Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[scribers]

4 to 5 minutes in GC behind Jorg is too much, IMO. The reasoning is it put pogi on the attack in subsequent stages and vingo only has to stay in the draft.

Gaming out bonkers scenarios here.

 

[Peyroteo94]

I think, and hope, he has learned that lesson.

We never know with him. He is older now and seems wiser but...

 

[Peyroteo94]

4 to 5 minutes in GC behind Jorg is too much, IMO. The reasoning is it put pogi on the attack in subsequent stages and vingo only has to stay in the draft.

Gaming out bonkers scenarios here.

He can recover 10 minutes to Jorg if he wants.

 

[scribers]

I can’t accept that range. You’ll be the first in the race thread announcing it’s over for pogi. For the love of Pete don’t allow Jorg 10 minutes!

 

[Peyroteo94]

I can’t accept that range. You’ll be the first in the race thread announcing it’s over for pogi. For the love of Pete don’t allow Jorg 10 minutes!

No, I won't. I only fear Matteo in this stage because Pogacar can be stupid enough to go after him.
I don't have any doubt, Pogacar will be 4 mimutes ahead after the MTT.

 

[YavorD]

He can recover 10 minutes to Jorg if he wants.

I don't think it's about simple recovering time to Jorgenson.
If he needs to win time (on Visma) his tactics advantage is lost and he has to attack. Vingegaard can only follow and do 1 or 2 deadly attacks if he can.

 

[Peyroteo94]

I don't think it's about simple recovering time to Jorgenson.
If he needs to win time (on Visma) his tactics advantage is lost and he has to attack. Vingegaard can only follow and do 1 or 2 deadly attacks if he can.

Big if

 

[Cycling111]

Since when does Jorgenson have the ability to win the Tour?

The wheel to watch is Vingegaard. Jorgenson isn't Roglic. Jorgenson said he didn't see himself winning a Giro, but now all I read on social media and in the forum that Jorgenson could complicate the Tour tomorrow when he's always lost more than 1-2 minutes per mountain stage to Pogacar.

 

[YavorD]

Big if

That's true.
But you can't base your strategy on "Vingegaard can't follow Pog".

 

[Cycling111]

I'm more concerned about the condition of some of UAE riders.

Wellens looked really fatigued today. He had to do all the work for Politt and Soler.

Sivakov isn't looking good and has struggled in the high mountains all year. And Yates had a terrible Giro.

Narvaez should be helpful tomorrow because the climbs are short, but Adam should be better in the high mountains than he has been the rest of the year, or Pogacar won't be able to do any attacks with his team.

 

[QueenStagiaire]

Since when does Jorgenson have the ability to win the Tour?

The wheel to watch is Vingegaard. Jorgenson isn't Roglic. Jorgenson said he didn't see himself winning a Giro, but now all I read on social media and in the forum that Jorgenson could complicate the Tour tomorrow when he's always lost more than 1-2 minutes per mountain stage to Pogacar.

The problem I see is that it would force Pogačar to attack and if Vingegaard is at Pogačar‘s level that might give Vingegaard a decisive edge. Of course if Vingegaard doesn‘t have it, there are no issues anyway.

 

[Cycling111]

I don't think it's about simple recovering time to Jorgenson.
If he needs to win time (on Visma) his tactics advantage is lost and he has to attack. Vingegaard can only follow and do 1 or 2 deadly attacks if he can.

Are we talking about the same Jorgenson who finished more than half an hour behind in last year's Tour, or the one who couldn't even keep up with Remco in Dauphiné?

Jorgenson shouldn't even keep up with Remco in the mountains.

Pogacar won't have to attack Jorgenson; Pogacar´s pace alone should droppe him before Pogacar makes a strong attack.

Unless Jorgenson has taken 10 steps forward since the Dauphiné.

 

[Miss Violet Smith]

I am the first to admit that Jorgensen lives rent-free in my head:
- Only 1:34 behind.
- Proven ability to rile up Tadej.
- Potential to be to Vingegaard what Vingegaard was to Roglič in 2022 after the hay bale debacle

Clearly need a calming evening ride to get a hold of myself.

 

[Peyroteo94]

I am the first to admit that Jorgensen lives rent-free in my head:
- Only 1:34 behind.
- Proven ability to rile up Tadej.
- Potential to be to Vingegaard what Vingegaard was to Roglič in 2022 after the hay bale debacle

Clearly need a calming evening ride to get a hold of myself.

ROFL. Not even a future GT podium finisher

 

[Cycling111]

I am the first to admit that Jorgensen lives rent-free in my head:
- Only 1:34 behind.
- Proven ability to rile up Tadej.
- Potential to be to Vingegaard what Vingegaard was to Roglič in 2022 after the hay bale debacle

Clearly need a calming evening ride to get a hold of myself.

Vingegaard was second in 2021, far behind Pogacar, but Jorgenson was eighth in 2024, far behind Mikel Landa.
And in Dauphiné, Vingegaard let Roglic beat him. Jogenson didn't even have the capacity to finish fifth.

