Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Benotti69]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

I watched the early RAI coverage then switched over to Eurosport later... , Sky was riding en bloc around 2/3 of the way down the bunch, unless there was a pinch point or tricky bit, then they would send up a couple guys to check then drop back... So, I reckon they rode almost half the race like that, getting sucked along, whilst everyone else worked... No small wonder there were 4-5 Sky riders on the Poggio looking fresh...

Out of 24 teams, were they all busting a gut?

It doesn't explain how Sky looked comfortable with so many.

No fetching bottles, sending back arm warmers, leg warmers etc etc. So no dom work all day just get sucked along and be there on the Poggio and it is that simple. Yet again the myth that Sky are different then others is complete BS.

Sorry not buying that.

 

[42x16ss]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

I watched the early RAI coverage then switched over to Eurosport later... , Sky was riding en bloc around 2/3 of the way down the bunch, unless there was a pinch point or tricky bit, then they would send up a couple guys to check then drop back... So, I reckon they rode almost half the race like that, getting sucked along, whilst everyone else worked... No small wonder there were 4-5 Sky riders on the Poggio looking fresh...

Out of 24 teams, were they all busting a gut?

It doesn't explain how Sky looked comfortable with so many.

No fetching bottles, sending back arm warmers, leg warmers etc etc. So no dom work all day just get sucked along and be there on the Poggio and it is that simple. Yet again the myth that Sky are different then others is complete BS.

Sorry not buying that.

Come on Bennotti, apparently any Fred can roll along for 270kms @ 40km/h when the group is large. No need for food or water, it's only 6 1/2 hours of riding and holding position and staying alert and chasing back on after nature breaks or punctures and avoiding wildcard riders with poorer bike skills and keeping track of the team leader...

 

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

Come on Bennotti, apparently any Fred can roll along for 270kms @ 40km/h when the group is large. No need for food or water, it's only 6 1/2 hours of riding and holding position and staying alert and chasing back on after nature breaks or punctures and avoiding wildcard riders with poorer bike skills and keeping track of the team leader...

and the cipressa sound like a cured and dried and salted mediterranean foodstuff packed into the intestines of some porcine

 

[42x16ss]

Re: Re:

Come on Bennotti, apparently any Fred can roll along for 270kms @ 40km/h when the group is large. No need for food or water, it's only 6 1/2 hours of riding and holding position and staying alert and chasing back on after nature breaks or punctures and avoiding wildcard riders with poorer bike skills and keeping track of the team leader...

and the cipressa sound like a cured and dried and salted mediterranean foodstuff packed into the intestines of some porcine

Some say that the Cipressa is easier to climb now, after Toto last rode MSR

 

[veganrob]

Any Sky fan will tell you that you can't trust a photo. The subject will either weigh far more or far less than than it appears. At the same time

 

[blackcat]

Re:

Any Sky fan will tell you that you can't trust a photo. The subject will either weigh far more or far less than than it appears. At the same time

aka, #schroedingers_Zeno_cound_paradox

torturing metaphors, torching towns

 

[Rob27172]

I mean it really is so simple to be a completely dominant team in any bike race. Most cyclists must be SO STUPID not to be able to work out that all they have to do is hide and come to the front at the end of the race.

Only Festina, USPS and SKY seem to have worked it out in the past twenty years.
Wonder what could possibly link those three???

 

[bigcog]

Re:

I mean it really is so simple to be a completely dominant team in any bike race. Most cyclists must be SO STUPID not to be able to work out that all they have to do is hide and come to the front at the end of the race.

Only Festina, USPS and SKY seem to have worked it out in the past twenty years.
Wonder what could possibly link those three???

Looks like they need some tips from Movistar no ? :lol:

 

[rick james]

Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

context please? how was the race up to the climb, was the average speed up or down on the previous years? a 6 minute climb proves nothing about doping.

the only Unbelievable thing here is you are copying digger

 

[Rob27172]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

context please? how was the race up to the climb, was the average speed up or down on the previous years? a 6 minute climb proves nothing about doping.

the only Unbelievable thing here is you are copying digger

Yes please provide context so the sky apologists and skybots can argue the minutiae out of it and try to derail from the obvious fact staring everyone in the face

 

[Benotti69]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

context please? how was the race up to the climb, was the average speed up or down on the previous years? a 6 minute climb proves nothing about doping.

the only Unbelievable thing here is you are copying digger

Rick, you ok with Sky sacking a rider who was 'suspected' but not diagnosed as having a mental disorder?

Why did Sky not diagnose and prescribe? What was it Brailsford said? "whiter than white".

As for MSR. Since when are races done at Sunday club run pace? Since when is a monument of 290+Km of racing, yes that is racing for 290kms and then the only team with nearly a full compliment at the head of affairs and you want to argue the time? Puhleeease. Some of us are watching pro bike racing since the 80s.

