Riders to watch in 2012

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

Lars Boom: as if he's going to win classics next year. Has he even top tenned one by now? I rate him a lot lower than Greg van Avermaet.
Luis Leon Sanchez: was mediocre this whole year and has never proven much in the classics anyway. I know he won San Sebastian, but what has he done in the Ardennes or Lombardia?
Mark Renshaw: exactly what has he proven in sprints? Being the leadout guy is something else than sprinting. They also have no decent train or leadout guy for their sprinters.
Theo Bos: mediocre sprinter. Whoopie!
Michael Matthews: promising young kid, but come'on now...

Rabobank is not a bad team or anything, but I just don't see the depth in it Steven Kruiswyck and Bauke Mollema are also no Menchov(he had a "bad" year though)

Yeah, Rabobank is not a good team considering their annual budget.

Luis Leon was not a bad signing at the time, though. He was 4th in the World Tour last year. No one expected him to suck this bad.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Yeah, Rabobank is not a good team considering their annual budget.

Luis Leon was not a bad signing at the time, though. He was 4th in the World Tour last year. No one expected him to suck this bad.

luis leon was a bad signing at the time I know I said it a million times he is so overrated and he did indeed suck hard

 

[theyoungest]

Yeah, Rabobank is not a good team considering their annual budget.

They have 72 riders under contract, which makes them the "biggest" team in the world. They don't have any huge earners on their team. And their policy is to develop Dutch riders, only signing foreign ones in the fields where Dutch cyclists lack, or still have to grow.

They could also have gone the BMC way, signing the cream of the crop, but without any development whatsoever. You choose.

Rabobank is not a bad team or anything, but I just don't see the depth in it Steven Kruiswyck and Bauke Mollema are also no Menchov(he had a "bad" year though)

You may not see the depth, the results say otherwise: Rabobank are currently 5th on the CQ team ranking, without any riders in the top-20 individually.

 

[auscyclefan94]

They have 72 riders under contract, which makes them the "biggest" team in the world. They don't have any huge earners on their team. And their policy is to develop Dutch riders, only signing foreign ones in the fields where Dutch cyclists lack, or still have to grow.

They could also have gone the BMC way, signing the cream of the crop, but without any development whatsoever. You choose.

Keep blurting out your vitriol. Have you bothered to respond to any of my posts in rebuttal to your comments about BMC developing riders?

 

[theyoungest]

Keep blurting out your vitriol. Have you bothered to respond to any of my posts in rebuttal to your comments about BMC developing riders?

I'm sure I have. Not sure I remember them though.

The only rider who has really developed on BMC is Mathias Frank.

 

[El Pistolero]

They have 72 riders under contract, which makes them the "biggest" team in the world. They don't have any huge earners on their team. And their policy is to develop Dutch riders, only signing foreign ones in the fields where Dutch cyclists lack, or still have to grow.

They could also have gone the BMC way, signing the cream of the crop, but without any development whatsoever. You choose.


You may not see the depth, the results say otherwise: Rabobank are currently 5th on the CQ team ranking, without any riders in the top-20 individually.

CQ team ranking is a joke, just look where Vaconsoleil stands.

 

[theyoungest]

CQ team ranking is a joke, just look where Vaconsoleil stands.

Fair enough. Then take the calculation of the UCI team ranking if all riders would count, rather than only the best 5: Rabo would be 3d or 4th IIRC. And that's in WorldTour races.

 

[Panda Claws]

Rabobank's riders are individually far inferior to the new BMC.

Mollema vs Evans
Gesink vs Gilbert
etc...


But Rabobank is still a good team because they always have people in the top-10 in nearly every race. It is said that BMC has too many chiefs and too little indians which might be true, but Rabobank on the other hand has too many indians because even their chiefs are still indians for the most part.

Just look at this year's AGR where Rabo had 3 riders in the front group. These riders finished 6th, 9th and 10th. So Rabo may be low on victories but their amazing amount of top-10's makes up for that.

 

[El Pistolero]

Fair enough. Then take the calculation of the UCI team ranking if all riders would count, rather than only the best 5: Rabo would be 3d or 4th IIRC. And that's in WorldTour races.

I still don't see the depth.

Let's take a look at Rabo's program for next year

The Monuments: they have no one who can realistically win a Monument. They can always surprise us, but let's be realistic here.

The other classics: with a bit of luck on their side they could win a classic like Amstel Gold Race and the Clasica San Sebastian, but there are better teams out there for those classics. I can't see them challenge in any other classics.

The semi-classics: here they could win a few races like the Giro dell'Emilia(Mollema, Gesink), Kuurne-Brussel-Kuurne(Renshaw, Bos), Omloop het Nieuwsblad(Boom), but so can every other team in the World Tour.

The one week stage races: Gesink, if he returns to his old level, could actually win a prestigious one week race like Tirreno-Adriatico and Pais Vasco. I rate Cadel Evans chances a lot higher to win one of these one week races though. I even rate Gilbert's chances higher to win T-A than those of Gesink. Steven Kruiswyck has proven little in one week stage races. He won a stage in the Tour of Suisse on his Giro form, but was never in contention for the overall GC. I don't see Bauke Mollema challenging for victory in an important one week race either.

The Grand Tours:

Giro: they're sending Kruiwyck, Mollema AND Gesink to the Tour. Their squad will suck and we all know it.

Tour: they'll send Kruiswyck, Mollema and Gesink. They won't win the Tour and with the many time trial kms they will struggle to even reach the top 5.

Vuelta: all their good GC riders will have done the Tour, so same problem as the Giro I'm afraid.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

They have 72 riders under contract, which makes them the "biggest" team in the world. They don't have any huge earners on their team. And their policy is to develop Dutch riders, only signing foreign ones in the fields where Dutch cyclists lack, or still have to grow.

