Tadej Pogacar and Mauro Giannetti

[Cookster15]

Besides, even if tired, there wouldn't have been that much wrong with giving a long shot at this race anyway.

Perhaps. But this raises another question: Are doping controls at the Olympics stricter than other races? Or is it something about timing of his "program" after peaking for the Tour and risking detection?

 

[Stablo]

Maybe. But I think many would put that down to Pogacar being tired after the Tour? He did after all just complete the first Giro-Tour double in 26 years. Maybe it was suss but I think he earned the right to take a break?

The Olympics road race on August 3 was only 13 days after the Tour finished (at the Nice TT, also a maximum effort). Pogacar had also been on top form since March 2 (SB) and he also had one more realistic* big objective to recover for after the Tour - Lombardia.

*GdL was a more realistic objective as it allowed time to recover and then be ready for one last maximum performance.

Come on the dude doesn't drop form these days, the only cryptonite seems to be the TT-bike occasionally(Dauphine, WC etc.). He could have easily taken the olympics RR too and then would have had time to "rest" and then build form (like he even needs that lol) for another two months.

 

[Stablo]

Perhaps. But this raises another question: Are doping controls at the Olympics stricter than other races? Or is it something about timing of his "program" after peaking for the Tour and risking detection?

YES. You might be on to something here i think🙏🏼

 

[Stablo]

Like someone else mentioned here too, I find it hilarious and extremely suspicious, that after pog got critisized about the seated attacks in the media, he suddenly started getting out of the saddle more. Even though we had been explained, that in fact the seated attack is way more efficient and makes total sense. The whole pog-show is so laughable and unbeliavable these days, that I just don't get how do we even have to argue it with true "fans" of the sport.
Well like I said before, cause apparently the UCI is not going to do anything about it, I just have to hope others hop in the wagon too. Now it's normal doing a supercharged Pantani/Landis all the time, so maybe in a few years we have a new normal again. Doing 8+ W/kg for like 50 minutes and hey it's the gear and nutrition that has developed, nothing to see here.

 

[Ripper]

He raced the 2023 WC in a much worse state. Besides, even if tired, there wouldn't have been that much wrong with giving a long shot at this race anyway.

Yup, and the evidence has been that even when he is tired, he can still win a road race. He might have been wiped out. Or it might have been a convenient excuse, along with his significant other not going.

Here is something I find a bit interesting - technically, I have not heard that the Olympics are more strict with testing. But there does seem to be a lot more caution around the Olympics (across a number of sports) and I do wonder if the risks of getting popped are just that much bigger (or the risk of future retesting is that much bigger). Just a thought

 

[Rob5091]

Pogi just went to the gym. Close the clinic!
https://velo.outsideonline.com/road...ng-secret-of-pogacar-and-his-tour-domination/

Tadej Pogačar won his fourth Tour de France thanks to a bunch of resistance bands and a yoga mat.

 

[Cookster15]

Here is something I find a bit interesting - technically, I have not heard that the Olympics are more strict with testing. But there does seem to be a lot more caution around the Olympics (across a number of sports) and I do wonder if the risks of getting popped are just that much bigger (or the risk of future retesting is that much bigger). Just a thought

Excuse my laziness and ignorance (I guess I should know or could check?) but who is responsible for doping controls at the Olympics? Is this different from who handles the Tour?

Who takes the samples?
Which labs are used
Etc.

Is this different for the Olympics?

Or is him missing the Olympics more about so called “glow times” after the Tour (or a sudden big change in his blood markers since July)?

 

[Salvarani]

Pogi just went to the gym. Close the clinic!
https://velo.outsideonline.com/road...ng-secret-of-pogacar-and-his-tour-domination/

Core strength is very important.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Pogi just went to the gym. Close the clinic!
https://velo.outsideonline.com/road...ng-secret-of-pogacar-and-his-tour-domination/

There have been various theories (i.e. top doping program, electric motor) but this one definitely looks the most believable!

 

[Salvarani]

Excuse my laziness and ignorance (I guess I should know or could check?) but who is responsible for doping controls at the Olympics? Is this different from who handles the Tour?

Who takes the samples?
Which labs are used
Etc.

Is this different for the Olympics?

Or is him missing the Olympics more about so called “glow times” after the Tour (or a sudden big change in his blood markers since July)?

It just a conspiracy theory imo.

The simple explanation is he was tired after the Tour and the situation with his spouse tipped the scale for him to not go. He said he shutdown right after the Tour, I believe, last season.

Rather than avoiding it because of some grand scheme.

 

[Cookster15]

Okay, found the time to check. Looks like both the Tour and Olympics doping controls are overseen by the same people (ITA).

So I guess we are back to what @Salvarani said? Occum’s Razor?

