Riccò hospitalized for possible kidney ailment

[Finbouy]

I was quite disturbed by this event in his history. I've always had some form of a soft spot for him, but it seems he's yet to balance his life up. I'll miss him riding this year, was really looking forward to seeing him out there again. I do hope he gets well, I do hope that he can get back on his bike too and I do hope that he's able to live a normal life.
Best of luck to him I say.

 

[Escarabajo]

While I realize you'll simply view this as a "crass" comment, the reality is that cycling IS real life, that's why he's in the predicament he's in.

I feel badly for him. I feel a lot worse for those fighting illnesses which were not of their own doing. Let's not lose sight of the fact that he made a conscious choice, and now he's facing some severe consequences.

Maybe some others can learn from this whole thing.

Hi 131313, I agree with a lot of things of what you write, but I have a disagreement on the bolded wording. I don't think Ricco knew exactly what he was doing or its consequences.

Is the same as teenagers or young adults when the drink or do any other stupid stuff. They don't even stop to think that they can die from their actions.

That is an age when they need love and comprehension IMHO.

 

[joe_papp]

I was quite disturbed by this event in his history. I've always had some form of a soft spot for him, but it seems he's yet to balance his life up. I'll miss him riding this year, was really looking forward to seeing him out there again. I do hope he gets well, I do hope that he can get back on his bike too and I do hope that he's able to live a normal life.
Best of luck to him I say.

Just wondering if anyone has documented an retractions by current riders or staff who said horrible things immediately after the announcement of Riccò's hospitalization, or the expression of human commentary since by those in the public eye (the wider public eye)?

It makes me feel uncomfortable that seemingly no one in the active ranks of the sport at the pro level could muzzle themselves long enough to recognize the potential seriousness of the Riccò situation and how it is both different than past cases of doping and transcends the realm of typically narcissistic behavior fueling doping and enters the space where someone can blindly risk their life and almost end it with practices that even the most amoral doper would find shocking. Riccò must have some serious personality disorder or intellectual blunting to risk transfusing blood that he allegedly stored in his fridge for nearly four weeks. Either that or there was a truly criminal element involved in managing the logistics of this for him, though that seems less likely than his just being totally unrealistic in what he should/could/would do. It seems highly likely that the guy has issues well beyond being a fame-addict or narcissist and he is lucky that he didn't die (though it's annoying to see someone with such natural talent waste it so stupidly).

 

[BotanyBay]

Just wondering if anyone has documented an retractions by current riders or staff who said horrible things immediately after the announcement of Riccò's hospitalization, or the expression of human commentary since by those in the public eye (the wider public eye)?

It makes me feel uncomfortable that seemingly no one in the active ranks of the sport at the pro level could muzzle themselves long enough to recognize the potential seriousness of the Riccò situation and how it is both different than past cases of doping and transcends the realm of typically narcissistic behavior fueling doping and enters the space where someone can blindly risk their life and almost end it with practices that even the most amoral doper would find shocking. Riccò must have some serious personality disorder or intellectual blunting to risk transfusing blood that he allegedly stored in his fridge for nearly four weeks. Either that or there was a truly criminal element involved in managing the logistics of this for him, though that seems less likely than his just being totally unrealistic in what he should/could/would do. It seems highly likely that the guy has issues well beyond being a fame-addict or narcissist and he is lucky that he didn't die (though it's annoying to see someone with such natural talent waste it so stupidly).

If McQuaid blows the right dog-whistle, the retractions will come. But my guess is that Pat blew a different whistle, prompting the reaction we witnessed.

 

[BotanyBay]

Hi 131313, I agree with a lot of things of what you write, but I have a disagreement on the bolded wording. I don't think Ricco knew exactly what he was doing or its consequences.

You need to understand addiction better.

He knew what he was doing. He even knew the potential consequences.

But he's so sick, it just didn't matter. The compulsion is far stronger than the sane, rational thinking that the non-afflicted are fortunate to possess.

 

[MarkvW]

Is this the last of Ricco?

The pro peloton doesn't owe Ricco anything. He is a cheat who brought disgrace to himself and his profession. His getting caught harms sponsorships and the financial interests of the other riders. They are understandably angry.

If Ricco hadn't screwed up his doping methodology, he would have been a doped contender. Anyone would be angry at him in that context, so why show him any love when his cheating methods failed him?

