Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[King Boonen]

Do you mind telling me how you found that link? What process did you go through?

I googled "Brailsford Team Sky Within Five Years 2009".

 

[Ventoux Boar]

tbh, it just gets uglier and uglier, seeing how this was all stage-managed.


you can't make this up.

When I'm trying to work out someone's true intentions I go to their corporate PR department and ask them for a news release. These are genuinely objective, devoid of spin, and certainly not targeted at sports editors of mass circulation media.

Cases involving demonic conspirators sometimes need the the clarifying lens of 5 years' fearless, fair and balanced scrutiny. In the most serious cases it can be necessary to embed an investigative Jesus right up the death star to flush out the truth.

The clinic is at it's most naive, or disingenuous, when it takes press releases (and almost all journalism) out for a spin, declaring them some kind of marker for objective truth.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

I googled "Brailsford Team Sky Within Five Years 2009".

huh. Doesn't appear on the first page of links on the au version of google :-/

 

[King Boonen]

And yet they managed to win the Tour with two different riders within those five years, both riders far from being GC contenders at the time the goal was set

So you think BC were doping Wiggins while he was at Garmin? Or knew he was doping and was about to perform?

You guys have brought me round on Froome, I still have question marks about Wiggins though.

Managing to complete that aim with not one, but two riders two years before the five years ran out is dodgy as hell, though. Especially considering their starting point, which was beyond terrible. Britain hadn't had a rider capable of riding mountains since Robert Millar. Their best climber at the time the 5 year plan was put forward was Charles Wegelius.

If they put Geraint Thomas on the podium of the Tour it'll be beyond farcical.

I agree, one I can believe but the two is pushing it. I've been brought round on Froome, part of me wonders if it was desperation to continue what happened with Wiggins, but that doesn't marry up well with Froomes' early performances.

 

[Netserk]

According to JV, Wiggo spend more time with the BC set up in 2009 than with Garmin (paraphrasing).

 

[RownhamHill]

Apologies about the error in my earlier post - I had remembered all the hype about a British Tour winner being from the glitzy launch of the team in the back half of 2009, but obviously it was from pre-the tour. (Not sure that really changes the substance of the reply to Dear Wiggo's latest 'theory', but still. . .)

Also, as we're going back to old stories, I was looking the other day at some coverage from the 2010 tour when Thomas did a good prologue and was in the white jersey - I have some memory of him being quoted after the prologue as saying 'if I want to win this race these are the rides I'm going to have to do' or some such - and the reporter (think it was Fotheringham in the Guardian) commenting: 'it wasn't clear if he was talking about the prologue or the overall'. Anyway, I couldn't find that quote (might have misremembered it anyway), but I did find this:
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2010/jul/09/tour-de-france-team-sky

"It was always expected that Sky's much-talked-about "first British winner of the Tour within five years" would be Peter Kennaugh or Ben Swift, but we should know when the race leaves the Alps whether Thomas can join those candidates."

With the benefit of four year's hindsight, make of that what you will. . .

 

[Saint Unix]

Eric Boyer, who used to work for Cofidis, talked about a former Cofidis rider had dropped 6-7 kilograms and started winning stage races, supposedly with the help of AICAR and GW1516. Reeks of Wiggins. I think Wiggins was the prototype and that he got hold of the winning formula just as Team Sky was starting to happen. It's all a bit fishy, to be honest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MRvw1vSivM

6:20 into that video.

 

[sittingbison]

When I'm here trying to work out someone's true intentions I go to their corporate PR department and ask them for a news release. These are genuinely objective, devoid of spin, and certainly not targeted at sports editors of mass circulation media.

Cases involving demonic conspirators sometimes need the the clarifying lens of 5 years' fearless, fair and balanced scrutiny. In the most serious cases it can be necessary to embed an investigative Jesus right up the death star to flush out the truth.

The clinic is at it's most naive, or disingenuous, when it takes press releases (and almost all journalism) out for a spin, declaring them some kind of marker for objective truth.

As world machinations are lubricated with the good oil of "press releases and almost all journalism", I am left to believe this is a trolling statement. Enjoy your hols.

 

[Ventoux Boar]

..., but I did find this:
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2010/jul/09/tour-de-france-team-sky

"It was always expected that Sky's much-talked-about "first British winner of the Tour within five years" would be Peter Kennaugh or Ben Swift, but we should know when the race leaves the Alps whether Thomas can join those candidates."

With the benefit of four year's hindsight, make of that what you will. . .

The damning evidence in favour of Hitch's 'Inception' theory - most rider's don't fulfill their potential - trickles in by the torrent. Is this an increasing phenomenon, or are we just noticing because we're now looking for it?

Anyway. Well done Hitch.

