Stage 8: Station des Rousses - Morzine-Avoriaz 189km

[DamonAlbarn]

Good points, well made..

Yup, that sums it up.

Very droll etc.

 

[DamonAlbarn]

What a load of nonsense

A lot of pages to go through. Been reading back through the catalogue. This needs to be addressed now.

You all posting during the race are not giving your full attention to the race. Guess what that means...you're lacking perspective. I see many of you make idiotic and foolish comments, some which almost match Phil Liggett calling the Avoriaz climb Alpe D'Huez look tame.

Andy Schleck made an acceleration in the final few hundred metres. He is very motivated to win a stage. Big bro is out and he has never won a stage. First time he has lived up to his word on a climb that AC has been in and come off with a win. Not bad, Samuel Sanchez went with him. Contador looked to go and then paid attention to the rest of the group. They couldn't have cared about the win so neither did he. One Spaniard already up the road, if AC was on their wheels he'd be obliged to win. I presume he is spreading the love, letting everyone get a piece of the pie. He already has a nice chunk. Guess who looked like they were coasting the entire stage? AC, not Andy. Who has looked crap all season. AC or Andy? Andy. Who only just beat Samu? Andy. Has, AC beaten Samu this season? Hell yes and by more than a few centimetres. News flash. AC sat back on the final attack and bluffed everyone and I bet as I read on over the last 30 pages of this thread I will find most people misinterpreted the race finish. It meant nothing. All the top guys were there, except for the stage win.

Watch the race and then comment. AC finishing with Menchov, Evans and Basso makes sense. He is close to Menchov and Van den Broecke on GC. Guess who gets yellow when Evans loses it? Andy. Better to give him ten seconds and let him be closer to having his team protect yellow. Contador is very smart and aware. AC had the measure of Schleck in every major stage last year. Who has been strongest this year out of the GC guys? AC and then Evans. A sprint for a stage win, that is contested by only 2 riders who have never worn yellow or won a stage, is not a major indicator of how the race will unfold. Keep the fantasies coming guys. Andy Schleck went for a stage win, not to gain major time at the beginning of a climb. AC is still the one to beat. AC is waiting for the Pyrenees and can take time whenever he chooses.

Well done to Astana and also the two guys sprinting for the win. They did well. To the Shack. Great fail guys. This team will probably stuff up Levi's chances now. So much for Bottle talking them up...only he performed and he sucked wheels the entire way.

My top ten still is in place. I will make a substitute for the RS rider. Levi in for Lance. Heck when Lance first fell I thought he'd lose 3 minutes. Second time I thought he'd lose 5...but 12! Oh how the $h1t has hit the fan. Been a long time coming. Bad year for LA.

Farking hell, do you really believe this?
"Contador decided not to chase..., he's waiting for the Pyrenees"

Jesus...

 

[rhubroma]

I don't know if Contador was just antsy or what, but what was the point in his closing down the Gesink/Sanchez attack? Just a waste of legs and I think a big reason Conti couldn't tack on to Schleck's wheel.

I think he was hoping that the others were at their limit as he was. Responding to those attacks was a passive-aggressive way to try and gain time on his rivals. Had he had the legs he would have attacked from 5-3 ks out, but he clearly wasn't capable today. He hoped the others weren't capable of following, and he was mistaken, above all in regards to Schleck.

On hindsight, he should have marked Schleck and road his race based on the latter's initiatives. Though Schleck did the same in regards to him. Shleck was frightfully strong however.

In the end Schleck proved to be the best climber in the race. AC found himself on the defensive and miscaluclated.

If Schleck retains this from in the Pyrenees, then he can hope for yellow in Paris. Otherwise he will have to stay with his rivals and hopr for the best in the time trial, where he is aparantly most vulnerable (if we are to judge from the past, and, particularly, form the opening prolouge).

AC is either not up to his potential, or will arrive there in the third week. If he does not then, baring Schleck doesn't put more time into him before the final time trial, then the Spaniard can still hope to win there. But as it stands, AC has to drop Schleck to in the mountains to have a real chance to win in Paris.

As far as Basso-Kreuziger goes, Ivan road the Giro the latter did not. He therefore expects to be better in the last week. Kreuziger is already at a high level, it remains to be seen whether or not he can maintain this form till the end. I think Basso could shine in the Pyrenees, if not, then he has not been able to reach the form he had in the Giro.

Evans was the real winner today (along with Shleck of course), however he did suffer the final attacks. He will need to do better in the Pyrenees to hold on to his jersey.

This race is very open between Shleck, Contador and Evans though for sure.

 

[Galic Ho]

Galic Ho,

I like your post, but why do you think Bertie closed the first two attacks?

