Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[HashRouge]

The first 7 km might have been very bad but let's not pretend his final 7 km were good. He lost more than 2s/km to Remco from T1 to finish.

The only stretch where he was alright was the climb, which btw contradicts the idea that a heavy bike would be the main issue.

I'm more concerned about the gap to JV to be honest. Remco is the best TTer in the world and I'd expect a decent chunk of change between him and the next guy on a TT like this, whereas I'd expect a relatively similar time from Jonas and Pog.

 

[rafa92]

These are calculations they made at X.

It's not exact, but it seems he was the best on the climb. The seconds may vary, but he was definitely the best.
His worst stretch was the first 7 km.

I read another comment that said he had problems with the bike before start. I haven't seen this.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932841506353664358

View: https://x.com/BenjiNaesen/status/1932841506353664358

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932839657013981423

View: https://x.com/BenjiNaesen/status/1932839657013981423

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932839727839039501

View: https://x.com/VeloFanaticcc/status/1932839727839039501

wow! very difficult to explain, he lost more than 30 seconds in 6.5 kms of flat? that's very hard to explain, if you think about it, it can't be explained by his shape or a bad day, because in the first kms everyone is fresh, he can't loose that much time. On the climb he was indeed the faster, and that's a positive sign going forward, in the flat something clearly went wrong

 

[rafa92]

I'm more concerned about the gap to JV to be honest. Remco is the best TTer in the world and I'd expect a decent chunk of change between him and the next guy on a TT like this, whereas I'd expect a relatively similar time from Jonas and Pog.

don't consider remco, focus on jonas vs pog, it's impossible that pogacar looses 30 seconds in 6.5 km of flat at the beginning of the TT (so when fresh). Something clearly went wrong, when I see him lifting the bike of visma after the race or when I see him wobbling on the bike whenever he went above a certain speed makes me believe he is not happy with the materials. To me the fact he was the best on the climb is a very good sign

 

[Poursuivant]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932830407809978370

View: https://x.com/friebos/status/1932830407809978370

 

[Lequack]

Maybe Pog should skip the Tour de France and do the Tour of Qinghai Lake instead.

 

[CatchyH]

Regardless of why he lost all that time, he now has to gain it back if he wants to win the race. Which means he'll have to go on the attack and that should be an exciting watch.

 

[Cycling111]

We'll soon see if he's not in good shape. If he puts in good stages, then we'll have to think it's a problem with the bike.
If he is bad in the mountains, it´s a problem of preparation.

We'll soon find out.

 

[rafa92]

We'll soon see if he's not in good shape. If he puts in good stages, then we'll have to think it's a problem with the bike.
If he is bad in the mountains, it´s a problem of preparation.

We'll soon find out.

exactly, let's wait for the weekend

 

[Fos]

wow! very difficult to explain, he lost more than 30 seconds in 6.5 kms of flat? that's very hard to explain, if you think about it, it can't be explained by his shape or a bad day, because in the first kms everyone is fresh, he can't loose that much time. On the climb he was indeed the faster, and that's a positive sign going forward, in the flat something clearly went wrong

Best time on climb and drinking?, losing exaggerated time in a few first kms?...maybe he want to troll everyone!.

Very strange ITT indeed.

 

[Jack_89]

Time to retire yet? 😆
This remember the post Amstel days

 

[Poursuivant]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932845412618268891

View: https://x.com/LucGrefte/status/1932845412618268891

 

[rafa92]

Best time on climb and drinking?, losing exaggerated time in a few first kms?...maybe he want to troll everyone!.

Very strange ITT indeed.

super strange

 

[rafa92]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932845412618268891

View: https://x.com/LucGrefte/status/1932845412618268891

clearly he can't tell the whole story (throwing his sponsors under the bus) but apart from the pacing there are clearly problems with the setup. Just looked at the times and also from T1 to finish (descent + flat) he was awful, that can't be a pacing issue.

 

[rafa92]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932821959919747452

View: https://x.com/LucGrefte/status/1932821959919747452


This photo tells almost all you need to know about today (I still think pog is not at his best yet). How else would you explain this

 

[Cycling111]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932845412618268891

View: https://x.com/LucGrefte/status/1932845412618268891

This is very strange. The first time trial of the 2024 Tour had the same profile, but was longer.
I mean, Pogacar has a lot of experience to make a miscalculation like that.

