Team Ineos Discussion thread

[oldcrank]

Re: Team Sky Discussion thread

It's beautiful to see SKY are staying close to their roots
by signing two pursuiters, Narvaez and now Ganna.

New SKY signing Ganna looked good yesterday at the first Track World Cup of the
season at S-Q-e-Y, France. His Italian TP squad took bronze with a quick 3:53.153.

 

[Axel Hangleck]

Re:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/team-sky-vortex-speed-suit-now-illegal-under-latest-uci-regulations/

Skinsuits illegal now? No worries new one's legal and faster

Got to hand it to Sky and Castelli, they don't sit still on anything.

This is what sport is about; always evolving and improving techniques, equipment, etc
Stand still, and you'll go backwards.

Road cycling is one of, if not the most conservative sports around - and I include the UCI in that.

 

[Angliru]

Re: Re:

Too much fuss is made of Sky - Yes they dominate the TDF, had some success in the Giro and the Vuelta and are hard to beat in hillier one week stage races - But they are middle of the road in the classics part of the calendar and have no sprinters of note - I'd argue that Quick Step are more dominant in classics/one day races than Sky are in GT's and one week stage races.

The fact Quickstep just beat their annual victory record can attest to that.

Quickstep and Sky aren't even remotely comparable in how bad they are for the entertainment value of the sport.

No they aren't. Most of Quick Step's wins are from sprints. Viviani, Gaviria, Jacobsen, Hodeg - even Alaphilippe's to an extent.

Sky on the other hand don't have sprinters, so they attack on climbs. Froome - Giro stage 19. A career defining performance. Thomas being the first to win on Alpe d'Huez in yellow. Bernal attacking throughout the year. Moscon in the late season.


Some of you need to get rid of this Sky stereotype you have wrapped yourself in and embrace reality. This includes the UCI President. To quote from a recent Velonews article

“Today everything is measured to a millimeter,” UCI president David Lappartient said. “How many people are really captivated? In [soccer], you have these extraordinary comebacks, but we do not have that much on the Tour de France.”

When was last time there was a genuine Tour de France comeback (excluding TTs)? 2006? Best ignore that one. Else we're going back to the 80s.
If he wanted a comeback he should have watched this year's Giro. Courtesy of Team Boring.

Years of dominance and absolute control of the sports biggest event is only good for the team doing the dominating and its fans. It is not good for the sport.

 

[Tim Booth]

Re: Re:

Years of dominance and absolute control of the sports biggest event is only good for the team doing the dominating and its fans. It is not good for the sport.

Le Monde put it this way: “Cycling has become mathematics, and Sky is best at adding up the numbers. And it’s terrible.”
so, is the Tour de France in trouble?
https://www.velonews.com/2018/10/from-the-mag/is-the-tour-de-france-in-trouble_480286
answers welcome from cycling fans (and Team SKY fans)

 

[kingjr]

I don't mind dominance in sports one bit. And even if the race is boring as a result, I'd never ask for changes aimed specifically at reducing the gap to one outstanding athlete or team.

 

[Singer01]

Re:

I don't mind dominance in sports one bit. And even if the race is boring as a result, I'd never ask for changes aimed specifically at reducing the gap to one outstanding athlete or team.

Yep, if Nibali was dominant there is no way his fans would be 'This is bad for the sport', it would be 'everyone else needs to catch up'. The problem is cycling fans are occasionally whiny babies.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

I don't mind dominance in sports one bit. And even if the race is boring as a result, I'd never ask for changes aimed specifically at reducing the gap to one outstanding athlete or team.

Yep, if Nibali was dominant there is no way his fans would be 'This is bad for the sport', it would be 'everyone else needs to catch up'. The problem is cycling fans are occasionally whiny babies.

Yeah ofcourse you kniw exactly what other people would think in a hypothetical situation

 

[DNP-Old]

Re: Re:

I don't mind dominance in sports one bit. And even if the race is boring as a result, I'd never ask for changes aimed specifically at reducing the gap to one outstanding athlete or team.