The were too far out. Andy and Samu went with a little more than 500 to go. Contador shut the first one down and the second and then realised what he was doing. His team did all the work apart from Sky and Saxo who all took minor turns. If he closed down his countryman, he is obligated to win the damn stage because his team did so much work on the last three climbs. Won't do that to a Spaniard of Samu's pedigree. Won't do that to Andy either. Also the profile of the stage tells me that this wasn't a likely win for AC with a bunch group as it wasn't steep enough. If it was the first cat 1 climb they finished on he would have won, but not Morzine Avoriaz. AC was watching Gesink because of the WC that is about to start. Roman made a move because Ivan was in severe pain. Both moves were too far out to let go. Did you see Ivans face? His face looked really funny.

Look at their faces and body language. Riders always copy their body language. A persons brain has only so many neural pathways. Once a form, or stance is memorised, they naturally adopt it when feeling a certain or particular way in a future. By this I mean when a rider is taking it easy, hurting or slightly under strain. Menchov is hard to read and so is AC. AC always looks like he is cruising. Cadel was only hurting near the end. Evans is very easy to read. He is good, so is Menchov and Samu. Gesink and Basso were in some real pain for most of the climb but held on. Good for them. Check out AC in the 2007 Tour, stage 16 if you want to see him in trouble. I haven't seen him look anything like that in 3 years. He was simply not being a selfish git and cheekily playing mind games with all the fans and riders. He is still super strong. His form and preparation suggest as much, more so than any other rider. Wait till the Pyrenees, Last year AC only made a move in the first mountains to shut down a leadership coup de etat within Astana's ranks. He has no need to make a move on day 8 this year. I thought for a second he "looked" weaker when he didn't catch Samu who was gapping Andy, but it was merely gamesmanship and being a good sport. AC was sharing the love. Alsot note that when Andy Schleck goes back in the peloton on a top 20 climb hge is checking people's form. He did it last year numerous times and he did it today. Smart man. He knew he could win today if he waited till late, just like Alpe D'Huez in 2008. Make a move in the later half of the last km on the first real mountain stage and most will let you go, especially when your chrono is that of AS.

I forgot Samu has a punch and that Andy was motivated. I always expect the big name to do his stuff. AC is really smart and knows there is a time and place to make his move. Today wasn't it. 10 seconds means little. The Giro last year and this year had similar group finishes of numerous GC guys in the early mountain stages. The Tour did last year on Arcalis if one excludes AC's ball busting move that nabbed 20 seconds. Looks like those big pulls will come in the Pyrenees.

Really happy that all the guys I picked months back are all on song. All of them. They were all in the front group. Not surprised Wigans was dropped either. Thought he'd lose less though. Sky looked good pulling on the front, but with Wigans limitations it was really stupid.

 

[DamonAlbarn]

no no no, you've got it all wrong according to

I think he was hoping that the others were at their limit as he was. Responding to those attacks was a passive-aggressive way to try and gain time on his rivals. Had he had the legs he would have attacked from 5-3 ks out, but he clearly wasn't capable today. He hoped the others weren't capable of following, and he was mistaken, above all in regards to Schleck.

On hindsight, he should have marked Schleck and road his race based on the latter's initiatives. Though Schleck did the same in regards to him. Shleck was frightfully strong however.

In the end Schleck proved to be the best climber in the race. AC found himself on the defensive and miscaluclated.

If Schleck retains this from in the Pyrenees, then he can hope for yellow in Paris. Otherwise he will have to stay with his rivals and hopr for the best in the time trial, where he is aparantly most vulnerable (if we are to judge from the past, and, particularly, form the opening prolouge).

AC is either not up to his potential, or will arrive there in the third week. If he does not then, baring Schleck doesn't put more time into him before the final time trial, then the Spaniard can still hope to win in there. But as it stands, AC has to drop Schleck to in the mountains to have a real chance to win in Paris.

As far as Basso-Kreuziger goes, Ivan road the Giro the latter did not. He therefore expects to be better in the last week. Kreuziger is already at a high level, it remains to be seen whether or not he can maintain this form till the end. I think Basso could shine in the Pyrenees, if not, then he has not been able to reach the form he had in the Giro.

Evans was the real winner today (along with Shleck of course), however he did suffer the final attacks. He will need to do better in the Pyrenees to hold on to his jersey.

This race is very open between Shleck, Contador and Evans though for sure.

to people on here, AC decided NOT to chase Schleck.
You couldn't make it up.

 

[rhubroma]

to people on here, AC decided NOT to chase Schleck.
You couldn't make it up.

Nope, sorry, he was gassed out. Schleck beat him today in a fair fight.

 

[Publicus]

This was stage 8. Last year AC blew the doors off of everyone on Stage 15. I think he is aiming to peak the 3rd week. All of the climbing plus the last TT are going to be where this Tour is won or lost.

 

[DamonAlbarn]

Very good summary..

