Strava sued over cyclist death

[Boeing]

See there is one thing I've never even clicked on, I'm off in comparing my own times on my own sections I deem or want to compare. Sure I see the other sections people mark off but one person's sprint is another's cool down section or stop and have a coffee. You need to stop looking at the others and concentrate on your own times. Much like life, others always trying to distract you.

thank for the advice and I appreciate your higher moral standing and focus . I'm looking at the tab and the site in the context of a lawsuit and Culpability and trying to find something to talk about other than humanistic hogwash

but we are cool my friend as you know no probs

 

[Boeing]

Many a Strava record is held by the guy who leaves their Garmin on their bike.... on their roof rack.... whilst they're driving home in their car..

that would be me

 

[MarkvW]

thank for the advice and I appreciate your higher moral standing and focus . I'm looking at the tab and the site in the context of a lawsuit and Culpability and trying to find something to talk about other than humanistic hogwash

but we are cool my friend as you know no probs

I'd start my culpability thinking with the First Amendment. The Plaintiffs are arguing that people should be barred from communicating about their fastest times on the Internet. There's no principled reason for making a distinction between Internet discussions, and discussions made on the street.

In other words, Plaintiffs' theory would necessarily mean that I couldn't brag to you in a face-to-face conversation about my fastest time around Mount Rainier because that might encourage you to kill yourself in an attempt to get around Mount Rainier faster than me (as if you could).

 

[ElChingon]

thank for the advice and I appreciate your higher moral standing and focus . I'm looking at the tab and the site in the context of a lawsuit and Culpability and trying to find something to talk about other than humanistic hogwash

but we are cool my friend as you know no probs

No worries man, I considered that above just a friendly discussion, not a harsh word was written, except about the Idiot

 

[Boeing]

settle or thrown out at pleading?

 

[MarkvW]

If it's not dismissed voluntarily, its 12(b)(6)'d. That's my bet.

 

[MarkvW]

so you think average speed is a true measure of fitness?

Of course it is, ceteris paribus.

 

[Boeing]

Of course it is, ceteris paribus.

parturient montes, nascetur ridiculus mus

 

[hiero2]

How does this differ from the average speed-o-meter or a stopwatch? . . .

I agree with the oldman. But you ask a good question - and the difference is there. The old free speech legal example was yelling fire in a crowded theatre. At what point does an activity become a social hazard?

You pointed to fast food as an earlier example - yet obesity has become such a national problem - it directly causes higher medical costs for all of us - that aspects of fast food have become the subject of legal restriction!

I think there is a good argument that Strava is crossing that line. And I do not think this is a trivial lawsuit, nor one that indicates a loss of common sense. It could well be that the lawsuit actually represents common sense.

 

[ElChingon]

I agree with the oldman. But you ask a good question - and the difference is there. The old free speech legal example was yelling fire in a crowded theatre. At what point does an activity become a social hazard?

You pointed to fast food as an earlier example - yet obesity has become such a national problem - it directly causes higher medical costs for all of us - that aspects of fast food have become the subject of legal restriction!

I think there is a good argument that Strava is crossing that line. And I do not think this is a trivial lawsuit, nor one that indicates a loss of common sense. It could well be that the lawsuit actually represents common sense.

Well if they win the case then Strava can counter sue the parents for not raising their kid right and for being such an idiot, should be interesting. As we know kids are blaming all their life long issues on their parents so now they should be sued for not raising the kid right.

 

[MarkvW]

If you strip away all the emotional affect, I can't see that the website is anything more than a map with routes and posted times ranked fastest first. The plaintiffs want to make that illegal.

Maybe I can ride a Strava route at high speed! And if I get scared I can sue them for my pain and suffering!

 

[Boeing]

Well if they win the case then Strava can counter sue the parents for not raising their kid right and for being such an idiot, should be interesting. As we know kids are blaming all their life long issues on their parents so now they should be sued for not raising the kid right.

Balif, wack his peepee

 

[ElChingon]

Balif, wack his peepee

Well you may know more about the case and kid than me

 

[Boeing]

If you strip away all the emotional affect, I can't see that the website is anything more than a map with routes and posted times ranked fastest first. The plaintiffs want to make that illegal.

Maybe I can ride a Strava route at high speed! And if I get scared I can sue them for my pain and suffering!

