Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

wtf is up with LRP? Can't find him on any startlists, absolute car crash of a season. Hopefully if he's called it already he can reboot in time for next year. I don't doubt that he was ill at some stages but looks a bit tap-on-the-shoulder-ish.

in my investigations, i think we can trace the baptising of LRP as LRP to fermie with this post. -respect fermie

you can add his entry to urban dictionary

The LRP thread here in the clinic was originally with 'Little' in the title. The op is from 2012.

but not the initials acronym of LRP.

I petitioned the mods to change the OP title from Little Richie Porte what do we know about him to Richie Port what do we know about him.

I then recently petitioned the mods to change it to LRP what do we know about him.

I think the OP title should now be just LRP

 

[Jimsnchz]

I'm wondering who at Sky had Pate shut down at #3. I've never followed his Twitter did I miss the Top 10 JTL excuses or the Top 10 reasons Henao was pulled last year? He may be "one of the handful" but his team employs many of the majority. That move could come back to bite him & Sky.

 

[Benotti69]

Re:

I'm wondering who at Sky had Pate shut down at #3. I've never followed his Twitter did I miss the Top 10 JTL excuses or the Top 10 reasons Henao was pulled last year? He may be "one of the handful" but his team employs many of the majority. That move could come back to bite him & Sky.

I bet JV rang Brailsford.

Pity Pate chickened out.

 

[pastronef]

Re: Sky

after a good search I found it. Nutella

https://instagram.com/p/53wKTrHczM/

 

[matter]

Re: Re:

Correct me if im wrong but i think sky's is à special geometrie which they have patented, other oval ones wont be as good as sky's

Oh come on, lame! This is so over the top trolling it's not funny. Just like sharktopus vs whalewolf.

Now they have also hired a supergenius mathematician with a target of inventing for them a new type of geometry™ for creating a unique oval ring for that last 1 extra Watt.

I know a white guy who can dunk like NBA players. When I asked how he trained for it he told me he came up with a new way to calculate gravity. He can't shoot or dribble though, but he's working on a new differential geometry of curves for his free throws right now. Maybe Sky should hire the guy.

 

[SkyTears]

many lols were given

 

[Brullnux]

Re:

many lols were given

Go pippo

In all seriousness, this means nothing. Riders rarely speak out about what they suspect. Just look at the USPS era.

 

[Lyon]

Of course they would eat ***, if it was Sky's ***, hoping that it was some good ***.

 

[blackcat]

Re:

many lols were given

italians conflate nutella and scatology

it has it antecedents in Berlusconi's "bunga bunga" parties. @RubyHeartbreaker, belly dancer or underage hookah. your choice. #hygeinenama

 

[Saint Unix]

Ah, yes. The old Italian classic of "What's in your protein drinks?" dressed in a slightly more vulgar outfit. Nothing more than peloton code language, and it basically means "You have good dope. What sort of dope is it? I want to get my hands on some of that dope so I can stuff my body with it."

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Re:

Ah, yes. The old Italian classic of "What's in your protein drinks?" dressed in a slightly more vulgar outfit. Nothing more than peloton code language, and it basically means "You have good dope. What sort of dope is it? I want to get my hands on some of that dope so I stuff my body with it."

I do not see how the passage can be interpreted any other way.

And when read in that light, it makes a lot of sense as to why the dubious performances are not called out. People can get away with anything, and getting away with anything leads to rewards that outweigh any risk of penalty, but also outweigh what you would receive clean.

The culture is broken.

Burn it down and start again.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Perhaps it is because athletes who are less gifted benefit more from doping (plausible) and that is the truth of the peloton now: inhabited by genetically inferior but dope repondingly superior riders.

Remove the dope and all the pointy end disappear.

 

[blackcat]

Re:

Remove the dope and all the pointy end disappear.

and ne'er a truer word uttered.

bring it down to 8 riders per team. Everyone clean. THEN, THEN we get proper racing. No teams could control it, no trains, no teams leading the mtn stages, lots more breakaways and breakaways with higher success. Lots of attacking ON CLIMBS.

but NATURAL and NORMAL riding when the road tilts up. But the riding will be relative to the competitor, and the rider side by side. It will not be Riis, Pantani, Armstrong, Froome type p/w, but it will still be impressive and entertaining, just sans dope

 

[Gung Ho Gun]

8 riders is already too much imo. 5 max for one-day races, 6 or 7 for GTs

 

[Lyon]

Modern sport is for the oportunists, the Horners of the world. Now this group has got the edge, now that. See athletes, coaches, doctors, helpers being recruited between groups. Italians on Italian teams winning the classics? Next year on French teams. Get in touch with Once's doctor, he knows something. What are you guys on?

