Tadej Pogacar and Mauro Giannetti

[Nick2413]

That takes not that much energy and Pogacar just trained himself to farm the easy content consistently.

He's jsut TikTok Armstrong.

It just took a decade or so for the marketing department to figure out how to grease the squeaky wheel.

 

[CleanCiclismo]

well no, i was very aware of the weak field at this race. i just really dislike the direction that cycling is headed. it's become more about fanboying-out at single riders dominating than embracing actual competition. you saw it with Kuss at the Vuelta last year. to me that was really eye opening, to see the vast majority of fans actually wanting team orders rather than a race between the teammates. RCS fed this race to Pogacar on a platter; it was clear they just wanted "Pogacar doing Pogacar things" (i hate that phrase) rather than any kind of actual GC race. they paid the guy to show up and crap all over their race! it's insane to me. it's not very fun to watch.

Like it or not. Vegni knew what he was doing when he got Pogačar to show up. This Giro is doing record numbers among viewers. Example: LINK. Pog is the best thing that happened to Giro in a long while. Without him we would see a repeat of last year where nobody attacked and time trials decided the race. Tiberi was the only one who at least tried something. In 20 stages! G got a podium by doing nothing. Same for Martinez.

 

[GuntherL1]

Let me ask you a question....what performance you think was more impressive? The performance today of Pogacar, or the performance of Vingegaard on Tourmalet stage Vuelta 2023?( i'm not gonna even talk about performances in the Tour). Tell me what you think without knowing some data.

Like i said, the level of this Giro was low, and Pogacar did some good performances consistent with what he did in the past years, but i don’t think we saw something outrageous in this Giro.

Everybody is in the "mix", but i didn't saw nothing ridiculous on this Giro, even in W/kg.

Did Vingegaard crush everyone in nearly every stage in that Vuelta? I don't think so. It's not only the performance in a single stage, it's the near invulnerability in every single stage. However, this is not the topic on Vingegaard, so I don't feel the need to talk about him.

You can claim the level of this Giro was low, but we have the former winner of Basque country/Dauphiné and the number of last year's Giro on the podium and I think it's absurd that someone can beat these guys every single time and put two minutes on them during six km of climbing.

 

[GuntherL1]

The riders and teams will tell us if anything unfair is going on.

And it's not just one guy winning. While Pogi is dominant, so is Van der Poel. Likewise Vingegaard.

The more outrageous one of them is, the more leeway the rest have.

How is MvdP as dominant as Pogacar? He won the two races he was made for while most of his opposition was injured or recovering (WVA, Pedersen, Girmay, Stuyven, Laporte, De Lie, etc...)

 

[AmRacer]

How is MvdP as dominant as Pogacar? He won the two races he was made for while most of his opposition was injured or recovering (WVA, Pedersen, Girmay, Stuyven, Laporte, De Lie, etc...)

Only Poggi is a worthy opponent of Mathieu. And Jonas is the only worthy opponent of Poggi regarding GT's

 

[Samu Cuenca]

I'm gen z + 30 years

topcat is genraint thomaz confirmed

 

[topcat]

topcat is genraint thomaz confirmed

I attack a lot more than G but I'm like him in the sense that I ignore attacks and just do my own thing.

 

[Cookster15]

Did Vingegaard crush everyone in nearly every stage in that Vuelta? I don't think so. It's not only the performance in a single stage, it's the near invulnerability in every single stage. However, this is not the topic on Vingegaard, so I don't feel the need to talk about him.

The Vuelta isn’t a valid comparison. Vingegaard rode the Vuelta after he had crushed Pogacar by 7 minutes at the Tour. He also rode to team orders to help reward Kuss for his efforts in the Giro and TdF. Many think Vingegaard could have won the Vuelta. Pogacar started this Giro fresh and primed - not with a grand tour already in his legs and it showed.

 

[Froome]

Did Vingegaard crush everyone in nearly every stage in that Vuelta? I don't think so. It's not only the performance in a single stage, it's the near invulnerability in every single stage. However, this is not the topic on Vingegaard, so I don't feel the need to talk about him.

You can claim the level of this Giro was low, but we have the former winner of Basque country/Dauphiné and the number of last year's Giro on the podium and I think it's absurd that someone can beat these guys every single time and put two minutes on them during six km of climbing.

That's the point, things didn't appeared outrageous on some stages of the Vuelta, like yesterday, because of the weak competition.

If Kuss and Roglic were yesterday on Monte Grappa, you wouldn't think the perfomance of Pogacar was that unbeliavable( even if he probably beat kuss and roglic).

 

[SHAD0W93]

That's the point, things didn't appeared outrageous on some stages of the Vuelta, like yesterday, because of the weak competition.

If Kuss and Roglic were yesterday on Monte Grappa, you wouldn't think the perfomance of Pogacar was that unbeliavable( even if he probably beat kuss and roglic).

Kuss is most likely getting wrecked like everyone else.

 

[Rob5091]

Maybe something like that, or something like this, illegal but almost impossible to detect.

Tour de France rider tried to obtain marine worm haemoglobin for blood doping boost

'This is a product to look for in competition' French AFLD tells l'Equipe of super haemoglobin

www.cyclingnews.com

2018 - and still nothing on thyroid medication that George Bennett talks about, and journalists were told about last year -
https://www.cyclist.co.uk/news/grey-area-medications-are-an-issue-in-pro-cycling-says-bennett

... thyroid medication is not really being talked about in cycling the way it is in other sports. It can help you lose weight without losing power, but it can leave you in a bad way afterwards.’

Thyroid medications such as levothyroxine are not on the WADA prohibited list but have been much debated across sport.