Excellent read on the subject of gross negligence in the state of California

http://www.plaintiffmagazine.com/Se... City of Santa Barbara_Plaintiff magazine.pdf



my good friend elcapitain; moral ideology aside

the bottom line is that (as stated in the link above) The California Supreme Court affirms that liability waivers for future gross negligence are unforeseeable as a matter of public policy. Claimants seeking damages in the context of sports or recreational programs have the ability to defeat a general release of negligence if they can plead and prove gross negligence





Is starva a sports program?
Can they prove gross negligence?

http://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx?selected=838

carelessness which is in reckless disregard for the safety or lives of others, and is so great it appears to be a conscious violation of other people's rights to safety. It is more than simple inadvertence, but it is just shy of being intentionally evil. If one has borrowed or contracted to take care of anther's property, then gross negligence is the failure to actively take the care one would of his/her own property. If gross negligence is found by the trier of fact (judge or jury), it can result in the award of punitive damages on top of general and special damages.

a bit of a reach maybe but I have a feeling this will have an impact on web based sports programs legally at a local, national and perhaps even international level.

Here is a link the their new terms and conditions.

http://www.strava.com/terms

 

[Boeing]

If you strip away all the emotional affect, I can't see that the website is anything more than a map with routes and posted times ranked fastest first. The plaintiffs want to make that illegal.

Maybe I can ride a Strava route at high speed! And if I get scared I can sue them for my pain and suffering!

It think you should start by removing emotion form your judgement

 

[Boeing]

I agree with the oldman. But you ask a good question - and the difference is there. The old free speech legal example was yelling fire in a crowded theatre. At what point does an activity become a social hazard?

You pointed to fast food as an earlier example - yet obesity has become such a national problem - it directly causes higher medical costs for all of us - that aspects of fast food have become the subject of legal restriction!

I think there is a good argument that Strava is crossing that line. And I do not think this is a trivial lawsuit, nor one that indicates a loss of common sense. It could well be that the lawsuit actually represents common sense.

good points thanks for adding them.

 

[Boeing]

I'd start my culpability thinking with the First Amendment. The Plaintiffs are arguing that people should be barred from communicating about their fastest times on the Internet. There's no principled reason for making a distinction between Internet discussions, and discussions made on the street.

In other words, Plaintiffs' theory would necessarily mean that I couldn't brag to you in a face-to-face conversation about my fastest time around Mount Rainier because that might encourage you to kill yourself in an attempt to get around Mount Rainier faster than me (as if you could).

true. but it is hearsay and or legend and not spelled out in a diagram inviting a challenge for a fee

 

[MarkvW]

true. but it is hearsay and or legend and not spelled out in a diagram inviting a challenge for a fee

I agree with you, but that's the 'defense in depth.'
Kill them on the beaches with the First Amendment, I say!

 

[Boeing]

I'm gonna go ride that course. My tuck is better and I can top the max speed and shave like 3 seconds. cant wait to beat my chest in the LBS ride after.

 

[BillytheKid]

Back in the day, we would swap times anyway. People are always competitive.
I would push myself on descents in trianing because you can loose a race on the downhill and I enjoyed it all.

If Strava goes down to this, then racing goes down because in effect Strava is a form of competition. But it is not formal competition. I had family members that could never understand why I raced. They were very negative about it. Let freedom rain, let freedon rain... Bicycling is dangerous, but so is driving a car. This is nothing but a shakedown.

Risk is an inherent part of living.

 

[rickshaw]

Please

I would appreciate if posters would indicate if they are a parent or not. Better yet, tell us if any of your children have died because of a stupid dare. How long did it take for the hole in your life to heal? Just a stupid kid anyway. Wouldn't it be nice other moms and dads didn't have to bury their stupid children?

 

[slowoldman]

Strava does not equal racing.

Racing teaches you how to handle your bike at speed. Strava encourages those that do not have that skill set to go out and ride beyond their capabilities to get some ridiculous "KOM".

Strava is garbage.

 

[Afrank]

I would appreciate if posters would indicate if they are a parent or not. Better yet, tell us if any of your children have died because of a stupid dare. How long did it take for the hole in your life to heal? Just a stupid kid anyway. Wouldn't it be nice other moms and dads didn't have to bury their stupid children?

So your saying just because their kid died then they have the right to sue anyone they want? Yes it is bad that this person died and sad for the parents but it doesn't excuse that they are now trying to make money off of what was a dumb decision to go that fast made by their son.

 

[phanatic]

reminds me of this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeXQBHLIPcw

Scary. On topic: Stupid and inconsiderate parents, stupid and inconsiderate kid. If this is how they grieve, they ought not to.

 

[ustabe]

Back in the day, we would swap times anyway. People are always competitive.
I would push myself on descents in trianing because you can loose a race on the downhill and I enjoyed it all.

If Strava goes down to this, then racing goes down because in effect Strava is a form of competition. But it is not formal competition. I had family members that could never understand why I raced. They were very negative about it. Let freedom rain, let freedon rain... Bicycling is dangerous, but so is driving a car. This is nothing but a shakedown.

Risk is an inherent part of living.

I concur with this, except for the typos. If you go fast, you assume the risk.

Well, my family was more ambivalent about racing. They saw it as basically uplifting but puzzling, sort of like Breaking Away. The difference now is the technological element, backed by deep pockets.