Stage 19, Avellino - Vesuvio, 164km

[lookkg386]

Phew.

Great race, they all left it out on the road.Great stuff, Menchov seemed almost overly nervous, the team's plan was to stick on DLD's wheel so well played to him.

Sastre was just awesome.

 

[Cobblestones]

So, it's only 18" between DDL and Menchov. Are there intermediate sprint bonus seconds on the road tomorrow?

 

[Bala Verde]

Never seen such wheel sucking ever before--even if it's to win.

This make Leipheimer and Evans look like Spanish bullfighters, the tip of the spear.

did they ever win a stage beside a TT? (and not including the ToC)

 

[luckyboy]

It's rather unfair that TT's don't yield bonus seconds.

What?

 

[franciep10]

No one should ever criticize Levi or Evans after this. No one. Not fair.

Agreed if we criticize them and not menchov that's not fair to them, I remember a lot of you saying that you don't like levi for wheel sucking then now you commend Menchov, make up ur mind. As for today great stage Di Luca didn't have it today.

 

[Parrot23]

Has he pulled the whole race even once, other than TT and de Siusi (which hardly counts)?

I know who's gonna take his cake: A. Schleck and Contador.

 

[Zoncolan]

did they ever win a stage beside a TT? (and not including the ToC)

Yes, Evans outsprinted Cunego at Coppi e Bartali earlier this year.

 

[Parrot23]

did they ever win a stage beside a TT? (and not including the ToC)

Evans attacks a lot now. Including vs. Menchov in the Dauphine.

 

[Bala Verde]

What?

Well why would you get bonus seconds in a regular stage, where you finish in the top three and (just) before someone else. If your specialty is TT, then you are kinda disadvantaged, because you do arrive somewhere faster then someone else, but you did not get the same bonus.

 

[kjetilraknerud]

I can't believe you are criticising Menchov for trying to win the Giro. You can choose not to like it, but you can't really blame him for doing excactly what he needs to do, nothing more nothing less. As pointed out before, you don't get points for riding beatifully, this isn't ski jumping.

 

[Parrot23]

Has he pulled the whole race even once, other than TT and de Siusi (which hardly counts)?

I know who's gonna take his cake: A. Schleck and Contador.

Addition: even Armstrong has shown his nose at the front this race, and pulling at the front numerous times this race, trying to create opportunities, whatever.

 

[Animal]

Well why would you get bonus seconds in a regular stage, where you finish in the top three and (just) before someone else. If your specialty is TT, then you are kinda disadvantaged, because you do arrive somewhere faster then someone else, but you did not get the same bonus.

I agree.

Equal rights for testers!

 

[luckyboy]

Well why would you get bonus seconds in a regular stage, where you finish in the top three and (just) before someone else. If your specialty is TT, then you are kinda disadvantaged, because you do arrive somewhere faster then someone else, but you did not get the same bonus.

Oh I see.


I'd like to see a GT without any TTs, just to see what happens.

 

[kjetilraknerud]

Yes, Evans outsprinted Cunego at Coppi e Bartali earlier this year.

Evans also won the fourth stage of Paris-Nice last year, although that was after sucking Gesink's wheel for a while

 

[BroDeal]

Addition: even Armstrong has been pulling at the front numerous times this race, trying to create opportunities.

...opportunities for TV exposure. It did not seem to help Leech Leipheimer much.

 

[Bala Verde]

Evans attacks a lot now. Including vs. Menchov in the Dauphine.

Well he attacks because he is always behind, so he kinda has to. If Menchov would have been behind di Luca, I don't think the race played out the same.

It's strategy, but I doubt it's strategy to let evans ride behind someone, when he is in second place...

on top of that, Breukink has always been of the 'conservative' Indurain school. Win TTs and limit losses in the Mountains

 

[jmnikricket]

Well why would you get bonus seconds in a regular stage, where you finish in the top three and (just) before someone else. If your specialty is TT, then you are kinda disadvantaged, because you do arrive somewhere faster then someone else, but you did not get the same bonus.

If your specialty is TT, then you have a huge advantage in that other riders cannot use their teams or draft you. That's why time gaps are larger in TT and why there are no bonus seconds needed to reward good performances.

Man, Sastre looks zonked on the podium. Great effort!

 

[Parrot23]

...opportunities for TV exposure. It did not seem to help Leech Leipheimer much.

Too cynical, Bro.

 

[Merckx]

...opportunities for TV exposure. It did not seem to help Leech Leipheimer much.

haha it has a certain ring to it. Leech Leipheimer. Although Bottle sounds good too

 

[franciep10]

Well he attacks because he is always behind, so he kinda has to. If Menchov would have been behind di Luca, I don't think the race played out the same.

It's strategy, but I doubt it's strategy to let evans ride behind someone, when he is in second place...

on top of that, Breuking has always been of the 'conservative' Indurain school. Win TTs and limit losses in the Mountains

And that's why I didn't like to watche the indurian era Gt's

 

[Parrot23]

on top of that, Breukink has always been of the 'conservative' Indurain school. Win TTs and limit losses in the Mountains

Okay, except for Rasmussen,

 

[Mellow Velo]

If I was selling elastic bands, I'd have Dennis Menchov as my poster boy.
Good stuff, today.
Rabo will let a huge break go, tomorrow, as LPR will be desperate to get DDL to that final climb.
Really is one for him to shift "Limpet" Menchov.

 

[Bala Verde]

Addition: even Armstrong has shown his nose at the front this race, and pulling at the front numerous times this race, trying to create opportunities, whatever.

Well that's for exposure, as well as to save their minimal results in a giro. No stage win, and far from a podium which such a team. After 2 weeks, seeing that all ambitions are shattered, you see lots of teams trying to get that one win just to salvage what's left of their prior goals.

 

[Jamsque]

Never seen such wheel sucking ever before--even if it's to win.

This make Leipheimer and Evans look like Spanish bullfighters, the tip of the spear.

I am getting really fed up with this. Anyone who is levelling 'wheelsucking' accusations at Menchov, Leipheimer or Evans has clearly never raced a bike up a hill in their life.

On the flat at high speeds, slipstreaming makes a big difference, and sitting in the wheels saves you a lot of energy. HOWEVER, once you hit 7/8/9 % slopes, the lower speeds make the advantages of sitting in someone's wheel vanishingly small. Hauling yourself up Vesuvius is incredibly hard, and whether or not you do it at the front of the group or the back makes very little difference. Menchov could have ridden in front of Di Luca today, sure, but the only difference it would have made is that it would have been harder for him to spot when Di Luca was attacking.

Even if you leave aside the fact that Menchov was only saving a tiny amount of energy by following Di Luca, this is professional goddamn bike racing. Menchov isn't trying to prove a point or show off, he is trying to win a Grand Tour. You don't win a grand tour by attacking every day and wasting energy. You have to be clever, you have to save your strength for the times when it will make the most difference. Menchov has done exactly that this Giro. His tactics have been flawless, and that's why he's in pink.

Menchov, Evans and Leipheimer may not be as aggresive as Di Luca and Contador, but that doesn't make them less talented bike riders.

 

[dgodave]

The conditions of the race reward Menchovs tactics, at this point. If you want him to behave differently, change the incentives... Concoct a different race.
.