Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[heart_attack_man]

Re: Re:

From the info we have, it appears Sky have some sort of relationship with GSK. Would it not be better to let a completely impartial company test Froome?

Flo - are you able to expand on this some more? What info do you know about Sky's relationship with GSK? Genuine question.

Thanks.

 

[infeXio]

Re: Sky

In the Chris Froome thread in the Pro Racing subforum, I saw a picture of Froome preparing for Rio 2016 in a "Peak Performance Chamber" by GlaxoSmithKline. In this chamber oxygen levels, humidity and temperature can be regulated. I also remember reading Team Sky's super performance on stage 10 of the TDF was explained away with the story that they had trained in a special chamber in which they mirrored the predicted conditions for that stage; this might have been the same chamber/machine. This made me think at the time and now that I see it again, I started wondering, do other teams have access to similar chambers? I remember reading a reply on the theguardian.com website, stating that Tinkoff-Saxo had tried to get their hands on the ketone drinks but you have to be besties with Oxford University to get them. I searched the comment section for that reply a while later but it appears it has been deleted just like all other replies questioning Team sky anyway my question: does anyone know if other teams have access to such chambers? And if they don't surely we have to wonder if this is what we want: multi-million dollar teams owned by huge companies with massive influence and many connections in their country of origin, leading to a massive technological and scientific advantage for these teams? It's not even just a matter of larger budgets: I understand a team with a bigger budget will have an advantage. But if one team can use methods other teams can't, no matter how much money those other teams are willing to spend.....?

Veloropa posted this during the Tour, though I can't seem to find it on Valgren's twitter feed now.
Alexander Kamp asks if Tinkoff-Saxo are using the Ketone-thingy, to which Valgren replies that they've explored the possibility but it's seemingly impossible unless you have a relationship with Oxford University

 

[Dear Wiggo]

SO we have :

Oxford uni supplying ketones to Sky
Sheffiled uni processing Henao's blood value research data

 

[Catwhoorg]

Re: Re:

SO we have :

Oxford uni supplying ketones to Sky
Sheffiled uni processing Henao's blood value research data

That's Sheffield.

So what's the difference between these ketone drinks and the ones you can buy on Amazon or stores selling dieting products ?

About 1000 quid per bidon ?

 

[adamfo]

Re: Re:

SO we have :

Oxford uni supplying ketones to Sky
Sheffiled uni processing Henao's blood value research data

That's Sheffield.

So what's the difference between these ketone drinks and the ones you can buy on Amazon or stores selling dieting products ?

About 1000 quid per bidon ?

I think you're having your leg pulled.

 

[Catwhoorg]

Or maybe I was making a joke based around Sky overpaying for a whole lot of stuff.

 

[adamfo]

Froome said he had to google the word ketone and had never taken it.

 

[King Boonen]

Re:

Froome said he had to google the word ketone and had never taken it.

He clearly doesn't know what a ketone is then...

 

[Lyon]

Sky's ketones go to 11.

 

[blackcat]

Re: Sky

In the Chris Froome thread in the Pro Racing subforum, I saw a picture of Froome preparing for Rio 2016 in a "Peak Performance Chamber" by GlaxoSmithKline. In this chamber oxygen levels, humidity and temperature can be regulated. I also remember reading Team Sky's super performance on stage 10 of the TDF was explained away with the story that they had trained in a special chamber in which they mirrored the predicted conditions for that stage; this might have been the same chamber/machine. This made me think at the time and now that I see it again, I started wondering, do other teams have access to similar chambers? I remember reading a reply on the theguardian.com website, stating that Tinkoff-Saxo had tried to get their hands on the ketone drinks but you have to be besties with Oxford University to get them. I searched the comment section for that reply a while later but it appears it has been deleted just like all other replies questioning Team sky anyway my question: does anyone know if other teams have access to such chambers? And if they don't surely we have to wonder if this is what we want: multi-million dollar teams owned by huge companies with massive influence and many connections in their country of origin, leading to a massive technological and scientific advantage for these teams? It's not even just a matter of larger budgets: I understand a team with a bigger budget will have an advantage. But if one team can use methods other teams can't, no matter how much money those other teams are willing to spend.....?

In the 2000's, many cyclists claimed to be using altitude tents. Turned they weren't, and were simply using them as an EPO smokescreen. Because real evidence of the performance benefits of such devices is scarce and hotly debated, it should not surprise anyone if this turns out to be the same exact tactic, re-hashed by Sky and sold as innovation.

Rather than some magical chamber we don't know works, again the simplest, (relatively) less expensive, time-honored and most likely scenario is oxygen vector doping.

that, why would a team invest 1000 units of resources in Oxford when they could invest 1 unit in Freiburg with one unit of blood?

 

[Cycle Chic]

Nicholas Roche morphing into Geraint Thomas now - just gets funnier every race. Roche with the climbers up til the last 1km....ahead of Pozzovivo !!

 

[Bernie's eyesore]

Re:

Nicholas Roche morphing into Geraint Thomas now - just gets funnier every race. Roche with the climbers up til the last 1km....ahead of Pozzovivo !!

Is this the same guy who has finished 5th and 6th in the Vuelta before?

 

[bigcog]

Re: Re:

Nicholas Roche morphing into Geraint Thomas now - just gets funnier every race. Roche with the climbers up til the last 1km....ahead of Pozzovivo !!

Is this the same guy who has finished 5th and 6th in the Vuelta before?