I hope he gets well soon so he can start spouting off inane statements that provide me with entertainment. I am indifferent to whatever brain chemistry impelled him to cheat. Maybe he can find love in the fraternity of other dope cheats who found truth after they got caught.

 

[Spank226]

I can't believe how everyone is jumping all over Roll for his "morgue" comment. OK, wait a minute, maybe I can considering the personalities in this forum and the penchant for removing all context clues to prove one's own agenda.

It's pretty damned obvious he was making reference to his career as a separate entity apart from the individual, and that it was his (Ricco's) CAREER that was just killed and able to be found in a morgue because of Ricco's senseless act of being a repeat doping offender. There was absolutely no mention of "critical condition", "ICU", or any similar indication of the grievous nature of Ricco's condition prior to his Roll's morgue comment.

Roll's humorous comment was not at all insensitive given the timing and context of it and is still relevant, but it does have a bit of a haunting echo given that Ricco's health condition has since been reported as pretty serious.

 

[Barrus]

I can't believe how everyone is jumping all over Roll for his "morgue" comment. OK, wait a minute, maybe I can considering the personalities in this forum and the penchant for removing all context clues to prove one's own agenda.

It's pretty damned obvious he was making reference to his career as a separate entity apart from the individual, and that it was his (Ricco's) CAREER that was just killed and able to be found in a morgue because of Ricco's senseless act of being a repeat doping offender. There was absolutely no mention of "critical condition", "ICU", or any similar indication of the grievous nature of Ricco's condition prior to his Roll's morgue comment.

Roll's humorous comment was not at all insensitive given the timing and context of it and is still relevant, but it does have a bit of a haunting echo given that Ricco's health condition has since been reported as pretty serious.

It still is quite disrespectful and at the very least very ill-timed and stupid to make such a comment when a person is in the hospital

 

[Granville57]

I can't believe how everyone is jumping all over Roll for his "morgue" comment.

Roll's humorous comment was not at all insensitive given the timing and context of it and is still relevant, but it does have a bit of a haunting echo given that Ricco's health condition has since been reported as pretty serious.

Really? It wasn't "serious" at the time of the initial announcement? What planet are you on?
No one is suggesting that Roll's comments were meant to be taken literally. It was the inappropriateness of them due to the fact that Ricco may very well have ended up in the "morgue" at the time of that "tweet."

It was exactly due to "the timing and context" that made his remarks so appalling. Humorous? Not so much.

And by all means, please share with us the context that was "removed."

 

[Benotti69]

Did a young Armstrong prior to 1998 not have a similar character to Ricco?

I wonder would the tweets of the news of his cancer have been the same???

I wonder would guys like cav et al have said such things back then had they been around

 

[biopass]

The pro peloton doesn't owe Ricco anything. He is a cheat who brought disgrace to himself and his profession. His getting caught harms sponsorships and the financial interests of the other riders. They are understandably angry.

Hypocrites.

 

[Anonymous]

Susan,

any update on how he's doing?

 

[rhubroma]

Just wondering if anyone has documented an retractions by current riders or staff who said horrible things immediately after the announcement of Riccò's hospitalization, or the expression of human commentary since by those in the public eye (the wider public eye)?

It makes me feel uncomfortable that seemingly no one in the active ranks of the sport at the pro level could muzzle themselves long enough to recognize the potential seriousness of the Riccò situation and how it is both different than past cases of doping and transcends the realm of typically narcissistic behavior fueling doping and enters the space where someone can blindly risk their life and almost end it with practices that even the most amoral doper would find shocking. Riccò must have some serious personality disorder or intellectual blunting to risk transfusing blood that he allegedly stored in his fridge for nearly four weeks. Either that or there was a truly criminal element involved in managing the logistics of this for him, though that seems less likely than his just being totally unrealistic in what he should/could/would do. It seems highly likely that the guy has issues well beyond being a fame-addict or narcissist and he is lucky that he didn't die (though it's annoying to see someone with such natural talent waste it so stupidly).

The thing is we don't know everything about this case. It seems most unlikely that Ricco' would have acted so recklessly without any medical support, also because such blood doping practice can hardly have been new to him. This would seem to be the type of mistake that only some foolish dilettante would make, not a cyclist who was at the tops of the profession a couple of years ago.