Yep, if Nibali was dominant there is no way his fans would be 'This is bad for the sport', it would be 'everyone else needs to catch up'. The problem is cycling fans are occasionally whiny babies.

Indeed. Complain, complain, complain. Go watch something else then. You know what you'll get before a race even started, so why bother?

 

[Singer01]

Re: Re:

I don't mind dominance in sports one bit. And even if the race is boring as a result, I'd never ask for changes aimed specifically at reducing the gap to one outstanding athlete or team.

Yep, if Nibali was dominant there is no way his fans would be 'This is bad for the sport', it would be 'everyone else needs to catch up'. The problem is cycling fans are occasionally whiny babies.

Yeah ofcourse you kniw exactly what other people would think in a hypothetical situation

If I can't know that they would behave like that, then you can't know that they wouldn't. Seeing how parochial a great many people on this board are though, I'm pretty sure I'm right and you're wrong.

 

[topcat]

A lot of Nibali's fans cheer for him in part because he is the under dog. If he became utterly dominant we'd cheer for some other under dog. Sport is competition and we need competition where the outcome is not utterly predictable.

 

[Hayabusa]

Team Sky in itself isn't a problem for Cycling, as I feel like Cycling as a whole would be in a much better state if there were bigger sponsors getting involved.

Speaking as a Sky fan however, the imbalance is a problem. When one team dominates, the sport does get boring. It's the same in the Classics with Quickstep who have a plethora of talent that does take some element of excitement away from the races.

You can't blame Sky for the imbalance, but close races make for entertainment and more fans.

 

[Akuryo]

Re:

Team Sky in itself isn't a problem for Cycling, as I feel like Cycling as a whole would be in a much better state if there were bigger sponsors getting involved.

Speaking as a Sky fan however, the imbalance is a problem. When one team dominates, the sport does get boring. It's the same in the Classics with Quickstep who have a plethora of talent that does take some element of excitement away from the races.

You can't blame Sky for the imbalance, but close races make for entertainment and more fans.

But other than Sky, Quickstep cant hold their talents for long. Kwiatkowski, Cavendish, Kittel,Trentin, Schachmann, De Plus, Uran and Terpstra left all for more money elsewhere. When was the last good Sky rider that left for a better contract with another team?

 

[pastronef]

Re: Re:

Team Sky in itself isn't a problem for Cycling, as I feel like Cycling as a whole would be in a much better state if there were bigger sponsors getting involved.

Speaking as a Sky fan however, the imbalance is a problem. When one team dominates, the sport does get boring. It's the same in the Classics with Quickstep who have a plethora of talent that does take some element of excitement away from the races.

You can't blame Sky for the imbalance, but close races make for entertainment and more fans.

But other than Sky, Quickstep cant hold their talents for long. Kwiatkowski, Cavendish, Kittel,Trentin, Schachmann, De Plus, Uran and Terpstra left all for more money elsewhere. When was the last good Sky rider that left for a better contract with another team?

Cav and Viviani

Gerrans was average and he went very good at Orica

 

[SHAD0W93]

Uran, Rogers, Landa, debatable EBH.

 

[Angliru]

Re: Re:

Team Sky in itself isn't a problem for Cycling, as I feel like Cycling as a whole would be in a much better state if there were bigger sponsors getting involved.

Speaking as a Sky fan however, the imbalance is a problem. When one team dominates, the sport does get boring. It's the same in the Classics with Quickstep who have a plethora of talent that does take some element of excitement away from the races.

You can't blame Sky for the imbalance, but close races make for entertainment and more fans.

But other than Sky, Quickstep cant hold their talents for long. Kwiatkowski, Cavendish, Kittel,Trentin, Schachmann, De Plus, Uran and Terpstra left all for more money elsewhere. When was the last good Sky rider that left for a better contract with another team?

Cav and Viviani

Gerrans was average and he went very good at Orica

Was that for better contract or because Sky chose to focus more on stage racing gc?

 

[Vasilis]

Porte, maybe Nieve, Henao this year, König, Van Poppel? Although Henao hasn't been so good recently.

 

[GuyIncognito]

Henao hasn't left yet.

