Re: Re:
On #2, I am not going to do even a quick Google search. But, while someone(s) may be trying this, longer-term use of Cortisone is correlated with serious tissue/muscle loss, bone demineralisation, reduced protein synthesis, etc. issues. At least it did last time I looked.
So, it is possible that someone or some team could be using cortisone OOC, but only possible with serious risks.
And (without doing a quick Google, or forum, search), as I recall AICAR supposedly offers weight loss without that serious risk that cortisone produces.
The obvious question (i.e. Occam's Razor): Are we sure they (whoever they are) aren't using AICAR while stating that they use cortisone?
That would make more sense, and would be consistent with past behavior (altitude tents, etc.) to hide what is really going on.
On interval training (and this is what the NB above was for):
If people "probably would have thought" that interval training wouldn't benefit a highly trained athlete, and increase power (i.e. over shorter duration), then they are idiots.
That is what interval training is all about, and always has been. <insert facepalm>
It doesn't mean, however, that an athlete employing interval training can somehow avoid or offset the deteriorating impacts of longer-term cortisone use such as would be required for any meaningful weight-loss program.
Dave.
(NB: Am trying to argue the point(s) in the post, and not the poster. If it appears otherwise, that is not the intent)TheSpud said:Really?to briefly summarize: you're all over the place.
The position put across was that Sky must be using illegal weight loss drugs (eg AICAR) since its not possible to lose weight without losing power. The one link thats posted is Eric Boyer - granted an experienced rider / manager - alluding to certain riders, and saying its not possible.
My position is that I dont think they are using AICAR for a number of reasons:
1. I believe they are a team that wants to race "clean" *
2. It is possible to lose weight and maintain power using cortisone. This, as we know, isnt banned OOC.
3. They are probably combining (2) with other things (Telmisartan, or similar).
* by "clean" I don't mean they haven't been chemically helped. They have always talked about pushing things to the limit / going right to wire / etc. - which means no banned substances / methods. That still leaves one hell of a grey area to work in. In the past that may have been Tramadol, Xenon, playing TUE rules to the max, who knows what else. Illegal - no, unethical - i would have thought so. Entirely consistent with Sutton's comments.
And just going back to (2) - page 60 in the CIRC report states this and that it has been used lately for a GT win with the approval of the team's management. Perhaps a team that wanted to push the limits within the rules? And also Tyler mentioned that by changing his training (under Cecco) to include more intervals he was able to increase his power, something people probably would have thought unlikely given the already highly trained state he was in. So power improvements possible by incredibly fit cyclists claimed by an experienced ex-rider. Weight loss without power loss possible using OOC cortisone claimed in an official report. All certainly as believable as Mr Boyer's claims.
So no, I dont think I am all over the place. In fact i have been completely consistent.
Anyway, of for a few days in the Alps now so you wont hear from me (wanted to let Hitch know).
On #2, I am not going to do even a quick Google search. But, while someone(s) may be trying this, longer-term use of Cortisone is correlated with serious tissue/muscle loss, bone demineralisation, reduced protein synthesis, etc. issues. At least it did last time I looked.
So, it is possible that someone or some team could be using cortisone OOC, but only possible with serious risks.
And (without doing a quick Google, or forum, search), as I recall AICAR supposedly offers weight loss without that serious risk that cortisone produces.
The obvious question (i.e. Occam's Razor): Are we sure they (whoever they are) aren't using AICAR while stating that they use cortisone?
That would make more sense, and would be consistent with past behavior (altitude tents, etc.) to hide what is really going on.
On interval training (and this is what the NB above was for):
If people "probably would have thought" that interval training wouldn't benefit a highly trained athlete, and increase power (i.e. over shorter duration), then they are idiots.
That is what interval training is all about, and always has been. <insert facepalm>
It doesn't mean, however, that an athlete employing interval training can somehow avoid or offset the deteriorating impacts of longer-term cortisone use such as would be required for any meaningful weight-loss program.
Dave.