I think he was hoping that the others were at their limit as he was. Responding to those attacks was a passive-aggressive way to try and gain time on his rivals. Had he had the legs he would have attacked from 5-3 ks out, but he clearly wasn't capable today. He hoped the others weren't capable of following, and he was mistaken, above all in regards to Schleck.

On hindsight, he should have marked Schleck and road his race based on the latter's initiatives. Though Schleck did the same in regards to him. Shleck was frightfully strong however.

In the end Schleck proved to be the best climber in the race. AC found himself on the defensive and miscaluclated.

If Schleck retains this from in the Pyrenees, then he can hope for yellow in Paris. Otherwise he will have to stay with his rivals and hopr for the best in the time trial, where he is aparantly most vulnerable (if we are to judge from the past, and, particularly, form the opening prolouge).

AC is either not up to his potential, or will arrive there in the third week. If he does not then, baring Schleck doesn't put more time into him before the final time trial, then the Spaniard can still hope to win there. But as it stands, AC has to drop Schleck to in the mountains to have a real chance to win in Paris.

As far as Basso-Kreuziger goes, Ivan road the Giro the latter did not. He therefore expects to be better in the last week. Kreuziger is already at a high level, it remains to be seen whether or not he can maintain this form till the end. I think Basso could shine in the Pyrenees, if not, then he has not been able to reach the form he had in the Giro.

Evans was the real winner today (along with Shleck of course), however he did suffer the final attacks. He will need to do better in the Pyrenees to hold on to his jersey.

This race is very open between Shleck, Contador and Evans though for sure.

Andy Schleck was on his own, at least I didn't see Chris Anker Sorensen among the final 15, and Fuglsang has been very disappointing so far. THAT has to be the point of the day when wading through dross on the chat pages.

 

[Cerberus]

Here you go:

http://www.diariodeleon.es/noticias/noticia.asp?pkid=540078

♠Perhaps you use a better autotranslate tool than I do, but what I get is at one point "The feeling was good. Sometimes I could hardly breathe" which doesn't make much sense. Seems to say both that he felt great and that he was at his limit in the space of 10 words. Can anyone who speaks Spanish clear up what he actually said?

 

[Benotti69]

Galic Ho, it was Sean Kelly's opinion that AC couldn't follow Shleck...

watching, it definitely looked like he tried and couldn't.

AS should have gone a lot earlier if he was feeling that good in his legs. Not gonna put time into someone is last kilometre....

 

[rhubroma]

Andy Schleck was on his own, at least I didn't see Chris Anker Sorensen among the final 15, and Fuglsang has been very disappointing so far. THAT has to be the point of the day when wading through dross on the chat pages.

What does this mean?

 

[Publicus]

♠Perhaps you use a better autotranslate tool than I do, but what I get is at one point "The feeling was good. Sometimes I could hardly breathe" which doesn't make much sense. Seems to say both that he felt great and that he was at his limit in the space of 10 words. Can anyone who speaks Spanish clear up what he actually said?

You seem to cut off the first part of the translated sentence:

"Starting and caught me a bit ago, so I decided to wait a bit for those who came from behind. I have removed a few seconds, but the feeling was good. Sometimes I could hardly breathe, "he said.

 

[DamonAlbarn]

Very good point

Galic Ho, it was Sean Kelly's opinion that AC couldn't follow Shleck...

watching, it definitely looked like he tried and couldn't.

AS should have gone a lot earlier if he was feeling that good in his legs. Not gonna put time into someone is last kilometre....

Very interesting cheers. Kelly has a point but perhaps they were all a bit scared of revealing their form just yet?

cheers!

 

[Galic Ho]

Farking hell, do you really believe this?
"Contador decided not to chase..., he's waiting for the Pyrenees"

Jesus...

If you posted on this forum regularly and I knew your stance on racers, then I would pay attention to the "jesus" part. There have been a lot of exaggerations here today about the plethora of topics that have arisen.

When was the last time Contador lost a major HC? Only Ricco and Rasmussen have beaten him in the last 3 years. Sella to. Andy Schleck won the final sprint on a hill stage contested by himself and one other man who shares the same nationality as AC. Too many variables in play to say who was the best climber...I'd give Navarro the nod personally. Andy simply won the stage. Andy did not make a move early on and drop everyone. I've never seen him do that. But I have seen Contador do it. Have you seen the movie "Get Him to the Greek? Go watch it and pay attention to the "Mind F%#K", because that is what Contador just did. He is playing with people and sharing the love. He had no real motive to stop 10 minor seconds (he was 3 plus minutes ahead in last years Tour) being gained by his major rival on day 8, when he knows what he can do and how strong he really is.

Perception dude. People are seeing what they want to see. A competition...which makes for lots of innuendo, speculation and for those watching and not commentating, good viewing. It is only a matter of time till AC pulls it all back and knocks everyone down to their natural pecking order. That is the Pyrenees role this year.

