Christian said:
Interesting story, red - both on your upbringing and your later experiences with religion. I am curious - as a child, did you ever ask your dad whether there was a god? If so, what did he answer? Also, did you go to Sunday school or religious classes?
Interesting questions, thanks.
Not sure when the specifics of his beliefs came out–I suppose at some point I asked my mom why he rarely if ever came to church. Not sure how old I was. I was probably 15 or so before having any real discussion with him about it. He does not believe in God, but coming from a religious family, he loved and respected many religious people.
I did go to religious classes after school, though it was on Mondays.
If I should ever be a father, those would be the things that it would be hard for me to compromise on. If my child asked me my honest opinion on whether or not there is a god, I could in good conscience only say one thing: no. I also would have to vividly oppose anyone who request that my child should go to religious classes. Cause that's what is usually meant by "being exposed" to religion. And then when you oppose that child indoctrination, you are "close minded". Classic reverse religious bullying.
Are you married? Something would have to give if you were married to a religious person who also wanted to share their values and experiences with your kids. My kids haven't asked me that question, they were raised Lutheran early (not teens yet) but we've stopped attending church. My wife is a believer, but not committed to going to church every Sunday. She like to say a prayer before any meal we have together, which bugs me. We talked about it, and it's easy enough for me to have her keep it short and sit quietly while she leads it. My kids with learn about all the other religious ideas or atheistic ideas in due course. I took a few eastern religious courses in college, and I think understanding religions of the world should be part of any educated person's experience. Without a reasonably broad-based understanding of the major moral and philosophical traditions of the world, how can one be educated?
I think if you expose your kids to religious classes that's a good thing. Just also expose them to other ideas as well. More difficult, more potentially confusing, but do you trust that they can sort it out? We should not fear ideas–the good ones will stand up to the test of examination, and the bad ones will fall by the wayside. To me this is the core of free thinking and the core of what we called the enlightenment. Liberalism is, in my view, a philosophy which should embrace the examination of all ideas.
I am even opposed to my child being baptized. People say well, "wait until they're old enough and they can make their own decision". But that means having to opt out, since everyone is baptized as an infant (at least in my country). Very few people actually go through the trouble of doing that, even though a large percentage of adults have little to no connection to religion whatsoever. Yet the catholic church can still say, "we represent 95% of the country".
I understand the objection philosophically, but really what's the harm? Is that a battle you really want to fight if you disagree with your wife or partner in the future? Up to you.
I read a book called The Case for God some years ago, and one of the points the author made (former Nun) was that one really needs to experience and practice religion to understand it and decide if it's right for you. You can't really just look at it on the outside and reject it, but if you put yourself into it and do the daily practice, you can truly decide if it's right for you. It really stuck with me. I tried for years, but could never get over the hump of faith in that which seemed to me to make little logical sense (Christian theology).
I witnessed an interesting discussion once between a person who was a baptist, and a lutheran pastor. Baptists apparently only get baptized at an adult age (hence the name, I assume). This person asked the lutheran pastor why this was not the case in lutheranism, and the pastor answered "because we believe that you don't choose god, god chooses you". So much for "wait until they're old enough and let them make their own decision".
Yes, that's...sort of...true. Lutherans believe that God accepts you simply on Grace, and whether you have the ceremony done or not has nothing to do with "getting into heaven". So it really doesn't have anything to do with making one's own decision or not. You're in if you believe you're in, and if you don't believe in it...well...no sweat. So I think your understanding of the Lutheran philosophy was a bit off. Easy enough to read up on. Lutherans are in general pretty logical, open and educated in my experience. A very tolerable version of Christian theology for the rationalist, all things considered.