 

[Divergence]

Yes indeed and I already said he imho considering all we know he certainly would not be, but I guess you have already forgotten. No one relevant is/was screaming murder, yeah right if you weren't following that time yet. How do you think he got caught after all? Landis, Hamilton etc. all irrelevant I guess. Fact is in that case as it is here with pog, that on a level playing field others would have been a lot closer or beaten him on severel occasions. The transformation after cancer fir Lance was nothing short of a miracle and poggies things are even higher on the scale of not beliavable.

Landis and Hamilton were both doing his program. They just were not good enough.

 

[DONCA]

At the Olympic Games and the Tour de France, different organizations are responsible for doping controls, even though they all operate under the same international rules — the World Anti-Doping Code (WADA Code).

Olympic Games​

• Doping controls are handled by the International Testing Agency (ITA).
• The ITA is an independent organization that conducts doping tests on behalf of the International Olympic Committee (IOC).

Tour de France​

• For the Tour de France, responsibility lies with the Union Cycliste Internationale (UCI) — the world governing body of cycling.
• The UCI also cooperates with the International Testing Agency (ITA). Since 2021, the ITA has been conducting doping controls on behalf of the UCI, including those during the Tour de France.

In short​

• Olympics: ITA → on behalf of the IOC
• Tour de France: ITA → on behalf of the UCI

So, the ITA is involved in both cases, but the governing bodies are different (IOC vs. UCI)

UCI + UAE = business partner = no problem as the UCI doesn´t want to lose his best asset (Pogi), the UAE Tour, World Tour teams and the venue for future World Championships (2028).

IOC = probably more strict

 

[cnort]

Landis and Hamilton were both doing his program. They just were not good enough.

From all I've read, Lance made sure he was on the A programme (in terms of content and support), and others were on the B programme. Also, they may well have been as physically talented or more so than Armstrong, but less responsive to doping. I guess we'll never know. He was certainly driven in an extreme way.

I think Armstrong highlights an uncomfortable truth that a sports champion has to be single-minded and ruthless in ways that can be quite unpleasant. It might not always be so overt or sociopathic, of course. Pogacar must also be ruthless, but his team knows to cultivate the image of a fun happy-go-lucky good egg. He was giving no gifts this year - he wants to win everything, which requires being ruthless.

 

[veganrob]

Can we sign a petition to bring Benotti and a few of the other legends back to the forum of love?

Dr Mas

 

[SorelyBoy]

Why are you replying to "I think Pogačar's performance is adequately explained by PEDs" with "you're so naïve to think Pogačar is clean"

Maybe it was your ‘Pogacar is the best cyclist ever’ line. I didn’t say you thought he was clean.

 

[SorelyBoy]

Yup, and the evidence has been that even when he is tired, he can still win a road race. He might have been wiped out. Or it might have been a convenient excuse, along with his significant other not going.

Here is something I find a bit interesting - technically, I have not heard that the Olympics are more strict with testing. But there does seem to be a lot more caution around the Olympics (across a number of sports) and I do wonder if the risks of getting popped are just that much bigger (or the risk of future retesting is that much bigger). Just a thought

It’s another signal amongst the noise. The oddities that don’t add up. This guy is such a cannibal, won’t let anyone else win anything if he can help it, yet he swerves the Olympics like it’s a dose of the clap? Not buying it. He’d kill to wear that gold medal unless he was advised he’d be running a greater risk of being caught. And I do think it was mainly a worry that there wouldn’t be as much control over how and if the equipment is checked as there usually is during UCI events.

 

[Shortcut]

Yup, and the evidence has been that even when he is tired, he can still win a road race. He might have been wiped out. Or it might have been a convenient excuse, along with his significant other not going.

Here is something I find a bit interesting - technically, I have not heard that the Olympics are more strict with testing. But there does seem to be a lot more caution around the Olympics (across a number of sports) and I do wonder if the risks of getting popped are just that much bigger (or the risk of future retesting is that much bigger). Just a thought

I don't get this argument since he already was great at olimpics (it is not like he is always skipping it). When he got bronze at OG Tokio he was not even in his prime. Also anybody who knows story about Zigart unfair treatment should praise Pogacar for not going. But it think this threat doesn't like facts.

 

[BubbaChuck]

pog couldnot train properly 2 months after glasgow,peopel think its easy just cause he does it,lmaoo.loze and glasgow were his true best performances in endurance sport.

 

[DONCA]

Critical voices are growing louder on the internet that Pog has no bad days, and suddenly a statement like this comes out. UAE is really working hard on the PR front.

https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/i-started-to-have-doubts-about-continuing-tadej-pogacar-reveals-that-a-knee-injury-almost-ruined-his-tour-de-france/

Just a few days ago, critical voices were saying that the story about the coach (San Millan) was only serving to distract attention from the main issue (doping).

Coincidence?