 

[AmRacer]

That's the point, things didn't appeared outrageous on some stages of the Vuelta, like yesterday, because of the weak competition.

If Kuss and Roglic were yesterday on Monte Grappa, you wouldn't think the perfomance of Pogacar was that unbeliavable( even if he probably beat kuss and roglic).

If Jonas was there with peak shape, Pog and Jonas would've raced first time up Grappa already. With unbelievable ridiculous numbers.

 

[Red Rick]

If Jonas was there with peak shape, Pog and Jonas would've raced first time up Grappa already. With unbelievable ridiculous numbers.

Nah, Pogacar and Vingegaard only get more passive when they race each other.

 

[Blobs]

You tell me? Were you here during the 2022 TdF? Polls of posters saying it was one of the most entertaining Tours.

Well the big difference was that in that race the overwhelming favorite was actually beaten and the race wasn't over until stage 18 as opposed to before it even began, as was the case with this giro. No comparison really.

 

[Rou]

That's the point, things didn't appeared outrageous on some stages of the Vuelta, like yesterday, because of the weak competition.

If Kuss and Roglic were yesterday on Monte Grappa, you wouldn't think the perfomance of Pogacar was that unbeliavable( even if he probably beat kuss and roglic).

What are you talking about, man? Kuss?! Really? He would be wrecked the same way Dani was. You can't keep repeating the same slogan 'the competition was too weak' over and over again. In Catalunya Pog wrecked different riders the same way. Rogla and Remco would be crushed in this Giro. I am 100 % sure that peak Jonas would stay with Pog but would lose this Giro with 1 min 30secs to 2 mins because of the TTs and time bonuses.

 

[Froome]

Nah, Pogacar and Vingegaard only get more passive when they race each other.

They were only passive in the last 2 km of Joux plane.

Kuss is most likely getting wrecked like everyone else.

Of course he would get beaten by Pogacar, but he would be 2nd in this Giro with a good margin(in the Vuelta shape).

 

[SHAD0W93]

They were only passive in the last 2 km of Joux plane.

Of course he would get beaten by Pogacar, but he would be 2nd in this Giro with a good margin(in the Vuelta shape).

Are they going to gift him 3 plus mins again?

 

[Froome]

Are they going to gift him 3 plus mins again?

Of course he won because Roglic and Vingegaard let him win, but let's not act like he wasn't climbing at very good level on Tourmalet or Angliru. It's even an insult comparing the climbing level of farmers like rubio, martinez, or Tiberi to the best climbing level of Kuss. We are talking about the best super domestique in the world, who can climb at elite level when he is good.

 

[Netserk]

Are they going to gift him 3 plus mins again?

After that he still outclimbed Ayuso, Landa and Mas. He was the 3rd best rider.

 

[GuntherL1]

Only Poggi is a worthy opponent of Mathieu. And Jonas is the only worthy opponent of Poggi regarding GT's

You can't be serious. Like WVA or Pedersen aren't serious competitors. De Lie might be a competitor as well, but we can't judge that yet.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Of course he won because Roglic and Vingegaard let him win, but let's not act like he wasn't climbing at very good level on Tourmalet or Angliru. It's even an insult comparing the climbing level of farmers like rubio, martinez, or Tiberi to the best climbing level of Kuss. We are talking about the best super domestique in the world, who can climb at elite level when he is good.

The same Kuss that was 9 ‘14” behind Pogacar before his crash when he would still ride as well as possible to keep his GC chances up and was in front of the others from the breakaway and would have barely finished ahead or been behind if he had been sole leader at the Vuelta. Then add in 2 time trials that did not suit him. Or do you think if Kuss was hat the Giro and no Pogacar that he like Hindley could do what Pog did?

After that he still outclimbed Ayuso, Landa and Mas. He was the 3rd best rider.

And still would have barely finished in front of the three without the breakaway, now if we remove Vinge and Roglic from the race and have Kuss as the sole leader he has the chance of finishing behind them.

 

[AmRacer]

You can't be serious. Like WVA or Pedersen aren't serious competitors. De Lie might be a competitor as well, but we can't judge that yet.

Now you have narrowed down your previous list. Good. In some races Wout and Mads can challenge Mathieu, even beat him. But not in the biggest races Mathieu targets.

 

[ivanic]

scary how many supporters he has. there are very few haters and after yesterday's bottle... bingo move.

Are they Gen Z virgins or do people have short memories?

 

[GuntherL1]

Now you have narrowed down your previous list. Good. In some races Wout and Mads can challenge Mathieu, even beat him. But not in the biggest races Mathieu targets.

Do you watch cycling? MvdP won P-R this year thanks to excellent team mates. Last year he was lucky because of WVAs flat tire. He won Flanders twice in the sprint and this year most important competitors weren't there.
He's far from unbeatable.

 

[Froome]

The same Kuss that was 9 ‘14” behind Pogacar before his crash when he would still ride as well as possible to keep his GC chances up and was in front of the others from the breakaway and would have barely finished ahead or been behind if he had been sole leader at the Vuelta. Then add in 2 time trials that did not suit him. Or do you think if Kuss was hat the Giro and no Pogacar that he like Hindley could do what Pog did?


And still would have barely finished in front of the three without the breakaway, now if we remove Vinge and Roglic from the race and have Kuss as the sole leader he has the chance of finishing behind them.

But that's not my point. I was trying to say that if 2nd GT tiers like Hindley or Kuss were there, they would lose yesterday 1 min/1 min 15 s to Pogacar, and the perfomance of Pogacar wouldn't look outrageous like it appeared to be due to the gaps between Pogacar and those 3rd GT tiers.