What a boring mess.

 

[blackcat]

Re:

8 riders is already too much imo. 5 max for one-day races, 6 or 7 for GTs

not if they are clean.

and remember, sponsors wish to have the large billboard.

my assumption of an 8, is based on all that has gone before. The biggest change is the 8, when they are clean. And remember, cycling has got significantly more specialised since Hinault and LEmond, the talents and specialisation has been atomised

we had

grimpuers
puncheurs
classics cobbles
ardennes
chrono'ists
GC
sprinters

then different classifications of domestiques.
and the Tour de France wishes to showcase and market all the individual stars. If we have only 5 riders per team, it is preventing many teams from running multiple targets and having multiple riders with different capacities and specialisation, we will have very boring teams. It would be good to still see superteams like Sky and Mapei and ONCE and USPS and CSC run a multi-target strategy and riders like Hincapie given their disproportionately large head, and target particular objectives on stages and parcours that met their abilities

 

[42x16ss]

Re:

Perhaps it is because athletes who are less gifted benefit more from doping (plausible) and that is the truth of the peloton now: inhabited by genetically inferior but dope repondingly superior riders.

Remove the dope and all the pointy end disappear.

IMO the majority of the pros would still be pros, but the pecking order would be completely shuffled around. The guys at the top would be totally different.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Re: Re:

Perhaps it is because athletes who are less gifted benefit more from doping (plausible) and that is the truth of the peloton now: inhabited by genetically inferior but dope repondingly superior riders.

Remove the dope and all the pointy end disappear.

IMO the majority of the pros would still be pros, but the pecking order would be completely shuffled around. The guys at the top would be totally different.

Yes pretty much what I was thinking also.

The thing stopping the natural guys riding as doms from speaking out etc -- at a guess -- is the complete lack of support available for doing so, IMO. I mean. There's enough protection of the golden geese precedence to put paid to any thoughts that the system would be fixed properly from the inside. Even if you remove one high level rider, there's a bunch of others receiving equal amounts of protection to take their place.

 

[42x16ss]

Re: Re:

Perhaps it is because athletes who are less gifted benefit more from doping (plausible) and that is the truth of the peloton now: inhabited by genetically inferior but dope repondingly superior riders.

Remove the dope and all the pointy end disappear.

IMO the majority of the pros would still be pros, but the pecking order would be completely shuffled around. The guys at the top would be totally different.

Yes pretty much what I was thinking also.

The thing stopping the natural guys riding as doms from speaking out etc -- at a guess -- is the complete lack of support available for doing so, IMO. I mean. There's enough protection of the golden geese precedence to put paid to any thoughts that the system would be fixed properly from the inside. Even if you remove one high level rider, there's a bunch of others receiving equal amounts of protection to take their place.

Yep. Once you get to Pro Conti level and beyond, it's a small sport. Everyone who's been around for a while knows each other.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Sky

In the Chris Froome thread in the Pro Racing subforum, I saw a picture of Froome preparing for Rio 2016 in a "Peak Performance Chamber" by GlaxoSmithKline. In this chamber oxygen levels, humidity and temperature can be regulated. I also remember reading Team Sky's super performance on stage 10 of the TDF was explained away with the story that they had trained in a special chamber in which they mirrored the predicted conditions for that stage; this might have been the same chamber/machine. This made me think at the time and now that I see it again, I started wondering, do other teams have access to similar chambers? I remember reading a reply on the theguardian.com website, stating that Tinkoff-Saxo had tried to get their hands on the ketone drinks but you have to be besties with Oxford University to get them. I searched the comment section for that reply a while later but it appears it has been deleted just like all other replies questioning Team sky anyway my question: does anyone know if other teams have access to such chambers? And if they don't surely we have to wonder if this is what we want: multi-million dollar teams owned by huge companies with massive influence and many connections in their country of origin, leading to a massive technological and scientific advantage for these teams? It's not even just a matter of larger budgets: I understand a team with a bigger budget will have an advantage. But if one team can use methods other teams can't, no matter how much money those other teams are willing to spend.....?