As for the personal jibe re Digger. Plenty are are saying the exact same as Digger, plenty, he just says it more often.

Personal attacks detract from ones argument not add to it. Important bot information.

 

[TheSpud]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

context please? how was the race up to the climb, was the average speed up or down on the previous years? a 6 minute climb proves nothing about doping.

the only Unbelievable thing here is you are copying digger

Rick, you ok with Sky sacking a rider who was 'suspected' but not diagnosed as having a mental disorder?

Why did Sky not diagnose and prescribe? What was it Brailsford said? "whiter than white".

As for MSR. Since when are races done at Sunday club run pace? Since when is a monument of 290+Km of racing, yes that is racing for 290kms and then the only team with nearly a full compliment at the head of affairs and you want to argue the time? Puhleeease. Some of us are watching pro bike racing since the 80s.

As for the personal jibe re Digger. Plenty are are saying the exact same as Digger, plenty, he just says it more often.

Personal attacks detract from ones argument not add to it. Important bot information.

When you say 'sacking a rider' I assume you are on about Edmondson? If so I haven't seen anything about him being sacked, either because of or not because of having any mental disorder. I may have missed it though so please provide the link.

 

[Benotti69]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

context please? how was the race up to the climb, was the average speed up or down on the previous years? a 6 minute climb proves nothing about doping.

the only Unbelievable thing here is you are copying digger

Rick, you ok with Sky sacking a rider who was 'suspected' but not diagnosed as having a mental disorder?

Why did Sky not diagnose and prescribe? What was it Brailsford said? "whiter than white".

As for MSR. Since when are races done at Sunday club run pace? Since when is a monument of 290+Km of racing, yes that is racing for 290kms and then the only team with nearly a full compliment at the head of affairs and you want to argue the time? Puhleeease. Some of us are watching pro bike racing since the 80s.

As for the personal jibe re Digger. Plenty are are saying the exact same as Digger, plenty, he just says it more often.

Personal attacks detract from ones argument not add to it. Important bot information.

When you say 'sacking a rider' I assume you are on about Edmondson? If so I haven't seen anything about him being sacked, either because of or not because of having any mental disorder. I may have missed it though so please provide the link.

Where did i say he was sacked due to the mental disorder? Stop obfuscating!

Why did Doctor Steve Peters not see it?

Is this not the team that in its quest for every marginal gain left no stone unturned? But rider's mental health was not part of that gain.

Sky lies. Sky doping.

 

[Benotti69]

Funny really Sky feeding the inner chimps Tramadol and Corticosteroids and not checking for depression, as this is a common side effect!

Sky, a run of the mill WT doping team.

 

[blackcat]

Re:

Funny really Sky feeding the inner chimps Tramadol and Corticosteroids and not checking for depression, as this is a common side effect!

Sky, a run of the mill WT doping team.

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=25932&start=1260&hilit=diffused

Dan, why did the thread "Dave Brailsford- cycling genius" disappear from the subfora?

Did he have lawyers contest
i) his physiognomy that he looked nothing like gollum? well, for starters, he does. surely.
ii) did his lawyers contest defamation because we hailed him a 'genius'? yeah, that was a defamation, he is no genius.

thanx

btw benotti, not a reply to you.
cheers

 

[blackcat]

edit: I am blind. the gollum thread is still there

 

[blackcat]

folks wont recognise this as my post. or blackcat's third person post alliterationz, mebbe now you will.


but, I think most have misread Sky, running a team doping program inhouse. ok, there was leinders. but I dont count some anti-inflammatories, as a USPS Spanish docs program.

No teams run "programs" now, in the popular interpretation of team structured internal doping medical doping program. They dont do it this way. It is a pas-de-deux within the system, they have to negotiate the system as it also has to do the double dealings with La Monde, L'Equipe, Madame Aubury, and the ASO, and TdF.

Hey you short memory board members... who is the chief of BMC? What was his job, before BMC? (well, before Phonak)... Lelangue, he works for the ASO for chrissakes profanity exponentiated

Lelangue works for ASO, jumps to Phonak and BMC works with Ochowitz! Och! och och och. Ask Race Radio. He of the famous car route in his american racing, jumps into a car, races his cycling route inside a car...

So, we have Phonak Andy Rihs, ASO, Och, Lelangue, Cuddles wins the Tour. cuddles!

Lelangue was ASO folks. Then he wins the Tour. Then he gets motor Spartacus from CSC. oh man.

So, look at the threads. Everyone is complicit. peel the eyelids back folks. peeel. it. back.
_
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from the sky gollum dave brailsford is a genius thread and james murdoch wont sack the LotR character sack him sack him sack him Murdoch


this is a fundamtental misreading of #TeamSky's JohNash gametheory doping.

