughters is correct. Armstrong is irrelevant.

The sport has compartmentalized Lance, put him and his co-conspirators in a box. What USADA is doing has little effect on the Tour, the sport has moved one.

Of course his irrelevancy drives Lance crazy. He thinks that by bringing him down the sport will be brought done. The sport does not care about the problems of an age group Tri Athlete.

Irrelevant

I thought is was great to hear TJ VG (yesterday) talk about how cool it was to be talked about, along with the names of America's cycling "icons"...Greg LeMond and Andy Hampsten. LA knows his spot in history, and its spiraling daily.

 

[sniper]

Vaughters is correct. Armstrong is irrelevant.

The sport has compartmentalized Lance, put him and his co-conspirators in a box. What USADA is doing has little effect on the Tour, the sport has moved one.

Of course his irrelevancy drives Lance crazy. He thinks that by bringing him down the sport will be brought done. The sport does not care about the problems of an age group Tri Athlete.

Irrelevant

I wish I could agree , but how is LA irrelevant to the tour?
So many examples of how the usada vs.LA case directly affects current members of the peloton, the UCI, and of course the entire (anti-)doping movement (all of which need revisions, sanctions, you name it, based on the outcome of the usada vs. lance case).
Indeed, what if Bottle wins the Tour?

Whether indirectly or directly, there is no denying that LA is very relevant to present-day cycling including the tour obviously. The sport of cycling will only have moved on as soon as guys like Pat and Bruyneel (i.e. with a direct connexion to Lance) have disappeared from the peloton.
and to be honest I'm not sure if I am willing to give Vaughters the benefit of the doubt (many doubts) either.

 

[Berzin]

So what are we to make of this quote? Sounds like Vaughters is pretty confident that neither he nor any of his riders are or will be suspended-

Vaughters, who is in France leading his team at the Tour, has used his Twitter account to issue a denial: "Regarding the Dutch media report: no 6mos (sic) suspensions have been given to any member of Slipstream Sports. Today or at any future date."

 

[neineinei]

So what are we to make of this quote? Sounds like Vaughter sis pretty confident that neither he nor any of his riders are or will be suspended-

Vaughters, who is in France leading his team at the Tour, has used his Twitter account to issue a denial: "Regarding the Dutch media report: no 6mos (sic) suspensions have been given to any member of Slipstream Sports. Today or at any future date."

The story was that the six month suspension was from September (so, shock and horror, USADA let the cheats be free to ride the Tour and the Vuelta.) And that is probably what "the today or at any future date" part of the message is about. That he is confident that they wont be suspended can't be read into the quote, in my opinion.

 

[KingsMountain]

Berzin,

On the contrary, JV makes no claim about suspensions which may be decided in the future. He does deny that a suspension has already been decided which is to be served in the future.

 

[joe_papp]

So what are we to make of this quote? Sounds like Vaughter sis pretty confident that neither he nor any of his riders are or will be suspended-

Vaughters, who is in France leading his team at the Tour, has used his Twitter account to issue a denial: "Regarding the Dutch media report: no 6mos (sic) suspensions have been given to any member of Slipstream Sports. Today or at any future date."

Total misdirection.

USADA won't "give" the suspension until such time as the rider in question testifies, or, if there's no arbitration, until after a "guilty" "verdict" is formally delivered (by default) against the rider against who the witness was to have testified.

Even then though, it's not like there'll be a formal plea agreement in place, and USADA will be free to assign whatever sanction it wants against the witnesses. Just look at the details of my case to see how that can go against them!

"Today or at any future date" = nonsensical

 

[BroDeal]

Tweeter Sagan ‏@TweeterSagan
Sagan very sorry for Mr Levi, Mr Zabriskie, Mr Christian, Mr Vaughters & Mr Hincapie. No cyclo-cross again for them this year.

 

[Cal_Joe]

Tweeter Sagan ‏@TweeterSagan
Sagan very sorry for Mr Levi, Mr Zabriskie, Mr Christian, Mr Vaughters & Mr Hincapie. No cyclo-cross again for them this year.

FYI, TweeterSagan is not Peter Sagan.

 

[Cloxxki]

FYI, TweeterSagan is not Peter Sagan.

Still, it does seem to be a fair estimate if the 6-month ban leaks prove to be worth anything. That's why you don't get bans in tennis, players can't afford to miss tournaments.

 

[Cal_Joe]

Still, it does seem to be a fair estimate if the 6-month ban leaks prove to be worth anything. That's why you don't get bans in tennis, players can't afford to miss tournaments.

Sure, but I what my comment was about is the request from Joe....

Let's keep this thread reasonably on-topic and stick to documenting the reactions from pro cyclists (and triathletes, too, and former riders, current DS's??) and providing appropriate commentary on said reactions. Want this to be a resource that's easy to access and doesn't require a lot of wading through typical Clinic in-fighting

 

[DominicDecoco]

JV seems to be very emotional about this according to his tweets.