 

[SHAD0W93]

I wouldn't count Konig as he hasn't done anything since leaving due to injury. Same with Van Poppel. I forgot Porte and Neive.
Cav left due to receiving zero support and Sky let him terminate his contract with no issue.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

Team Sky in itself isn't a problem for Cycling, as I feel like Cycling as a whole would be in a much better state if there were bigger sponsors getting involved.

Speaking as a Sky fan however, the imbalance is a problem. When one team dominates, the sport does get boring. It's the same in the Classics with Quickstep who have a plethora of talent that does take some element of excitement away from the races.

You can't blame Sky for the imbalance, but close races make for entertainment and more fans.

But other than Sky, Quickstep cant hold their talents for long. Kwiatkowski, Cavendish, Kittel,Trentin, Schachmann, De Plus, Uran and Terpstra left all for more money elsewhere. When was the last good Sky rider that left for a better contract with another team?

Cav and Viviani

Gerrans was average and he went very good at Orica

Was that for better contract or because Sky chose to focus more on stage racing gc?

Viviani was making more money at Sky. He just wasn't happy there. I remember something about not many opportunities which is why he went back to a larger focus on track while there.

 

[YavorD]

Well, I just want to ask one question.. Is there a rider that Sky really wanted to keep and they didn't (talking JUST about money reasons, necause I think some riders left Sky in pursue of their own chances)? Maybe Nieve but I think there were some personal reasons for him.

 

[Koronin]

Re:

Well, I just want to ask one question.. Is there a rider that Sky really wanted to keep and they didn't (talking JUST about money reasons, necause I think some riders left Sky in pursue of their own chances)? Maybe Nieve but I think there were some personal reasons for him.

My understanding of why Nieve left was he wanted a new/different challenge.

 

[Nirvana]

Re: Re:

Team Sky in itself isn't a problem for Cycling, as I feel like Cycling as a whole would be in a much better state if there were bigger sponsors getting involved.

Speaking as a Sky fan however, the imbalance is a problem. When one team dominates, the sport does get boring. It's the same in the Classics with Quickstep who have a plethora of talent that does take some element of excitement away from the races.

You can't blame Sky for the imbalance, but close races make for entertainment and more fans.

But other than Sky, Quickstep cant hold their talents for long. Kwiatkowski, Cavendish, Kittel,Trentin, Schachmann, De Plus, Uran and Terpstra left all for more money elsewhere. When was the last good Sky rider that left for a better contract with another team?

Cav and Viviani

Gerrans was average and he went very good at Orica

Was that for better contract or because Sky chose to focus more on stage racing gc?

Viviani was making more money at Sky. He just wasn't happy there. I remember something about not many opportunities which is why he went back to a larger focus on track while there.

Actually Viviani went to Sky because was the only team that allowed him to ride on the track how much he wanted, even if that hampered his results on the road, and they fully support him in that.

I don't think it's a coincidence that a rider with a focus on Tokyo like Ganna now has signed with them, at UAE weren't happy with him focusing on the track. But with him we should also take in account his long term aim to become also a weeklong stage racer, something that probably only Sky can accomplish.

 

[yaco]

Re: Re:

Well, I just want to ask one question.. Is there a rider that Sky really wanted to keep and they didn't (talking JUST about money reasons, necause I think some riders left Sky in pursue of their own chances)? Maybe Nieve but I think there were some personal reasons for him.

My understanding of why Nieve left was he wanted a new/different challenge.

Nieve was given a contract that Sky couldn't match.

 

[Pricey_sky]

Re: Re:

Well, I just want to ask one question.. Is there a rider that Sky really wanted to keep and they didn't (talking JUST about money reasons, necause I think some riders left Sky in pursue of their own chances)? Maybe Nieve but I think there were some personal reasons for him.

My understanding of why Nieve left was he wanted a new/different challenge.

Nieve was given a contract that Sky couldn't match.

Financially speaking, they could. But they decided they wouldn’t match it.

 

[Simurgh]

I just wondered, what has happened to Diego Rosa? (injuries, getting sick?) He was good when at Astana some years ago.