Since when is Jorgenson a climber who doesn't lose 2 minutes on each high finish to Pogacar?

 

[Valv.Piti]

I am the first to admit that Jorgensen lives rent-free in my head:
- Only 1:34 behind.
- Proven ability to rile up Tadej.
- Potential to be to Vingegaard what Vingegaard was to Roglič in 2022 after the hay bale debacle

Clearly need a calming evening ride to get a hold of myself.

Same, but have to believe that a) Pogacar is a lot smarter now and b) he is miles better than Jorgenson anyways, so it wont be a problem.

 

[YavorD]

Are we talking about the same Jorgenson who finished more than half an hour behind in last year's Tour, or the one who couldn't even keep up with Remco in Dauphiné?

Jorgenson shouldn't even keep up with Remco in the mountains.

Pogacar won't have to attack Jorgenson; Pogacar´s pace alone should droppe him before Pogacar makes a strong attack.

Unless Jorgenson has taken 10 steps forward since the Dauphiné.

Well, if Vingegaard is good enough to follow Pogacar he can't simply rely on pace to distance Jorgenson.
Yes, he can distance him and Vingegaard will chill behind. That's why you don't give time to Jorgenson.

 

[Cycling111]

ROFL. Not even a future GT podium finisher

He couldn't even keep up with Remco in the Dauphiné, even though Remco didn't have his best performance. Last year, he was beaten by Landa, Remco's domestique, in every stage.

I don't understand this psychosis with Jorgenson. Perhaps it's because influencers working for Visma are spreading this idea on Twitter.

If Jorgenson gains time in a breakaway tomorrow, Pogacar doesn't even have to attack him. With simple pace before the attack, Jorgenson will dropped like he did in Dauphiné. And as soon as Pogacar attacks, he'll open a two-minute gap on high-mountains.

 

[Peyroteo94]

He couldn't even keep up with Remco in the Dauphiné, even though Remco didn't have his best performance. Last year, he was beaten by Landa, Remco's domestique, in every stage.

I don't understand this psychosis with Jorgenson. Perhaps it's because influencers working for Visma are spreading this idea on Twitter.

If Jorgenson gains time in a breakaway tomorrow, Pogacar doesn't even have to attack him. With simple pace before the attack, Jorgenson will dropped like he did in Dauphiné. And as soon as Pogacar attacks, he'll open a two-minute gap on high-mountains.

I'm not worried about Matteo. I'm worried about Pogacar's excessive confidence and he responds to him just to show who is the boss.

 

[rafa92]

He couldn't even keep up with Remco in the Dauphiné, even though Remco didn't have his best performance. Last year, he was beaten by Landa, Remco's domestique, in every stage.

I don't understand this psychosis with Jorgenson. Perhaps it's because influencers working for Visma are spreading this idea on Twitter.

If Jorgenson gains time in a breakaway tomorrow, Pogacar doesn't even have to attack him. With simple pace before the attack, Jorgenson will dropped like he did in Dauphiné. And as soon as Pogacar attacks, he'll open a two-minute gap on high-mountains.

to me if jorgenson takes 2 minutes and the yellow jersey it would be ideal. It means pog can take it easy behind and have no podium commitments tomorrow and before the hautacam stage

 

[Cycling111]

to me if jorgenson takes 2 minutes and the yellow jersey it would be ideal. It means pog can take it easy behind and have no podium commitments tomorrow and before the hautacam stage

He could even give him more than 5. He'll lose more than 2 in each mountain stage, just like last year.
Last year he wasn't even at Landa's level. In Dauphiné not even at the level of a regular Remco.

 

[Peyroteo94]

to me if jorgenson takes 2 minutes and the yellow jersey it would be ideal. It means pog can take it easy behind and have no podium commitments tomorrow and before the hautacam stage

I would love to see Matteo gaining 2' on both Vingegaard and Pogacar. Pogacar would surpass him on Hautacam and then catch him in the MTT.

 

[rafa92]

He could even give him more than 5. He'll lose more than 2 in each mountain stage, just like last year.

true, let's see, loosing 2-3 minutes tomorrow to jorgenson and remain on the wheels would be good, I just hope he doesn't start covering attacks by himself with 100km to go

 

[Cycling111]

I would love to see Matteo gaining 2' on both Vingegaard and Pogacar. Pogacar would surpass him on Hautacam and then catch him in the MTT.

And maybe they create a fictitious conflict with Vingegaard's wife.
I say fictitious because Vingegaard recovers time from Jorgenson in only one or two high finishes.

He's far behind them in the high mountains.
Jorgenson has never demonstrated Roglic's climbing ability. And on the Granon day, it wasn't arrogance, it was respect for his rivals. Arrogance would have been letting Roglic go because he had fallen, and because he was sure he would easily beat him.

 

[rafa92]

I would love to see Matteo gaining 2' on both Vingegaard and Pogacar. Pogacar would surpass him on Hautacam and then catch him in the MTT.

yes but let's hope he doesn't start covering moves too far from the finish