 

[Billie]

Sven Nys trained in similar labs before the Bejing olympics in 2007. It was with Prof Hespel so the Bakala acadamy must have one aswell.

Hypoxie chamber is what it's called.

Here is an article about it (dutch):
http://mountainbike.be/nieuws/algem...test-hypoxiekamer-voor-olympische-spelen-2008

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

Sven Nys trained in similar labs before the Bejing olympics in 2007. It was with Prof Hespel so the Bakala acadamy must have one aswell.

Hypoxie chamber is what it's called.

Here is an article about it (dutch):
http://mountainbike.be/nieuws/algem...test-hypoxiekamer-voor-olympische-spelen-2008

Thanks for the info, I knew about hypoxia chambers but didn't know they also use it to regulate humidity and temperature

2nd point: as far as I'm aware, GSK is going to test Froome's physiology. From the info we have, it appears Sky have some sort of relationship with GSK. Would it not be better to let a completely impartial company test Froome?

 

[red_flanders]

Re: Sky

In the Chris Froome thread in the Pro Racing subforum, I saw a picture of Froome preparing for Rio 2016 in a "Peak Performance Chamber" by GlaxoSmithKline. In this chamber oxygen levels, humidity and temperature can be regulated. I also remember reading Team Sky's super performance on stage 10 of the TDF was explained away with the story that they had trained in a special chamber in which they mirrored the predicted conditions for that stage; this might have been the same chamber/machine. This made me think at the time and now that I see it again, I started wondering, do other teams have access to similar chambers? I remember reading a reply on the theguardian.com website, stating that Tinkoff-Saxo had tried to get their hands on the ketone drinks but you have to be besties with Oxford University to get them. I searched the comment section for that reply a while later but it appears it has been deleted just like all other replies questioning Team sky anyway my question: does anyone know if other teams have access to such chambers? And if they don't surely we have to wonder if this is what we want: multi-million dollar teams owned by huge companies with massive influence and many connections in their country of origin, leading to a massive technological and scientific advantage for these teams? It's not even just a matter of larger budgets: I understand a team with a bigger budget will have an advantage. But if one team can use methods other teams can't, no matter how much money those other teams are willing to spend.....?

In the 2000's, many cyclists claimed to be using altitude tents. Turned they weren't, and were simply using them as an EPO smokescreen. Because real evidence of the performance benefits of such devices is scarce and hotly debated, it should not surprise anyone if this turns out to be the same exact tactic, re-hashed by Sky and sold as innovation.

Rather than some magical chamber we don't know works, again the simplest, (relatively) less expensive, time-honored and most likely scenario is oxygen vector doping.

 

[heart_attack_man]

Re: Re:

From the info we have, it appears Sky have some sort of relationship with GSK. Would it not be better to let a completely impartial company test Froome?

Flo - are you able to expand on this some more? What info do you know about Sky's relationship with GSK? Genuine question.

Thanks.

 

[infeXio]

Re: Sky

In the Chris Froome thread in the Pro Racing subforum, I saw a picture of Froome preparing for Rio 2016 in a "Peak Performance Chamber" by GlaxoSmithKline. In this chamber oxygen levels, humidity and temperature can be regulated. I also remember reading Team Sky's super performance on stage 10 of the TDF was explained away with the story that they had trained in a special chamber in which they mirrored the predicted conditions for that stage; this might have been the same chamber/machine. This made me think at the time and now that I see it again, I started wondering, do other teams have access to similar chambers? I remember reading a reply on the theguardian.com website, stating that Tinkoff-Saxo had tried to get their hands on the ketone drinks but you have to be besties with Oxford University to get them. I searched the comment section for that reply a while later but it appears it has been deleted just like all other replies questioning Team sky anyway my question: does anyone know if other teams have access to such chambers? And if they don't surely we have to wonder if this is what we want: multi-million dollar teams owned by huge companies with massive influence and many connections in their country of origin, leading to a massive technological and scientific advantage for these teams? It's not even just a matter of larger budgets: I understand a team with a bigger budget will have an advantage. But if one team can use methods other teams can't, no matter how much money those other teams are willing to spend.....?

Veloropa posted this during the Tour, though I can't seem to find it on Valgren's twitter feed now.
Alexander Kamp asks if Tinkoff-Saxo are using the Ketone-thingy, to which Valgren replies that they've explored the possibility but it's seemingly impossible unless you have a relationship with Oxford University