UAE PR Team is working day and night. Deleting critical voices on social media, reacting to critics with highly improbable statements.

 

[ontheroad]

Pogi just went to the gym. Close the clinic!
https://velo.outsideonline.com/road...ng-secret-of-pogacar-and-his-tour-domination/

Swart giving away Pogs secret and now every cyclist in the peloton will be hitting the gym over the winter and churning out the sit ups and crunches. Lots of riders will have 8 packs next year which will help facilitate those insane seated accelarations. Not sure why Swart decided to share it with everyone else though.

 

[peterfin]

At the Olympic Games and the Tour de France, different organizations are responsible for doping controls, even though they all operate under the same international rules — the World Anti-Doping Code (WADA Code).

Olympic Games​

• Doping controls are handled by the International Testing Agency (ITA).
• The ITA is an independent organization that conducts doping tests on behalf of the International Olympic Committee (IOC).

Tour de France​

• For the Tour de France, responsibility lies with the Union Cycliste Internationale (UCI) — the world governing body of cycling.
• The UCI also cooperates with the International Testing Agency (ITA). Since 2021, the ITA has been conducting doping controls on behalf of the UCI, including those during the Tour de France.

In short​

• Olympics: ITA → on behalf of the IOC
• Tour de France: ITA → on behalf of the UCI

So, the ITA is involved in both cases, but the governing bodies are different (IOC vs. UCI)

UCI + UAE = business partner = no problem as the UCI doesn´t want to lose his best asset (Pogi), the UAE Tour, World Tour teams and the venue for future World Championships (2028).

IOC = probably more strict

An answer from Gemini 2.5 that gives more nuance. I didn't check the details so there might be errors:

---
In-Depth Look at the Differences:

Governance and Sanctions: While the ITA conducts the tests for both, the body that manages the results and imposes sanctions differs. For the Tour de France, this responsibility lies with the UCI. At the Summer Olympics, to ensure independence and a streamlined process during the short period of the Games, the IOC has delegated the hearing of doping cases to the CAS Ad Hoc Division. This means that athletes at the Olympics have their cases heard and ruled upon by a specialized court on-site.

Testing Strategy and Scope: The Tour de France's anti-doping strategy is highly focused on the specific demands of endurance cycling. The heavy emphasis on pre-competition testing is a direct response to the historical prevalence of doping in the sport, aiming to ensure riders start the race clean. The daily, predictable testing of the race leader is a unique feature of the Tour.
In contrast, the Summer Olympics presents a far more complex logistical challenge, with thousands of athletes from hundreds of countries competing in a wide array of sports. The testing strategy is therefore broader, with a significant pre-Games testing effort across multiple sports and a wide net cast during the Games to ensure a level playing field across all disciplines.

Technological Innovations: The introduction of Dried Blood Spot (DBS) testing at the Olympics marks a significant advancement in anti-doping. This method is less invasive than traditional venous blood draws and simplifies the transportation and storage of samples. While the UCI and ITA are constantly evolving their methods, the prominent use of DBS has been a feature of recent Olympic Games.

In conclusion, while the fight against doping in both the Tour de France and the Summer Olympics is guided by the same international standards, the operational and strategic nuances reflect the unique characteristics of a three-week-long single-sport endurance event versus a multi-sport global spectacle. The governance structure for sanctions, the specific focus of testing strategies, and the adoption of new technologies are the primary areas where these two iconic sporting events diverge in their approach to ensuring clean competition.
---

So there are differences in who controls and sanctions the test results, differences in when tests are performed (less predictable for olympics) and the olympics seems to adopt the more advanced tech more rapidly.

If you take already measured risks by using doping in UCI controlled sports events, you better stay away from the olympics. So, in my opinion, the uncertainty is the main reason Pogacar did not go to the olympics.

 

[Divergence]

From all I've read, Lance made sure he was on the A programme (in terms of content and support), and others were on the B programme. Also, they may well have been as physically talented or more so than Armstrong, but less responsive to doping. I guess we'll never know. He was certainly driven in an extreme way.

I think Armstrong highlights an uncomfortable truth that a sports champion has to be single-minded and ruthless in ways that can be quite unpleasant. It might not always be so overt or sociopathic, of course. Pogacar must also be ruthless, but his team knows to cultivate the image of a fun happy-go-lucky good egg. He was giving no gifts this year - he wants to win everything, which requires being ruthless.

Sure he was targeting the TdF and he made sure to be best prepared for it, but I do not think he wanted his teammates to be anything less than the best they can be. It was established within the team that he was the best.
Regarding Pog, yes I think he is pretty ruthless and rightfully so. As far as I know he is not a borderline psychopath like Lance, but he can be pretty vindictive. When I do not like him is when he tries to portray himself as a naive boy who is friendly with everybody.