 

[maarten]

Bruyneel has a regular column in the same paper that broke the story, De Telegraaf. Today's full column is only available online for payment (€1,10) or in the print edition; free web version has only an excerpt. Maybe someone who gets the paper can give us the full scoop?

Excerpt roughly translated:

"All the noise that's been created around the USADA story in among others this newspaper proves again that it was a good choice that I didn't go to this Tour. By making a step aside myself, I'm keeping the team in the lee of the ongoing investigation of Lance Armstrong and myself.

"I can't say much about the possible deal that USADA has made with five former teammates of Lance's. I found it very strange that the four cyclists recently took themselves out of consideration for the Olympic Games. For American athletes the Games are sacred. They are the pinnacle of one's career. Whether this case has something to do with it is hard for me to say. This matter is too delicate for me to go into it very deeply."

Original text:

"Alle rumoer die ontstaan is rond het Usada-verhaal in onder andere deze krant, bewijst nogmaals dat het een goede keuze is geweest dat ik niet naar deze Tour ga. Door zelf een stap op zij te zetten, hou ik de ploeg in de luwte van het onderzoek dat naar onder meer Lance Armstrong en mij loopt."

"Over de mogelijke deal die Usada met vijf voormalige ploeggenoten van Lance heeft gemaakt, kan ik vrij weinig zeggen. Ik vond het heel vreemd dat de vier renners zichzelf onlangs afmeldden voor de Olympische Spelen. Voor Amerikaanse sporters zijn de Olympische Spelen iets heiligs. Die vormen het hoogtepunt van hun carrière. Of deze zaak er iets mee te maken heeft, kan ik moeilijk zeggen. Al is deze kwestie te delicaat voor mij om hier diep op in te gaan."

http://www.telegraaf.nl/telesport/tour-de-france-2012/12501219/__Bruyneel__Heel_vreemd__.html

 

[pelodee]

1) Tim De Waele - Photographer

2) "Serious,do we care about what happened 10years ago....I'm not!‪#TDWsport‬ ‪#lancearmstrong"

3) http://twitter.com/TDWsport/status/221513597593993216

----------------------------------
Tim 4th March 2012:

"Please be aware that you're using our picture witch are copyright protected!!"

"If they're not removed all within 24h,we'll address ourselves to SOFAM who will take the necessaire juristic steps!"

"Hate it when people think, images are for free use and ignoring the copyright! "

 

[Cavalier]

This isn't directly related, but given this guy would have been in the team at the time, I think Orica-Greenedge need to have a damn good think about who they've hired now:

http://espn.go.com/olympics/cycling...e-armstrong-news-not-surprise-some-tour-qatar

Laurenzo Lapage, the Greenedge cycling sporting director who worked with Armstrong on the U.S. Postal Service and Discovery Channel teams from 2003-07, said the decision reaffirmed what most colleagues of Armstrong had long believed: He isn't a doper.

"Everyone who knows Lance and was racing and working with him knew this before," Lapage said as his team prepared for the first stage of the Tour of Qatar.

"It was not a surprise for anyone. It's a good feeling that the truth is out now," Lapage said. "The guy had a lot of success and a lot of people were jealous. ... People tried to break him down with lies and it is really good thing everything (is) over for him now. He did a lot of great things for cycling. It is his moment to live in peace."

 

[BroDeal]

After tonight Sky might want to assign someone to console Wiggins. A big bag of B.C. bud might work too.

 

[OldManThyme]

This isn't directly related, but given this guy would have been in the team at the time, I think Orica-Greenedge need to have a damn good think about who they've hired now:

http://espn.go.com/olympics/cycling...e-armstrong-news-not-surprise-some-tour-qatar

Matt White being a DS there is more worrying - ex US postal, cofidis, discovery and then fired from Slipstream.....

 

[Cavalier]

Interesting to see some double standards already coming out from people. Scott Sunderland:

https://twitter.com/triplesmc/status/238919622018084864

I fail to see who will be the winner here. A lot of people will be hurt as telling or finding out the truth often does.

I already called him out based on his previous statements of:

By keeping the witch hunt alive how many people and how much money are they saving, to say. I knew it....

He also accused me of this in the past:

with all respect you are making this personal. Give me credit that possibly I know a lot more about this than you do!

So he knew a lot more about it, and called it a witch-hunt, and now he calls it "the truth".

 

[Ferminal]

Reactions to Armstrong Sanction

Firstly, within the next 24 hours, USADA will officially hand down the sanction. It is OK to say (and phrasing it another way would be a misrepresentation of the truth) "Armstrong doped throughout his career", it doesn't need to be "USADA allege that Armstrong doped throughout his career". There is nothing alleged, it will be official. To suggest otherwise would in my opinion be a misrepresentation of the truth.

Anyway, what I'm seeing is a lot of "cycling will be worse for this", "what happened was in the past but now the sport will be hurt by it", "who will sponsor cycling now", "great, a 2nd place doper is now a Tour winner".