 

[DamonAlbarn]

rhubroma

What does this mean?

That means he's basically on his own
(good grief)

 

[Cerberus]

You seem to cut off the first part of the translated sentence:

Yes I did, only quoted the part that was most clearly contradicting itself. As for the earlier part I still don't think it's that clear and given how nonsensical the part I highlighted was I'm not inclined to draw overly subtle meanings from the rest, particularly when it contradicts what I saw myself. Given a choice between believing the race footage and a machine translation of something Contador said I chose to believe the race footage.

 

[richwagmn]

What does this mean?

Saxo looks quite weak to me. BMC is weak too. AC's in a good spot. BMC should be shot by the time they get to week 3. If I'm Astana, I just rest up now.

 

[sometriguy]

You seem to cut off the first part of the translated sentence:

Contador said he made the mistake of being in the front of the group in a head wind... which would have made him tired.

But, I Think it explains the breathing problems. If you have done a lot of running or biking into a head wind, you realize that it messes with your breathing pattern.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/nelson-mail/...3/Aussie-leads-Tour-as-Lance-Armstrong-cracks

 

[rhubroma]

That means he's basically on his own
(good grief)

Sorry genius, but what does this have to do with anthing? He was on his own, ergo he had to win the stage? But not Contador? Contador could afford to let the second most predicted rider to win the Tour gain more time on him?

Right, AC just sat up and saved energy.

(Good grief, indeed)

 

[DamonAlbarn]

Too many swear words so lost interest half way through

If you posted on this forum regularly and I knew your stance on racers, then I would pay attention.

Wake the F*&K up. When was the last time Contador lost a major HC? Only Ricco and Rasmussen have beaten him in the last 3 years. Sella to. Andy Schleck won the final sprint on a hill stage contested by himself and one other man who shares the same nationality as AC. Too many variables in play to say who was the best climber...I'd give Navarro the nod personally. Andy simply won the stage. Andy did not make a move early on and drop everyone. I've never seen him do that. But I have seen Contador do it. Have you seen the movie "Get Him to the Greek? Go watch it and pay attention to the "Mind F%#K", because that is what Contador just did. He is playing with people and sharing the love. He had no real motive to stop 10 minor seconds (he was 3 plus minutes ahead in last years Tour) being gained by his major rival on day 8, when he knows what he can do and how strong he really is.

Perception dude. People are seeing what they want to see. A competition...which makes for lots of innuendo, speculation and for those watching, not commentating, good viewing. It is only a matter of time till AC pulls it all back and knocks everyone down to their natural pecking order. That is the Pyrenees role this year.

On current evidence I can't see the AC lovefest materialise sorry!
Jokes and togging todgers aside, this is going to be a very good race, I think we can all agree on that.
Let the fun beging, and perhaps some of us may have egg on our faces afterwards....

Deal?

 

[Publicus]

Here's a quote from the Velonews story that is in English:

“I didn’t quite have the punch in my legs to react when Andy attacked,” Contador said at the finish. “Last year, Andy put me on the ropes. Now it’s obvious that he will be my most dangerous rival this year.”

So I'll go with this quote over the google translated one.

Some more quotes:

I am very content with today’s stage. The team did an incredible job today. We were the only team willing to take the weight of the race on our shoulders and the team responded perfectly,” Contador said. “We wanted to attack from a little further from the finish, but Schleck was all over me. We have to be content because we eliminated some important rivals.”

Contador didn’t seem too worried about the time differences to Evans and Schleck.

“We are just starting this Tour and I am satisfied that the team responded the way we did in the stage today,” he said. “The Pyrénées will be even more difficult. We are in a good position going into the second half of the race.”

http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/07/news/alberto-contador-%E2%80%98andy-schleck-is-most-dangerous-rival%E2%80%99-at-the-tour-de-france_128182?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=VN

 

[DamonAlbarn]

I'm sure you are a diamond geezer and all that

Sorry genius, but what does this have to do with anthing? He was on his own, ergo he had to win the stage? But not Contador? Contador could afford to let the second most predicted rider to win the Tour gain more time on him?

Right, AC just sat up and saved energy.

(Good grief, indeed)

but AC just sat up and saved energy? Oh Cheers, that's sorted then.

 

[rhubroma]

Saxo looks quite weak to me. BMC is weak too. AC's in a good spot. BMC should be shot by the time they get to week 3. If I'm Astana, I just rest up now.

Saxo may be weak, but AC was not stronger than Shleck today. Anyone that thinks otherwise is deluding themselves. Perhaps tomorrow will be different, but today Andy was the strongest. End of story.

 

[rhubroma]

but AC just sat up and saved energy? Oh Cheers, that's sorted then.

It's all just Greek to me.

 

[VeloCity]

People are seeing what they want to see.

Yes, you are.