 

[thehog]

Eric Boyer, who used to work for Cofidis, talked about a former Cofidis rider had dropped 6-7 kilograms and started winning stage races, supposedly with the help of AICAR and GW1516. Reeks of Wiggins. I think Wiggins was the prototype and that he got hold of the winning formula just as Team Sky was starting to happen. It's all a bit fishy, to be honest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MRvw1vSivM

6:20 into that video.

He did, yes.

http://www.trucs-astuces.info/video/2MRvw1vSivM/Aicar-GW1516-GW501516-Doping-English-subtitles-Franais-Espaol-Portugus.html

 

[sittingbison]

Listen up gentle(wo)men.

I will have no compunction about banning anyone on this thread for trolling, baiting or derailling. And that includes permabans if I even suspect an agenda.

You have been warned.

Cheers
Bison

Edit:
This is the 25k post service and tune up

 

[sniper]

whatever became of the Linda McCartney investigation?
small reminder:

The Times says that UK Anti Doping (UKAD) has opened an investigation into alleged doping at the former Linda McCartney Racing Team, which raced from 1998 until it collapsed in early 2001, managed by Sean Yates and whose riders included Max Sciandri and, very briefly, Bradley Wiggins. The newspaper says that the investigation was launched as a result of information provided by team founder Julian Clark, who has recently finished a jail term for fraud unrelated to the team.

eyewitness testimony from three individuals connected to the team who say that “doping was rife” within it

http://road.cc/content/news/71882-uk-anti-doping-reportedly-opens-investigation-linda-mccartney-racing-team

 

[King Boonen]

huh. Doesn't appear on the first page of links on the au version of google :-/

It was this that I googled:

team sky brailsford within five years 2009


Should be the third link in the list.

 

[King Boonen]

According to JV, Wiggo spend more time with the BC set up in 2009 than with Garmin (paraphrasing).

You're slowly bringing me round on this...

 

[Benotti69]

You're slowly bringing me round on this...

Did Wiggo spending more time with BC than Garmin mean that Wiggo was excluded from JV internal testing

 

[Digger]

The Boyer Cofidis went on the win stage races story is significant...

Interesting that Wiggins says he lost all that weight with Mitchell...yet Cound told me that she was the one who supervised Froome's weight loss.
Maybe she's a nutrition expert...along with her other numerous talents.

 

[sniper]

Eric Boyer, who used to work for Cofidis, talked about a former Cofidis rider had dropped 6-7 kilograms and started winning stage races, supposedly with the help of AICAR and GW1516. Reeks of Wiggins. I think Wiggins was the prototype and that he got hold of the winning formula just as Team Sky was starting to happen. It's all a bit fishy, to be honest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MRvw1vSivM

6:20 into that video.

slightly off topic: interesting how boyer also suggests that even losing as little a 6 to 7 kilos while increasing your poweroutput is hardly possible without doping.

 

[Digger]

Regarding Wiggins and Froome, it's nonsense and insulting to think these guys are the only ones who were careful about diet. All while not only maintaining power, but actually increasing it....a person doesn't even need to look too hard here, just use an ounce of common sense,

 

[Saint Unix]

The Boyer Cofidis went on the win stage races story is significant...

Interesting that Wiggins says he lost all that weight with Mitchell...yet Cound told me that she was the one who supervised Froome's weight loss.
Maybe she's a nutrition expert...along with her other numerous talents.

With AICAR and GW1516 and their supposed effects anyone can be a weight loss expert.

"Take this!"

Whooooosh!

"Thanks, honey!"

 

[sniper]

much of boyer's wiggins skepsis was discussed in the jv thread some time ago.
hrotha asked some questions about it.
if you look it up, you'll find jv replying that it is perfectly possible to loose 5-6 kg without loosing power, for instance because if you loose weight it only (or mostly) affects the inactive muscle groups (according to jv).

 

[Justinr]

slightly off topic: interesting how boyer also suggests that even losing as little a 6 to 7 kilos while increasing your poweroutput is hardly possible without doping.

Its interesting that he says that. I've managed to lose twice that in the past and increase my power at the same time.

 

[Saint Unix]

Its interesting that he says that. I've managed to lose twice that in the past and increase my power at the same time.

Are you a professional athlete with very low body fat?

If not, your point is invalid.

 

[King Boonen]

Its interesting that he says that. I've managed to lose twice that in the past and increase my power at the same time.

Yes, but are you an elite level cyclist?

 

[hrotha]

Its interesting that he says that. I've managed to lose twice that in the past and increase my power at the same time.

Were you in shape for pro cycling standards, though? What was your body fat % before losing those 12-14 kilos?

edit: ok, ok, I get it, I'm late.

 

[Justinr]

Were you in shape for pro cycling standards, though? What was your body fat % before losing those 12-14 kilos?

edit: ok, ok, I get it, I'm late.

My body fat % was < 10% afterwards