I also don't think he was "wasting" his undeniable raw talent, if we are to assume that blood doping with transfusions is a common praxis of the professional cyclist. In that case, then, he was simply "preparing" himself within the established methodology and not wasting anything because doing what's expected.

No, this stinks of a "common" procedure gone wrong. The "stored in the fridge" story, well, if true, was likely under medical advice, or else if invented then to cover-up someone, keeping in mind that Ricco' probably never imagined that the doctor would have gone public with his story. I wouldn't be at all surprised if the latter were the case.

If anything, however, this case should make the other riders seriously consider what a monstrous world they in part have created (along with the team management and medics who have also contributed), which should allow them at least the decency to show a bit of pity for a colleague that has nearly paid with his life as a consequence. Otherwise we should believe that the Italian is just one "rotten apple" whose selfish act has tarnished the rest of the bunch.

I don't believe that. This makes some of those comments more vile and cruel and speaks terribly of the moral character of many world class cyclists who only think of their careers.

 

[Finbouy]

I have no idea how on earth you perform a transfusion, would you simply grab a bag of blood, slam a needle in your arm and squeeze?? I mean if this is the case then surely it's quite simple to do yourself, if not, then hey wouldn't you want someone around to help you out?? Just thinking out loud.

But the thing with me on Ricco is quite simple. I'm not too sure why you would jepordize your career on the second attempt or second go at it when your training seems to be going well, most of the public support you and encourage then you go and take steps that could hinder, and obviously have hindered, your return to a profession you love..

Just seems kinda odd to me.

Still, I do have a soft spot for the lad and hope he gets better soon.

 

[rhubroma]

I have no idea how on earth you perform a transfusion, would you simply grab a bag of blood, slam a needle in your arm and squeeze?? I mean if this is the case then surely it's quite simple to do yourself, if not, then hey wouldn't you want someone around to help you out?? Just thinking out loud.

But the thing with me on Ricco is quite simple. I'm not too sure why you would jepordize your career on the second attempt or second go at it when your training seems to be going well, most of the public support you and encourage then you go and take steps that could hinder, and obviously have hindered, your return to a profession you love..

Just seems kinda odd to me.

Still, I do have a soft spot for the lad and hope he gets better soon.

Because he needed a result. And this is the way you get them, simple.

We know he had in mind winning on Mt. Faron, the hardest early season climb. We know he also went through an intensive block of training leading up to the Mediterranean Tour, which would have left his body worn down and so doing a transfusion would have given him the recovery necessary for victory at the mountain top. This is commonly done leading into the third week of a grand tour among the protagonists. Anyone that doesnt believe this is simply kidding themselves.

Consequently, from Ricco's perspective, he wasn't "jeopardizing" anything but indeed "gaining insurance". But then it all went horrifically bad.

I understand that some feel that he took the risks and so we can't feel sorry for him, however, this is a practice that I think is much more common than those who feel this way are willing or desire to realize.

In this sense, the unlucky aspect, not the exceptional nature of it, is what sticks out.

 

[Cloxxki]

Because he needed a result. And this is the way you get them, simple.

We know he had in mind winning on Mt. Faron, the hardest early season climb. We know he also went through an intensive block of training leading up to the Mediterranean Tour, which would have left his body worn down and so doing a transfusion would have given him the recovery necessary for victory at the mountain top. This is commonly done leading into the third week of a grand tour among the protagonists. Anyone that doesnt believe this is simply kidding themselves.

Consequently, from Ricco's perspective, he wasn't "jeopardizing" anything but indeed "gaining insurance". But then it all went horrifically bad.

I understand that some feel that he took the risks and so we can't feel sorry for him, however, this is a practice that I think is much more common than those who feel this way are willing or desire to realize.

In this sense, the unlucky aspect, not the exceptional nature of it, is what sticks out.

Perhaps he decided to do it on his own, after having been professionally transfused several times, feeling confortable enough with the procedure?

In Operacion Galgo, leaked telephone conversations Spanish police intercepted, suggest that one female athlete (Herzog) went to train in Spain wanting to get on a blood doping program, but resorting to asking her trainer Pascua for EPO, due to "not knowing anyone" to get her a blood recycling job.

