State of the Peloton 2024

[Casual cyclist]

In the comments he basically says that he knows small fish ("Landis") but is now building evidence for his big fish ("Lance"). Apparantly he has been in discussion with mou as well who says in the comments that he is eager to supply him with any info showing Pogi is clean. According to mou it's more realistic that the pope would mary in the Saint Peter's cathedral than Pogi doping

That could actually be true, at least during this season. As we have seen with our own eyes, he did not have to push on those pedals all that hard, smiling and chatting with camera guys while on the attack. Indeed, why damage own health with chemicals if the little "secret" inside the bike does much of the required work?

A little addendum: that must be the same insider mou who secretly let us. this past winter, on "Pogi' switching from the country bumpkin Maxtin as coach to a "real" one who was going to have him do some intervals on top of the famous "zone 2" easy pedaling. So we, as warned my Mr. Insider, had better be not too surprised if 'Pogi' showed a newb-like improvements (like 10% or more instantly). So, we heeded said warning and, when 'Pogi' did that 80k solo, just shrugged our shoulders saying "yeah, expected, he has just started training like a serious amateur." So let's wait until he starts training like a professional, you know, with a power meter and stuff... And let us not act surprised when he adds another 10% next year. All thanks to mou. It feels really good to be informed. I just hate that feeling of being a fool in the dark.

 

[Nick2413]

There's at least anecdotal evidence in ultra endurance athletes that fatigue, presumably at lower intensities, is also highly psychological and people can just blast through levels of fatigue they didn't think was possible at all.

I agree and would be interested in reading more on this if there is a source/studies

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Muscular damage and glycogen shortage. I think in extreme exercise there's also hormonal effects.

There's at least anecdotal evidence in ultra endurance athletes that fatigue, presumably at lower intensities, is also highly psychological and people can just blast through levels of fatigue they didn't think was possible at all.

The last point is definitely true. There are various levels of fatigue: when one feels considerable fatigue for the first time it's still far from being "done" but mental effort is required. I experienced it a few times during ultra long treks (up to 70 km in one day).

 

[peterfin]

The last point is definitely true. There are various levels of fatigue: when one feels considerable fatigue for the first time it's still far from being "done" but mental effort is required. I experienced it a few times during ultra long treks (up to 70 km in one day).

Apparently the brain can reduce nerve signals to protect muscles from being damaged. Willpower may help to reactivate the nervous system.

 

[zlev11]

Clicky bait or actual info?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847337675814039733

View: https://x.com/unclecycling/status/1847337675814039733?s=19

CyclingHighlights
@unclecycling

"Since 45 days I know one of the biggest doping secrets in World Tour. It will be disappointing for a lot of fans who think actual cycling is clean. But I have to wait guys, that’s how it works. This info has a great value but we don’t sell nothing to the press."

this guy is a clickbait artist but he occasionally does have some real scoops. his videos about the Portuguese peloton ended up all being true. he seems to have legitimate insider information.

 

[houtdffan]

We've seen an absolute arms race the last 3 years

started when Mapei bossed things from April through October of 2022 (except for Remco's little heat stroke at TDS)

Then Mapei were bossing things early in 2023 until covid and the Bank Robbers really turned up the dial, winning all 3 GT in 2023

Saunier-Duval really turned it up about 10 notches in 2024

What will Mapei and the Bank Robbers do to counter, or will everyone be told, no more of this?


The bigger question is, how are these teams still allowed to operate?

 

[Rob5091]

According to the UCI we're in 2025
(see https://inrng.com/2024/10/happy-new-year-2025-season/ ) so thinking about 2024, if all of the peloton is just as juiced up as this year then next year, I fear, we'll have more bad crashes. As Tommy Franks said, "Speed kills".

 

[pastronef]

Radio France has an investigation about products in the peloton. voltaren, paracetamol, caffeine, ketones.
stuff I can buy over the counter

 

[Rob5091]

Radio France has an investigation about products in the peloton. voltaren, paracetamol, caffeine, ketones.
stuff I can buy over the counter

Is Tapentadol mentioned as it's still only on WADA's monitor list? (https://www.wada-ama.org/sites/defa...toring_program_en_final_22_september_2023.pdf )

 

[pastronef]

Is Tapentadol mentioned as it's still only on WADA's monitor list? (https://www.wada-ama.org/sites/defa...toring_program_en_final_22_september_2023.pdf )

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPmqZavnJEE


they talk about legal stuff. nothing banned. Tapendadol not named

 

[pastronef]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1849901595829363066

View: https://x.com/faustonef/status/1849901595829363066

 

[Rob5091]

If guys and gals in the pro-peloton are using something that's not banned, then it's legal. A little lab alteration and volia, illegal becomes legal. If WADA have no test for something, then it's as good as legal (i.e. "Never tested positive!")