I guess I shouldn't be surprised, as it's these sort of attitudes which allowed the unabated doping to go on for a decade. The idea that doping violations should only be enforced if the short term cost-benefit for the sport comes out positive is ridiculous - it's the UCI mantra. Is that what they really want the anti-doping process to be about? "We will not enforce anti-doping policy if (...)".

Come out and say that you support the semi-legalisation of doping, at least this is a position of some merit. You are either for or against the anti-doping process, say that. I guess my problem is that they are so half-way about it.

Anyway, apologies for ranting, I'll start us off with this predictable one from Sunderland. I guess twitter wasn't around when Riis admitted so we didn't have to listen to his garbage back then.

-------------------------------------------------------

Scott Sunderland ‏@triplesmc

I fail to see who will be the winner here. A lot of people will be hurt as telling or finding out the truth often does

 

[pastronef]

http://www.twitter.com/Hayden Roulston @HaydenRoulston


I was once told. Front page news today. Fish and chip paper tomorrow. Yeah right! This 'fish and chip paper' must be on roids!

 

[RobbieCanuck]

Make no mistake, Lance Armstrong's failure to answer USADA's charges is a clear and unequivocal admission that he was a doper, cheat and conspired to use EPO from 1996 to 2010 because he knew without it he could not win.

Armstrong's feeble denial that USADA does not have jurisdiction and the UCI does is ludicrous. I have read Judge Sparks judgment and it is clear and convincing. Armstrong tried to use the Federal Court as a PR tool to perpetuate the fiction he did not dope.

Armstrong is a legend only in his own mind and clearly that of his lawyer Tim Herman whose disingenuous letter to USADA is so full of disinformation he should be appointed Secretary of Propaganda. Herman knows Sparks is correct, and Herman's weird interpretation of the facts in this case should win him fiction writer of the year.

Judge Sparks in his judgment summarizes the overwhelming evidence against Armstrong and unless LA has not a scintilla of brains, the writing was on the wall. LA has the moral obligation to return every penny he raised under the false pretense he won the TDF clean.

The sooner cycling is rid of Armstrong and his phoniness the better cycling will be. Tygart is incorrect - this is a good day. The only sad thing is LA just doesn't get it nor do his besotted fans who are blinded by faux celebrity.”

 

[Houndbike]

http://www.sbs.com.au/cyclingcentral/video/2272028745/phil-anderson-on-lance-armstrong

Phil Anderson really doesn't want to land his friend in it

 

[sniper]

http://www.sbs.com.au/cyclingcentral/video/2272028745/phil-anderson-on-lance-armstrong

Phil Anderson really doesn't want to land his friend in it

Anderson BS-ing his way through that interview.
He's really using way too many words, where he could just say straight away "we were all doped to the eyebrowes, so I feel a bit sorry for Lance."

and what's that he's saying in the middle of the interview: "I don'T think he's saying we all cheated (...)"

some interesting words towards the end, though, where he speaks of his time with Lance in the pre-cancer period.

 

[L'Etranger]

Some Twitter reactions from selected French cyclists, on l'Equipe's website.

jerome pineau @jejeroule44 Avec tout ça je rentre dans le top 20 du tour 2004 pas mal #affaireLA
24 Août 12 RépondreRetweeterFavori

Translation: with all this I'm into the top 20 of the 2004 Tour -- not bad.

Samuel DUMOULIN @SamuelDumoulin Armstrong va perdre ses sept titres du Tour de France.Qu'est ce que cela change?Casser le cyclisme,encore.Nos palmarès,rien:trop tard!

Translation: Armstrong will lose his 7 TdF titles. What does that change? Destroying cycling, again. Our palmares, nothing: it's too late!

24 Août 12 RépondreRetweeterFavori

Jimmy Engoulvent @JimmyEngoulvent Le constat , c'est que les contrôles anti-dopage sont inefficaces . #Armstrong #lechangementcestmaintenant

Translation: This shows that anti-doping controls are ineffective.

Also, there is an article ( http://www.lequipe.fr/Cyclisme-sur-route/Actualites/Jalabert-un-peu-partage/308092) with reactions from Jalabert, Hinault and Bernard Thevenet. Jaja talks around the subject, stressing how bad it all is for cycling. He goes as far as to say that one can be angry at Armstrong for that, but overall he is pro-Lance, stating that he was good for cycling, boosted cycling outside Europe. Basically, as another doper from the same era, not too much of a surprise.

Hinault just says that he couldn't give a sh**, it should all have been sorted out 10-12 years ago.

Thevenet also starts with the "bad for cycling" note, but goes on to say that if he was guilty it is good that he is being sanctioned, as this sends a strong message to current cyclists (though he qualifies that by "if the UCI follows USADA").

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

Hinault just says that he couldn't give a sh**, it should all have been sorted out 10-12 years ago.

That made me smile. I can well believe it as well.

 

[Cavalier]

Sunderland just tweeted that he stands by his witch-hunt comment. Omerta lives on.