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I've been hesitant to needle Horner because I think there might be legitimate speech issues there, but 'Joe Allen Almeida' on yesterdays podcast really got me.
Hatch's attempts, clumsy or otherwise really aren't a problem, the real linguistic faux-pas is the English manager goes abroad and speaks broken English on purpose to try and sound regional theme.
Nathan Van Hooydonck. He called him Van Honeydunk after G-W, so he's actually getting worse.
Unrecognisable, I fear.
Yeah, Steve McClaren is definitely a bad example, but he did at least have enough success for him to be able to return to Twente later on.
You should give up two pages ago and speak within yourself with this complain about someone making effort
I like him trying to make an effort with pronouncing names of riders, cities places etc. He is very hit and miss with german names tbh.
What annoys me about him was how biased he was at the Giro last year towards Ineos and Tao. He couldn't stop talking about them and Tao especially. Made me even root a bit against Tao, who I really like as a person.
Hopefully a bit less of that at the Giro this year with Ineos and the brits like Carthy.
What annoys me about him was how biased he was at the Giro last year towards Ineos and Tao. He couldn't stop talking about them and Tao especially. Made me even root a bit against Tao, who I really like as a person.
Hopefully a bit less of that at the Giro this year with Ineos and the brits like Carthy.
He should definitely try to say the names the correct way and fair play to him because I notice a lot of English and US people are very rude when it comes to demanding everyone speaks their way even to go as far as to correct people who are saying it properly.
He does get it wrong sometimes though or try too hard. He pronounces Roche as Rosh instead of Roach as in cockroach
He does get it wrong sometimes though or try too hard. He pronounces Roche as Rosh instead of Roach as in cockroach
When Nathan wins a stage. "Van HoneyDink just Honeydunked all over their Honeybook a**es.
He does get German names surprisingly wrong sometimes, considering he seems to have an alright grasp of Dutch/Flanders (but that might just be because I speak German a lot better than Dutch/Flanders, meaning I don't spot the mistakes as easily/at all).
I was watching British Eurosport for the Giro and was actually pleasantly surprised they said Ronde van Vlaanderen instead of Tour of Flanders. I really like that about this sport that fans more often than not say the names of races in the original language. It is a Nice bit of respect being shown imo.
I understand that the French pronounciation of -bourg is a difficult one for English speakers but come on. I shiver at the idea of someone saying Strasborg.
Just think of the Strasboar instead of the Strasborg and you'll be much closer.
I understand that the French pronounciation of -bourg is a difficult one for English speakers but come on. I shiver at the idea of someone saying Strasborg.
Just think of the Strasboar instead of the Strasborg and you'll be much closer.
I didn't realize Ronde van Vlaanderen and Tour of Flanders was the same race for a couple months reading this forum. Then I thought everything that had the word "tour" in it was a stage race and one day races were like Paris-Roubaix.
I laughed at Horner talking about Tom Piddock as if he didn’t want to say a semi-rude word on The Butterfly Effect.
Knucklehead.
Knucklehead.
Yeah I can imagine that is confusing when you don't grow up up with cycling. Wonder if that is why it became Il Lombardia
I thought Paris-Nice was one day race. Let's just say my grasp of French geography wasn't the best.
It would have to be a two days race like Paris-Brest-Paris.
Since it's l'Alsace I actually never know whether to pronounce it French or German - I feel pretentious saying it in French, coarse in German.
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Embarrassing OP, probably a tory brexiteer: this country, in the words of Rob Hatch, dear oh dear oh dear.
Pronounciation of places can certainly be tricky.Since it's l'Alsace I actually never know whether to pronounce it French or German - I feel pretentious saying it in French, coarse in German.
To be honest I am already glad that we can all write things in the original language instead of talking about the Tour of Italy.
I was mildly disappointed when they changed the graphics for Itzulia to English a few years back.