 

[Ripper]

If guys and gals in the pro-peloton are using something that's not banned, then it's legal. A little lab alteration and volia, illegal becomes legal. If WADA have no test for something, then it's as good as legal (i.e. "Never tested positive!")

We know that is not quite true though. The WADA rules definitely make mention of general methods and the sought after effects. They do this because 1) with some products, if you do make some changes to a compound, it is not currently testable (e.g. the Clear), and 2) some methods or drugs might be created to have a specific effect, but no available test right now (think of any cutting edge process that could be similar to EPO).

 

[Ripper]

Radio France has an investigation about products in the peloton. voltaren, paracetamol, caffeine, ketones.
stuff I can buy over the counter

That must be some crazy reporting they got going on

I am old and I sometimes take three of those things on a regular training day

Pretty sure that NSAIDS, acetaminophen, and some coffee are not what is fueling the top dogs right now. No idea where ketones fit for most people, but given it is "all about the carbs", color me skeptical

 

[Sciatic]

Radio France should instead be digging into the marine lugworms thing. A French company is the only one worldwide to have put a product on the market. Of course, it’s probably not French riders to target since they are performing so poorly.

 

[E_F_]

Of course, it’s probably not French riders to target since they are performing so poorly.

They're better than ever, but they can't compete because doping is illegal in France.

 

[cnort]

Of course, it’s probably not French riders to target since they are performing so poorly.

Surely they should target the French because a) they won't find anything and b) they can tell the riders what they haven't found so the riders can start taking it and "level the playing field".

 

[Pannenkooky]

In the comments he basically says that he knows small fish ("Landis") but is now building evidence for his big fish ("Lance"). Apparantly he has been in discussion with mou as well who says in the comments that he is eager to supply him with any info showing Pogi is clean. According to mou it's more realistic that the pope would mary in the Saint Peter's cathedral than Pogi doping

I find it weird that his YouTube sounds like a normal Englishman but his Twitter reads like someone whose first language is not English...what's up with that?

 

[pastronef]

I find it weird that his YouTube sounds like a normal Englishman but his Twitter reads like someone whose first language is not English...what's up with that?

yes, his first language is Spanish from some of his replies in Spanish. but I've yet to watch a video, I'll probably won't though

 

[Pannenkooky]

yes, his first language is Spanish from some of his replies in Spanish. but I've yet to watch a video, I'll probably won't though

If his first language is Spanish who is speaking in the videos or writing the scripts? The patterns of speech sound like native English.

 

[pastronef]

"Jean-Pierre Verdy, former director of the French Anti-Doping Agency, considers this massive use of drugs to be a form of doping, albeit a legal one."

"The investigation also highlights the availability of various drugs in the peloton. Cyclists have access to substances such as Voltaren, caffeine or paracetamol, often in the form of cocktails. An anonymous witness describes the "magic box", a box containing various drugs, freely distributed before races. The concept of the "bomba", a mixture of these authorized products, recalls the amphetamine cocktails that were once widespread."

no, NO. it does recall fck all. amphetamines are banned. voltaren, caffeine, paracetamol are legal. dear me some French journos are desperate. they'd better stick at looking for those invisible motors

 

[Monoxidator]

yes, his first language is Spanish from some of his replies in Spanish. but I've yet to watch a video, I'll probably won't though

I'm sure he pays a voice talent to read the scripts.

 

[Nick2413]

"Jean-Pierre Verdy, former director of the French Anti-Doping Agency, considers this massive use of drugs to be a form of doping, albeit a legal one."

"The investigation also highlights the availability of various drugs in the peloton. Cyclists have access to substances such as Voltaren, caffeine or paracetamol, often in the form of cocktails. An anonymous witness describes the "magic box", a box containing various drugs, freely distributed before races. The concept of the "bomba", a mixture of these authorized products, recalls the amphetamine cocktails that were once widespread."

no, NO. it does recall fck all. amphetamines are banned. voltaren, caffeine, paracetamol are legal. dear me some French journos are desperate. they'd better stick at looking for those invisible motors

It delegitimizes the threat of doping purely by association to even mention those things in the same sentence as blood doping or other banned substances.

 

[pastronef]

It delegitimizes the threat of doping purely by association to even mention those things in the same sentence as blood doping or other banned substances.

but it gets mentions and clicks cause the vast majority of the July watchers think that way. and it's absolutely baffling how the few twitter-antidopers (Neil Wooldridge, Vayer, UncleCycling and co) promote that view. they shout "caffeine, voltaren, paracetamol" same as the French journos are doing.
ffs, if you blab on about credibility, well, then check your own one.
yeah I know we made this points before on here

 

[E_F_]

no, NO. it does recall fck all. amphetamines are banned. voltaren, caffeine, paracetamol are legal. dear me some French journos are desperate. they'd better stick at looking for those invisible motors

Amphetamines weren't banned. It's 100% very much like when amphetamine-cocktails were widespread in cycling.