It's strange. Although I'd rather he not tell the truth than to make excuses.

 

[jmdirt]

no the bike model is called TT1 and was released at the beginning of 2022, then they might change other materials every year

The bike could keep the name TT1 while still continuing to evolve, right? The name being the same doesn't necessarily tell us anything. Although, a quick goog only turns up a new 3D printed aero bottle.

 

[Extinction]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932821959919747452

View: https://x.com/LucGrefte/status/1932821959919747452


This photo tells almost all you need to know about today (I still think pog is not at his best yet). How else would you explain this

Then again, nobody amongst Tour contendors should be at their best until the Tour (in particular, weeks 2 and 3).

 

[rafa92]

The bike could keep the name TT1 while still continuing to evolve, right? The name being the same doesn't necessarily tell us anything. Although, a quick goog only turns up a new 3D printed aero bottle.

no, if they release a new bike the name always changes, the frame is the same from 2022. Then they might change other things (wheels, handlebars....)

 

[rafa92]

This is very strange. The first time trial of the 2024 Tour had the same profile, but was longer.
I mean, Pogacar has a lot of experience to make a miscalculation like that.

It's strange. Although I'd rather he not tell the truth than to make excuses.

of course it's strange, pog knows perfectly how to pace a TT, as you say he's got a lot of experience for these kind of efforts. You can always make a small miscalculation but that would not explain the time splits of today. We have to wait for the weekend to have a better idea of his level

 

[jmdirt]

Well,

no, if they release a new bike the name always changes, the frame is the same from 2022. Then they might change other things (wheels, handlebars....)

I can't speak specifically about Colnogo, but bike companies frequently change things (maybe small) without changing the name.

EDIT: I don't know if making changes like epoxy, or lay-up require UCI recertification for team bikes though.

 

[Cycling111]

X's calculations appear to have been incorrect. Pogacar has uploaded the climb time to Strava, and it doesn't good.
Same as Jorgenson, so I assume Vingegaard and Remco must have done better.

Pogacar can't be on Jorgenson's climb times. That's a very bad time for him.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932857802453553384

View: https://x.com/laflammerouge16/status/1932857802453553384

 

[Lorzenz08]

This is very strange. The first time trial of the 2024 Tour had the same profile, but was longer.
I mean, Pogacar has a lot of experience to make a miscalculation like that.

It's strange. Although I'd rather he not tell the truth than to make excuses.

Yes there is definitely more to it.

However for me the fact that he lost 20 secs in the first 7km is a point of comfort. In the sense that this is not indicative of an endurance issue.
The problem is somewhere else

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Yes there is definitely more to it.

However for me the fact that he lost 20 secs in the first 7km is a point of comfort. In the sense that this is not indicative of an endurance issue.
The problem is somewhere else

17-km TT is not about endurance, it's about above-threshold performance at a very high % of VO2max. Pogacar clearly missed submaximal wattage for some reason, his top form was not there.

 

[rafa92]

X's calculations appear to have been incorrect. Pogacar has uploaded the climb time to Strava, and it doesn't good.
Same as Jorgenson, so I assume Vingegaard and Remco must have done better.

Pogacar can't be on Jorgenson's climb times. That's a very bad time for him.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932857802453553384

View: https://x.com/laflammerouge16/status/1932857802453553384

X calculations are not calculations, they just took screenshots of the big 3 at the same point at the foot of the climb (it was after 6.5 kms approximately) and there pogacar was down more than 30 sec from remco and 27 from vingegaard, then from that point to the intermediate (in that part there was the climb, a very short descent and then another short part going uphill) pogacar took 3 seconds on evenepoel and 8 on vingeggard.
"Pogacar can't be on Jorgenson's climb times. That's a very bad time for him" . Jorgenson was better than remco and vingegaard in that portion of the TT

 

[Lorzenz08]

17-km TT is not about endurance, it's about above-threshold performance at a very high % of VO2max. Pogacar clearly missed submaximal wattage for some reason, his top form was not there.

Hopefully it is just a bad day