Indeed it is

 

[Bernie's eyesore]

Re: Re:

Nicholas Roche morphing into Geraint Thomas now - just gets funnier every race. Roche with the climbers up til the last 1km....ahead of Pozzovivo !!

Is this the same guy who has finished 5th and 6th in the Vuelta before?

Indeed it is

Oh right, I assumed from Cycle Chic's post that I had got him confused with a different rider!

 

[ppanther92]

Re:

Nicholas Roche morphing into Geraint Thomas now - just gets funnier every race. Roche with the climbers up til the last 1km....ahead of Pozzovivo !!

He is a better climber Thomas ever was. (ok, until the 2015 TdF of course )

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

Nicholas Roche morphing into Geraint Thomas now - just gets funnier every race. Roche with the climbers up til the last 1km....ahead of Pozzovivo !!

Is this the same guy who has finished 5th and 6th in the Vuelta before?

Indeed it is

Oh right, I assumed from Cycle Chic's post that I had got him confused with a different rider!

True but come on, you have to be pretty desperate for an internet win if you are going to be pointing holes in cycle chics posts. She (or he since its chic not chick so I don't know) is like the clinic version of Grandpa Simpson with increasingly ridiculous theories and more often than not it used to be the sky "haters" who are the first to dispute their posts, though now we just ignore them.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Re: Re:

Nicholas Roche morphing into Geraint Thomas now - just gets funnier every race. Roche with the climbers up til the last 1km....ahead of Pozzovivo !!

Is this the same guy who has finished 5th and 6th in the Vuelta before?

In fairness, being with Ag2r and not having especially strong support squads then he did "Zubeldia" his way to those results for the most part (though he was conspicuously visible in a stage or two each time, which Haimar would never allow for); he quite likely won't do as well on GC as that this time but has been active and at the forefront throughout, which gives the illusion - which is more than likely what it is - of him doing better than usual.

 

[Bernie's eyesore]

Re: Re:

Nicholas Roche morphing into Geraint Thomas now - just gets funnier every race. Roche with the climbers up til the last 1km....ahead of Pozzovivo !!

Is this the same guy who has finished 5th and 6th in the Vuelta before?

In fairness, being with Ag2r and not having especially strong support squads then he did "Zubeldia" his way to those results for the most part (though he was conspicuously visible in a stage or two each time, which Haimar would never allow for); he quite likely won't do as well on GC as that this time but has been active and at the forefront throughout, which gives the illusion - which is more than likely what it is - of him doing better than usual.

Roche was actually pretty visible in 2013 when riding for Tinkoff, I think you are doing him a disservice. Okay, there was an element of Zubeldia to his ride in the latter stages when he was defending his position in the GC but he was as active in the first week then as he has been this year.

 

[Cycle Chic]

So when the last climb is down to Quintana, Rodriquez, Valverde, Froome, Aru, Majka, Henao, Nieve, Chaves, ROCHE !! thats not a bit odd ??

 

[cadence]

Re:

So when the last climb is down to Quintana, Rodriquez, Valverde, Froome, Aru, Majka, Henao, Nieve, Chaves, ROCHE !! thats not a bit odd ??

You forgot the race winner, Dumoulin. I also think you are confusing the Roche at the tour who was carrying a bit of weight to work for Froome on the flats to the Roche normally seen at the Vuelta

 

[42x16ss]

Re:

So when the last climb is down to Quintana, Rodriquez, Valverde, Froome, Aru, Majka, Henao, Nieve, Chaves, ROCHE !! thats not a bit odd ??

Roche on the Bola del Mundo on his way to 7th on GC in 2010...

 

[42x16ss]

Re: Re:

So when the last climb is down to Quintana, Rodriquez, Valverde, Froome, Aru, Majka, Henao, Nieve, Chaves, ROCHE !! thats not a bit odd ??

You forgot the race winner, Dumoulin. I also think you are confusing the Roche at the tour who was carrying a bit of weight to work for Froome on the flats to the Roche normally seen at the Vuelta

Indeed. Check out this fatty:

 

[Cycle Chic]

Re: Re:

So when the last climb is down to Quintana, Rodriquez, Valverde, Froome, Aru, Majka, Henao, Nieve, Chaves, ROCHE !! thats not a bit odd ??

You forgot the race winner, Dumoulin. I also think you are confusing the Roche at the tour who was carrying a bit of weight to work for Froome on the flats to the Roche normally seen at the Vuelta

ohhhhhhhhh yeh I forgot you can transform yourself whenever the occasion permits.

So the Worlds are coming up - hey think i,ll be a timetrialler that week !

 

[cadence]

Re: Re:

So when the last climb is down to Quintana, Rodriquez, Valverde, Froome, Aru, Majka, Henao, Nieve, Chaves, ROCHE !! thats not a bit odd ??

You forgot the race winner, Dumoulin. I also think you are confusing the Roche at the tour who was carrying a bit of weight to work for Froome on the flats to the Roche normally seen at the Vuelta

ohhhhhhhhh yeh I forgot you can transform yourself whenever the occasion permits.

So the Worlds are coming up - hey think i,ll be a timetrialler that week !

I didn't know you were a pro cyclist, I will have to look out for you in the WC! It's a simple thing called peaking for your key objective. I mean, most of the club cyclists at my local CC can do it, but I am sure for a pro paid to cycle for 10 months a year that's a complicated thing to do....

 

[Cycle Chic]

Re: Re:

It's a simple thing called peaking for your key objective.

is that a euphemism for Roche timing his doping program....or maybe he just knows that the Spanish dont bother testing at the Vuelta.