They could also have gone the BMC way, signing the cream of the crop, but without any development whatsoever. You choose.


You may not see the depth, the results say otherwise: Rabobank are currently 5th on the CQ team ranking, without any riders in the top-20 individually.

yeah I;m sure guys like niermann, martens, breschel, barredo, wijnants, garate, brown really add something to the team that can't be found in netherlands

 

[theyoungest]

I even rate Gilbert's chances higher to win T-A than those of Gesink.

I liked this one, seeing as Gesink got 2nd in the Tirreno this year, while he was even considering to leave the race because his head was elsewhere.

yeah I;m sure guys like niermann, martens, breschel, barredo, wijnants, garate, brown really add something to the team that can't be found in netherlands

Come on, can you actually think for one second before posting something? Niermann, Garate, Brown bring experience in their respective fields which can't be found in NL. Martens is an Ardennes rider, we don't have too many of those, Barredo a breakaway rider in the mountains, same story. Breschel can win cobbled classics.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

that's the point. gesink alays gets 2nd or less and gilbert only wins. whatever the reason is EVERY TIME he just doesn't win.

 

[El Pistolero]

I liked this one, seeing as Gesink got 2nd in the Tirreno this year, while he was even considering to leave the race because his head was elsewhere.

Gesink won't get an unfair head start this time because of the team time trial

Plus Gilbert has improved since then. At T-A he was unable to challenge for victory at the steep walls, but at the Mur de Huy he proved everyone otherwise. I look forward to seeing him at T-A next year. It all depends on the course though.

 

[El Pistolero]

I liked this one, seeing as Gesink got 2nd in the Tirreno this year, while he was even considering to leave the race because his head was elsewhere.


Come on, can you actually think for one second before posting something? Niermann, Garate, Brown bring experience in their respective fields which can't be found in NL. Martens is an Ardennes rider, we don't have too many of those, Barredo a breakaway rider in the mountains, same story. Breschel can win cobbled classics.

He's called Johnny Hoogerland.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

I liked this one, seeing as Gesink got 2nd in the Tirreno this year, while he was even considering to leave the race because his head was elsewhere.


Come on, can you actually think for one second before posting something? Niermann, Garate, Brown bring experience in their respective fields which can't be found in NL. Martens is an Ardennes rider, we don't have too many of those, Barredo a breakaway rider in the mountains, same story. Breschel can win cobbled classics.

lol. that's such a cliche. in fact there can be found dutch riders better in those fields. martens is an ardennes rider that I only see in msr somehow. and barredo is a mountain breakaway rider like hoogerland

and breschel can win cobbled classics?? how many has he won yet then? langeveld alone is better for sure.

 

[theyoungest]

that's the point. gesink alays gets 2nd or less and gilbert only wins. whatever the reason is EVERY TIME he just doesn't win.

Every time, except when he actually does win of course.

lol. that's such a cliche. in fact there can be found dutch riders better in those fields.

Name them. Name one Dutch rider who could do a better job at domestique-ing in a GT than Niermann and Garate.

martens is an ardennes rider that I only see in msr somehow.

? He didn't even race it this year.

and barredo is a mountain breakaway rider like hoogerland

Yes, we have one mountain breakaway specialist. One. Who won't ride for Rabobank anyway.

and breschel can win cobbled classics?? how many has he won yet then? langeveld alone is better for sure.

Langeveld is absolutely not a better rider than Breschel. No way. Breschel at his 2010 level will crush Langeveld (in fact he already did).

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Every time, except when he actually does win of course.

which is when?? he has won a stage in tour of california in 2008 and giro emillia and canadian race. for a teamleader of one of the biggest teams in the world that's pretty sad and it's not as if he's a great gc rider either., his best gc result was a 6th place in the tour de france

 

[El Pistolero]

Bauke Mollema and Steven Kruiswyck look like good replacement for Garate to me. Garate is nothing special to be honest. Paul Martens ain't that good at the Ardennes classics either.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Ten Dam was an awesome domestique for Menchov in 2009.

 

[theyoungest]

Bauke Mollema and Steven Kruiswyck look like good replacement for Garate to me. Garate is nothing special to be honest. Paul Martens ain't that good at the Ardennes classics either.

They don't see Mollema and Kruijswijk as domestiques.

Ten Dam was an awesome domestique for Menchov in 2009.

Yeah, but he's already on the team. You can't have just one.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

They don't see Mollema and Kruijswijk as domestiques.

ten dam and slagter are

 

[theyoungest]

which is when?? he has won a stage in tour of california in 2008 and giro emillia and canadian race. for a teamleader of one of the biggest teams in the world that's pretty sad and it's not as if he's a great gc rider either., his best gc result was a 6th place in the tour de france

He wasn't their team leader in the past years, as you may recall. Okay, on the road he might have turned out to be, because he already was that good at such a young age.

 

[El Pistolero]

They don't see Mollema and Kruijswijk as domestiques.


Yeah, but he's already on the team. You can't have just one.

So their Tour team will have 4 leaders + a breakaway dude who wants to do his own thing?

Bauke Mollema
Steven Kruiswyck
Robert Gesink
Mark Renshaw
Luis Leon Sanchez

And BMC has too many chiefs?

 

[theyoungest]

So their Tour team will have 4 leaders + a breakaway dude who wants to do his own thing?

Bauke Mollema
Steven Kruiswyck
Robert Gesink
Mark Renshaw
Luis Leon Sanchez

And BMC has too many chiefs?

Yeah, I don't understand it either, but this is the plan.

 

[El Pistolero]

Yeah, I don't understand it either, but this is the plan.

I could actually agree they have depth if they spread out their GC guys some more, but next year I really don't see it.