Everyone is like JTL and does their diffused own responsibility doping, the era from bringing it inside the team has been quashed, riders need to manage their own enhancement and supply/logistics,

this #gametheory allows the team plausible deniability.

as my neologism is, implausible undeniability[sic]

effectively, nothing has changed, but everything has changed.

Edita Rumsas does the job of the USPS doctors.

ok, you can say Leinders, Cope etc...

for one rider. No more. The programs are diffused, this allows the teams to defuse risk, and to deny.

 

[Irondan]

Re: Re:

Funny really Sky feeding the inner chimps Tramadol and Corticosteroids and not checking for depression, as this is a common side effect!

Sky, a run of the mill WT doping team.

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=25932&start=1260&hilit=diffused

Dan, why did the thread "Dave Brailsford- cycling genius" disappear from the subfora?

Did he have lawyers contest
i) his physiognomy that he looked nothing like gollum? well, for starters, he does. surely.
ii) did his lawyers contest defamation because we hailed him a 'genius'? yeah, that was a defamation, he is no genius.

thanx

btw benotti, not a reply to you.
cheers

I dunno Blackcat... I'll check the mod logs when I get back to my pc, I'm mobile right now and it's a PITA on mobile.

 

[42x16ss]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

context please? how was the race up to the climb, was the average speed up or down on the previous years? a 6 minute climb proves nothing about doping.

the only Unbelievable thing here is you are copying digger

Average speed was just under 41km/h, a fair bit faster than 2011, 2001, 1993 and 1992. Roughly the same as 2008, 2005, 2004, 2000 and 1998. Middle of the road...

 

[rick james]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

context please? how was the race up to the climb, was the average speed up or down on the previous years? a 6 minute climb proves nothing about doping.

the only Unbelievable thing here is you are copying digger

Rick, you ok with Sky sacking a rider who was 'suspected' but not diagnosed as having a mental disorder?

Why did Sky not diagnose and prescribe? What was it Brailsford said? "whiter than white".

As for MSR. Since when are races done at Sunday club run pace? Since when is a monument of 290+Km of racing, yes that is racing for 290kms and then the only team with nearly a full compliment at the head of affairs and you want to argue the time? Puhleeease. Some of us are watching pro bike racing since the 80s.

As for the personal jibe re Digger. Plenty are are saying the exact same as Digger, plenty, he just says it more often.

Personal attacks detract from ones argument not add to it. Important bot information.

who did sky sack for having a mental disorder?

using a strava timer up a 6 minute climb to claim doping is almost amateur stuff, this place could do so much better work yet the hatred of all things sky makes some blind

 

[rick james]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

context please? how was the race up to the climb, was the average speed up or down on the previous years? a 6 minute climb proves nothing about doping.

the only Unbelievable thing here is you are copying digger

Average speed was just under 41km/h, a fair bit faster than 2011, 2001, 1993 and 1992. Roughly the same as 2008, 2005, 2004, 2000 and 1998. Middle of the road...

Again context, how easy did Kwiatkowski have it until that final climb? how much did the wind affect him?

picking a time up a small climb single climb and claim doping is so wrong.

 

[classicomano]

Dumoulin did a massive pull right from the bottom almost all the way to the top, they also had a big tailwind. Thats the context.

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

5:55. Third fastest climbing time on Poggio today, we're back to pre-EPO test speeds.

Sky train looking like a Sunday club ride at times while Dumoulin was spilling his guts!!!

Unbelievable.

context please? how was the race up to the climb, was the average speed up or down on the previous years? a 6 minute climb proves nothing about doping.

the only Unbelievable thing here is you are copying digger

Context is from my understanding theyve been doing the poggio for 60 years almost including the entirety of the EPO era.

If benotti or digger was comparing 2017 poggio to one other version of the same climb you can use these variables.

If they do it every year however the variables get lost in the sample. What, are you really trying to argue that people with 60% hematocrit in the 90's and 2000's were going slower than 2017 because the race was superhard every single year for an entire generation, then this year, the 1 time a Sky rider wins it, just happens to be the one year they go super slow and easy?

To be fair, that argument might even work once or twice.

But the funny thing is, we hear from you that every time Sky do well. Every time G beats EPO times its cos there is a tailwind. And everytime Froome does it its a tailwind. Or the race was easy. Everytime Wiggins does it its because he "prepared", or he had an easy course. Everytime a Sky rider wins anything, its always also the 1 time that particular climb or tt or mountian was easier than all the other times in history it was climbed. And never with any evidence to back it up either.


That is nonesence.

No surprise to see the dumbest least thought through arguments always coming from the same side.

 

[rick james]

well sky never really came to the front until the second to last climb, they had it very easy up until that point, but feel free to tell everyone a 6 minute effort = doping

 

[thehog]

Re:

well sky never really came to the front until the second to last climb, they had it very easy up until that point, but feel free to tell everyone a 6 minute effort = doping

An easy 272km to that point? :lol: