Sky/Froome Talk Only (No Way Sky Are Cleans?)

[DirtyWorks]

What I was trying to point out is that some here act like Froome is an untalented rider, totally unworthy of riding as well as he's doing atm. Consistency perhaps shows that he is indeed talented, however it doesn't necessarily indicate total cleanliness.

I see what you did there. You simultaneously defend Froome's GT potential, then leave the question of doping unanswered.

In Grand Tour cycling for sure, an elite athlete's potential and doping fit together like a hand in a glove.

 

[Froome19]

No. It was a recreation of a sketch Brailsfraud made. It is hard to believe that the reporter misplaced the worst rider on the team on the graph. One of the middle riders who were clumped together, sure, but not the very worst rider.

I don't think it is a stretch to consider that the reporter never really registered a rider like Froome and then after checking up and finding him on Team Sky's website decided to put him pretty low, because he must have been pretty poor if he had never been heard of before.

 

[Schwartzchov]

He is untalented.

Are you implying that Froome lacks a capacity for achievement or success ?

To answer that. No he is not untalented.

 

[del1962]

That wasn't you making the steak comment about Contador in the romandie thread?

Yeah making a light hearted joke about Bertie's steak eating is the same as trollling the GF of a rider on twitter.

Thats why we bow to your perceptive intellect.

 

[the sceptic]

No. It was a recreation of a sketch Brailsfraud made. It is hard to believe that the reporter misplaced the worst rider on the team on the graph. One of the middle riders who were clumped together, sure, but not the very worst rider.

Even if the graph didnt come directly from Brentford, it was still accurate at the time.

 

[Pentacycle]

No. It was a recreation of a sketch Brailsfraud made. It is hard to believe that the reporter misplaced the worst rider on the team on the graph. One of the middle riders who were clumped together, sure, but not the very worst rider.

As you see, it wasn't a interpretation from DB's graph(as if he'd show that), but from his way of judging rider's potential. Those journo's(or whatever they were) probably thought all Sky accounted for were 2010 results. While in reality such an interpretation can't be made by an outsider, unless you're not minding some errors.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Damn.. Froome is looking thin huh..

Sky's coaches have taught him how to TT like they taught Wiggo to podium Grand Tours.

Because, you know, throughout the history of pro cycling there have been skinny guys TTing like Cancellara.

 

[DirtyWorks]

As you see, it wasn't a interpretation from DB's graph(as if he'd show that), but from his way of judging rider's potential. Those journo's(or whatever they were) probably thought all Sky accounted for were 2010 results. While in reality such an interpretation can't be made by an outsider, unless you're not minding some errors.

So, the Journo misplaces Froome Dog from top to bottom? How is it you are so confident Froome was so highly ranked inside Sky at the time?

This is all beginning to make perfect sense.

 

[BYOP88]

As you see, it wasn't a interpretation from DB's graph(as if he'd show that), but from his way of judging rider's potential. Those journo's(or whatever they were) probably thought all Sky accounted for were 2010 results. While in reality such an interpretation can't be made by an outsider, unless you're not minding some errors.

Someone in the Sky press dept. would have seen the graph and no doubt passed it on the Dave. I'm sure if he had any complaints with it he could've got them in a later issue to say 'we got the graph regarding Sky wrong'.

 

[Cyivel]

Yeah making a light hearted joke about Bertie's steak eating is the same as trollling the GF of a rider on twitter.

Thats why we bow to your perceptive intellect.

How is making a comment about Froome that didn't even @ his GF, trolling her?

 

[del1962]

How is making a comment about Froome that didn't even @ his GF, trolling her?

Well Froomes GF had to block the troll, by the trolls own admission.

 

[Pentacycle]

So, the Journo misplaces Froome Dog from top to bottom? How is it you are so confident Froome was so highly ranked inside Sky at the time?

This is all beginning to make perfect sense.

Not that he's supposed to be highly ranked, but I'm sure it wasn't the only way Sky used to measure talent. They knew Froome was hitting TdF winner levels in FTP tests, and he still had lots of progression left. Based on his results in 2010 he fits right in place on the graph, but in terms of real talent he'd be way higher.

Someone in the Sky press dept. would have seen the graph and no doubt passed it on the Dave. I'm sure if he had any complaints with it he could've got them in a later issue to say 'we got the graph regarding Sky wrong'.

Why did people on the outside have to know about Froome's talent? They were very anticipant of him for the 2011 Vuelta, they were expecting him to at least be his key domestique, or to be one of the best riders in the race. Their fault was however to overestimate Wiggins, that's why they were sacrificing on mountain stages.

 

[xcleigh]

Why not? He is already doing 6.0w/kg

Please do show your workings (otherwise that's just a wild guess).....or do you have access to his power meter data. Thanks.

 

[thehog]

I don't think it is a stretch to consider that the reporter never really registered a rider like Froome and then after checking up and finding him on Team Sky's website decided to put him pretty low, because he must have been pretty poor if he had never been heard of before.

No it's a stretch to think a guy who can't ride straight one year can win the Tour the next.

It's a stretch such an awkward looking rider can win a short prologue.

It's a stretch than nobody even his own team would think this guy would even make the team let alone win a GT.

There's so much stretching going on that Froome s nothing but a really tall, skinny fraud.

 

[BroDeal]

Sky's coaches have taught him how to TT like they taught Wiggo to podium Grand Tours.

Because, you know, throughout the history of pro cycling there have been skinny guys TTing like Cancellara.

Yup. We have not seen a transformation like Froome's since the first fish crawled out of the ocean and decided life was better on the beach.

 

[Cyivel]

Well Froomes GF had to block the troll, by the trolls own admission.

I don't agree with your interpretation of that however this is wildly off topic, so feel free to have the last word del I'm done on this one.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Well, at first, I was very suspicious of Sky, especially back in 2011 when they still had Leinders, and Froome suddenly broke through.(not to the level of twittering about hating Froome though, if I had twitter) However, both Wiggo and Froome have been so consistent over the last seasons, that their suspicion has lowered somewhat. I'm therefore just arguing that there could be some plausible explanation for Froome's rise, or rather to the delay in his rise. Wiggo's a bit of a mystery for me though.

But I usually don't make sense as well, so it makes no difference really.

Froome has only been consistent after making one of the biggest shock jumps in form in the history of the sport though. Bernhard Kohl had podiumed the Dauphiné; Mosquera had top 10ed every non-WT stage race in Spain and the Volta a Portugal; even Santí Pérez had more results to speak of befor his great Vuelta than Froome did. The nearest thing we have to somebody coming from nowhere (as a GT contender) the same way as Froome did is Bradley Wiggins, which doesn't help the argument.

It is true that Froome has been very consistent since that breakthrough. He was consistently brilliant for a month, then garbage for all of 2012 until June. Since then he's been on it constantly, except at the Vuelta where he was tired. I assume he's due for a rest soon since he's been at top form (well, unbeatable form. Whether he has another couple of gears to use if he needs is another matter, given how fresh he was at the finish today) since February, although Wiggins of course showed that at Sky, the secret of unstoppable peaking can be broken.

Besides, Froome was most assuredly NOT making slow progress before his Vuelta transformation. His CQ scores, year on year, were going downwards, and his contract for the following year hadn't been sorted out. If that's not a red flag I don't know what is. If Steve Houanard suddenly started destroying the late season one-day races last season and won Paris-Bruxelles, Paris-Tours and the Tour de Vendée and podiumed Lombardia like he's 2005 Murilo Fischer or something, would you have thought, "well, you know, he has been top 10 in the Driedaagse van West-Vlaanderen and he did podium the Tour d'Alsace a few years ago, so it's totally logical that he would be this good"? But no, not only did Houanard not get to have his day in the sun, but he got busted for EPO as he tried to get the results to keep himself in the World Tour. Bad luck Steve, have another go in a couple of years.

Also, consistency is not a good thing to use as a guide, because form is transient. Form is like a bell curve. People who are good at all times are at one end of it (as freakishly uncommon), while people who superpeak are at the other. Froome used to be in the superpeak area, now he's swinging over to the other side at pace.

Oh, and as to consistency? Say hello to the most consistent elite cyclist of the last decade:

2003 first podium: February 2, Trofeo Mallorca
2003 last podium: October 12, World Championships RR
Months with a podium: February, March, April, July, September, October

2004 first podium: February 3, Trofeo Cala Millor
2004 last podium: September 19, stage 15, Vuelta a España
Months with a podium: February, March, April, May, June, August, September

2005 first podium: February 8, Trofeo Manacor
2005 last podium: September 25, World Championships RR
Months with a podium: February, March, April, July, September

2006 first podium: March 2, stage 2, Vuelta a Murcía
2006 last podium: September 24, World Championships RR
Months with a podium: March, April, June, August, September

I mean, I could go on.

 

[xcleigh]

He forgot to shave his arms!!

Marginal gains right there!

Actually from a strictly aerodynamic point of view that arm hair may well help cause a boundary layer of air over the arms improving airflow around the body...marginal gains indeed

 

[the sceptic]

Sky's coaches have taught him how to TT like they taught Wiggo to podium Grand Tours.

Because, you know, throughout the history of pro cycling there have been skinny guys TTing like Cancellara.

If you work on your cadence then you can become a good ITTer even if you only weigh 50kg. Just look at Pantani, Heras, Contador etc. That could also have been the power of the yellow jersey of course, not sure.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Well Froomes GF had to block the troll, by the trolls own admission.

Please Del, you can do better, not as good as Libertine, of course, hammer/nail again, but this is somewhat lame, to say the least.

On topic:
how can anyone be surprised by todays result of Froome? Sure it is somehow ridiculous, but hey, lets take pentacycles term: 'he is consistent'.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Well Froomes GF had to block the troll, by the trolls own admission.

About 8 months ago, yes. When she tweeted that Universal vuelta tv ad. I told her it wasn't a nice thing to do. She didn't appreciate the criticism.

 

[martinvickers]

You know, sometimes I just gotta love this place...

The Clinic. Quality entertainment.

 

[yespatterns]

On topic:
how can anyone be surprised by todays result of Froome? Sure it is somehow ridiculous, but hey, lets take pentacycles term: 'he is consistent'.

If he could fit in a bmx bike basket, im pretty sure he'd want a consistent feed of reese's pieces. So suspect it almost hurts.

 

[airstream]

Many many reasonings here underlinedly imply so to speak Froome (Wiggins) are less talented and capable than Contador, Evans or someone and only more sophisticated pharmacological nutrition helps them get the result. All these thoughts are absolutely unprovable and strictly speaking all you can present like an argument IS 'imo this this and this rider are obv more talented than Froome and Wiggins. They are stronger than Sky boys ceteris paribus'. Though, the concept of talent is overly subtle substance which is impossibly to compare and evaluate.

As for doping Hamilton clearly explained me what happens even to an elite GT rider if he starts clean the flat stage in the Tour, so I don't look into this question.

 

[goggalor]

What I was trying to point out is that some here act like Froome is an untalented rider, totally unworthy of riding as well as he's doing atm. Consistency perhaps shows that he is indeed talented, however it doesn't necessarily indicate total cleanliness.

Can't believe I have to post the graph again.

Well to beat Pantani's time's he will need 6.6w/kg



Damn.. Froome is looking thin huh.. Rasmussen and Froome would be best buddies. They could share 'Dietary' tricks with eachother

Lol seriously look at his legs,, but still putting out them watts ^^

He clearly put on lots of upper body muscle in the off season, once he loses that he'll be flying.