Never heard about the name Rob Hatch. But speaking, I dropped the British version of Eurosport commentary in late 90ies. I felt sorry for them apparently all having chronical stomach pains to a great extent when they had to pronounce especially French names. Hinault - 'Hi-naaaoooouuuuh', Fignon - 'Fiiiiiijnuun", Clavayrolat - 'Clawaaayrolaiiiii'. I.e. especially names with mute 'abrubt' endings. Which ofcourse isn't natural in the English language.
Poor stomaches, I hope they're OK today
I have always been in favor of commentators feeling an extra responsibility for the formation of their viewers and listeners, thereby making a great virtue out of proper local pronunciation of names. I mean, some of them even get paid for it and go over their heads for it. Maybe even a bike to get to work on. The pros do it (most, especially those from the small countries), and quickly learn 5-6-7 different languages fluently in the peleton
I think that more people here on the forum have the same experience - grewing up as a 'sports fanatic' and from childhood have noticed names of different nationalities in text form (live printing, results lists, etc), heard interviews and dialects and on trips around Europe as a teenager and young person made a virtue out of being a "guest" where one is on the "outfield" and trying to learn local vocabulary. In short - formation.
If the person mentioned makes an effort without knowing the correct pronunciation, then it can quickly become too much an effort to listen to.
So in short - I prefer commentators putting a REAL effort in researcing the right pronouncement of each rider. So stimulating when they hit it 90-100%.
Poor stomaches, I hope they're OK today
I have always been in favor of commentators feeling an extra responsibility for the formation of their viewers and listeners, thereby making a great virtue out of proper local pronunciation of names. I mean, some of them even get paid for it and go over their heads for it. Maybe even a bike to get to work on. The pros do it (most, especially those from the small countries), and quickly learn 5-6-7 different languages fluently in the peleton
I think that more people here on the forum have the same experience - grewing up as a 'sports fanatic' and from childhood have noticed names of different nationalities in text form (live printing, results lists, etc), heard interviews and dialects and on trips around Europe as a teenager and young person made a virtue out of being a "guest" where one is on the "outfield" and trying to learn local vocabulary. In short - formation.
If the person mentioned makes an effort without knowing the correct pronunciation, then it can quickly become too much an effort to listen to.
So in short - I prefer commentators putting a REAL effort in researcing the right pronouncement of each rider. So stimulating when they hit it 90-100%.
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Armchair cyclist
Moderator
But what is the correct way of pronouncing a name? Someone has cited the example of Voigt ( a name that has an accepted English language pronounciation by virtue of the actor John, although Jens would pronounce it differently in Germany, how does he say it when working for an American broadcaster.) and his pronounciation of Carthy as Carty. But while Hugh is Lancastrian, his surname is Irish, and in many parts of Ireland would be pronounced 'Carty'.
The purpose of a commentator is to identify and inform; if he is using a pronunciation that is not recognisable he isn't doing his job. That doesn't mean there is any excuse for, eg, Valverde rhyming with curd, or Hinault rendered as Heenawlt. But my brother will give Hinault's name with a Breton delivery (he lived there for a couple of years) that makes it unidentifiable: it is sufficient to make him sound like he could be Brian Eno's brother.
There is a balance to be struck between sounding ignorant, and sounding as though you are doing a poor impersonation of an accent that is not yours. Hatch gets too close to the latter too often.
The purpose of a commentator is to identify and inform; if he is using a pronunciation that is not recognisable he isn't doing his job. That doesn't mean there is any excuse for, eg, Valverde rhyming with curd, or Hinault rendered as Heenawlt. But my brother will give Hinault's name with a Breton delivery (he lived there for a couple of years) that makes it unidentifiable: it is sufficient to make him sound like he could be Brian Eno's brother.
There is a balance to be struck between sounding ignorant, and sounding as though you are doing a poor impersonation of an accent that is not yours. Hatch gets too close to the latter too often.
I hate it when they don't write "kop van de wedstrijd" in a Belgian race
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