Or, are we seeing a new level of desperation among athletes, too afraid to get caught (again), not trusting anyone with the knowledge of their medical and moral status, and then just getting started with what's written in the newspapers as undetectable? Oh yes, I read here that you need to store the blood in a fridge (check), and then place back into the body after it's already replaced the mising blood cells (check). OK, here it goes!

 

[Finbouy]

Cheers for the background lads.

And now though I read the Vaco's License maybe revoked. We know Masq's impending investigation, but Ricco came in to the squad and brought with him the points that the team needed to gain ProT level qualification. Now it looks like they'll loose them, then go down a notch in ranking to ProC... because of Ricco..

Do you not think that these points went through his mind when he did what he did? You know a "well if this gets out will I bin not just me but the team too"
Dunno, just thinking out loud again..

 

[Benotti69]

Cheers for the background lads.

And now though I read the Vaco's License maybe revoked. We know Masq's impending investigation, but Ricco came in to the squad and brought with him the points that the team needed to gain ProT level qualification. Now it looks like they'll loose them, then go down a notch in ranking to ProC... because of Ricco..

Do you not think that these points went through his mind when he did what he did? You know a "well if this gets out will I bin not just me but the team too"
Dunno, just thinking out loud again..

do you think any of them think about their personal health when they mess with their bodies? i hope that these idiots have not done anything that has been passed on in their genes and their children suffer from certain health problems pertaining to mom and daddy doping.

 

[rhubroma]

Cheers for the background lads.

And now though I read the Vaco's License maybe revoked. We know Masq's impending investigation, but Ricco came in to the squad and brought with him the points that the team needed to gain ProT level qualification. Now it looks like they'll loose them, then go down a notch in ranking to ProC... because of Ricco..

Do you not think that these points went through his mind when he did what he did? You know a "well if this gets out will I bin not just me but the team too"
Dunno, just thinking out loud again..

Of course there's also the equally likely possibility that Vaco was complicit, precisely because they relied upon Ricco for the prestige to gain admittance into the ProT events.

The hypocrisy in this sport does not allow me to doubt it.

 

[biopass]

And now though I read the Vaco's License maybe revoked. We know Masq's impending investigation, but Ricco came in to the squad and brought with him the points that the team needed to gain ProT level qualification. Now it looks like they'll loose them, then go down a notch in ranking to ProC... because of Ricco..

Is there any evidence Ricco earned those points being doped?

 

[Beech Mtn]

Perhaps he decided to do it on his own, after having been professionally transfused several times, feeling confortable enough with the procedure?

<snipped>

I suspect Ricco had to do it on his own because of the raids during Operation Cobra Red. Folks who may have advised or assisted him in the past are likely having to limit contact with Ricco, and thus he had no other choice than DIY. And you're probably right - he probably thought he could do it after seeing it done so many times before.

 

[rhubroma]

I suspect Ricco had to do it on his own because of the raids during Operation Cobra Red. Folks who may have advised or assisted him in the past are likely having to limit contact with Ricco, and thus he had no other choice than DIY. And you're probably right - he probably thought he could do it after seeing it done so many times before.

Yet you would think that after having done it "so many times" (and no doubt this was the case) in the past, he'd have at least known that you don't keep blood behind the mustard in the fridge for 25 days!

This part, to me, just doesn't make sense.

 

[Escarabajo]

Yet you would think that after having done it "so many times" (and no doubt this was the case) in the past, he'd have at least known that you don't keep blood behind the mustard in the fridge for 25 days!

This part, to me, just doesn't make sense.

???? please explain.

 

[rhubroma]

???? please explain.

Well the reports said that he told the doctor he gave himself a transfusion of blood that he had kept in the fridge for 25 days.

Well you would have thought that one with his experience would have known that you just don't do that. Thus I have doubts that this is true. In other words, that he may have fabricated the thing to protect someone else with the belief that the story he furnished would have stayed between himself and his hospital doctor. Not that he didn't give himself or receive a blood transfusion, but that how he explained it to his doctor isn't what really took place.

I don't mean to repeat myself, but this just doesn't add up.

 

[Cloxxki]

But then, why would he allow himself to get so ill and be found by his wife that way, if he had "a guy" doing the medical part for him? I'd be calling at the first sign of it having gone wrong.