Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[SeriousSam]

Re: Re:

Not Clean.

Crap all year, all of the team except Kwiatkowski and Kirienka.

Turns up to Dusseldorf and their Dauphine complete and utter lack of form team wise relative to 2016; it is just too much to take.

Seriously Team Sky? Did you have to go to the absurd. Porte is the gauge.

Dauphine destroyed your whole team alone.

4 riders on their squad put 35-40 seconds into him today! 40 seconds.

It's the fact the team as a whole has sucked all year long and now boom! We've got the form.

Not clean. Looks beyond dirty.

Either be on form all year, or drop the charade. Didn't believe it with Armstrong, so not buying this.

You guys had better go back to sucking as a team asap!! Your number is up...

The reason they put 40 seconds into Porte is because he decided to be very careful after seeing Roche crash, he said it himself in an interview. Sky took a different view of the stage and took more risks. Your use of Porte as gauge is a load of bs.

Did you watch the stage? Froome was treading carefully around corners also and even if he hadn't been, safe cornering would account for 10-15 seconds at most in a 14k TT. Froome was clearly taking a huge chunk of time on all his main rivals in the straights. Ominous. Or maybe it was just because he sought out the dry patches on the road as Kirby acclaimed him for in commentary!!

:lol:

Perhaps his personal tailwind was back as well

 

[Galic Ho]

Re: Re:

Not Clean.

Crap all year, all of the team except Kwiatkowski and Kirienka.

Turns up to Dusseldorf and their Dauphine complete and utter lack of form team wise relative to 2016; it is just too much to take.

Seriously Team Sky? Did you have to go to the absurd. Porte is the gauge.

Dauphine destroyed your whole team alone.

4 riders on their squad put 35-40 seconds into him today! 40 seconds.

It's the fact the team as a whole has sucked all year long and now boom! We've got the form.

Not clean. Looks beyond dirty.

Either be on form all year, or drop the charade. Didn't believe it with Armstrong, so not buying this.

You guys had better go back to sucking as a team asap!! Your number is up...

The reason they put 40 seconds into Porte is because he decided to be very careful after seeing Roche crash, he said it himself in an interview. Sky took a different view of the stage and took more risks. Your use of Porte as gauge is a load of bs.

No it's not.

Form is always the gauge.

On paper, Landa is Sky's outstanding rider along with Kwiatkowski.

Not surprised by him or Kirienka.

But Froome! Relative to Contador and Valverde (who crashed) at the Dauphine, Froome was way off in the time trial.

He reversed his 37 second deficit there and put 35 into Porte.

Yes the weather plays a part.

So you're suggesting, on form relative to other GC rivals, Froome not only turned his season long (so he's sucked all year relative to other seasons) highly UNDERWHELMING form into better than every rival by a country mile!

I'll explain simply.

Aru, Fuglsand, Bardet, Pinot, Contador, Quintana, Martin and Porte, the men likely to fill out the top 10, all of them, yes all of them, were within 7 seconds of each other. Chaves was a further 20 seconds down too.

So where did Chris find this form?

Want to explain how many of them beat him at the Dauphine and the earlier season? Heck, Froome mouthed off so much about wanting to win the Dauphine and choked big time.

Come the tour a 3 weeks later and he's as fresh as a daisy. SO FRESH HE COULD BE AN AIRSPRAY.

Gotta love the Froome FUMES.

Fanboy much on your behalf?

It's the huge jump in his form that is BS. Not my statement.

Porte, looks after this stage, where he was relative to every major rival was last year...except Froome.

The test is uphill.

Sorry, but team Sky have sucked in that department all year long except for Kwiatkowski and Landa. If Froome starts dropping his rivals...yeah, uber super dodgy because he simply has not shown an inkling all season long.

That's textbook Armstrong methodology. Yes it looks dirty. Because it is dirty.

The measure, is always the REST and YOUR own form before.

And on that note, Froome looked normalish.

We will see how these mountains go.

 

[Electress]

Re: Re:

A fairly incredible first 10 minutes of coverage of the TDF by the UK's ITV where the great Imlach and his colleagues Boardman and Dave Millar absolutely speared Sky. Making it clear that whilst technically they may not have breached rules, their entire conduct stank to high heavens both before and after the Wiggins TUE revelations broke. A very brave move by a broadcaster to question the credibility of leading performers at the outset of three weeks of wall to wall coverage.

I'd expect nothing less from the outstanding Imlach but I'm still amazed that the broadcasters let them do it. I can see there being very real consequences for Brailsford and Sky from such impartial coverage.

Inside knowledge that the end is near and putting the boot in now takes no courage. Like kicking a man when he is down and out.

They are 5 years too late.

Do you think the end is near for Sky?

I reckon they'll go all out for this one, Brailsfraud will then slink off into the night. Crookson won't get re-elected and we'll see Sky slowly diminish. If not, and they get greedy, then we'll see a Lance like denouement. TPTB must be cottoning on to the hostility they invite, and that cannot be good for the sport. They'll need a scalp.

 

[ontheroad]

Re:

Its not really out of the ordinary. Its a wet opening time trial, there are so many variables that aren't directly linked to pure power. Lets wait for the mountains, but they do look incredibly strong.

Absolutely the time gaps from Froome to other GC men were significant for a 14km TT. He took 35 seconds on all his main rivals which is crazy in a short TT. Lance in his live stream after said it was a very strong message and Contador said in interview afterwards it was crazy to lose 40 secs in this stage. I expect ASO also thought there would be 10-20 seconds max between GC contenders.

 

[Galic Ho]

Re: Re:

Not Clean.

Crap all year, all of the team except Kwiatkowski and Kirienka.

Turns up to Dusseldorf and their Dauphine complete and utter lack of form team wise relative to 2016; it is just too much to take.

Seriously Team Sky? Did you have to go to the absurd. Porte is the gauge.

Dauphine destroyed your whole team alone.

4 riders on their squad put 35-40 seconds into him today! 40 seconds.

It's the fact the team as a whole has sucked all year long and now boom! We've got the form.

Not clean. Looks beyond dirty.

Either be on form all year, or drop the charade. Didn't believe it with Armstrong, so not buying this.

You guys had better go back to sucking as a team asap!! Your number is up...

The reason they put 40 seconds into Porte is because he decided to be very careful after seeing Roche crash, he said it himself in an interview. Sky took a different view of the stage and took more risks. Your use of Porte as gauge is a load of bs.

Did you watch the stage? Froome was treading carefully around corners also and even if he hadn't been, safe cornering would account for 10-15 seconds at most in a 14k TT. Froome was clearly taking a huge chunk of time on all his main rivals in the straights. Ominous. Or maybe it was just because he sought out the dry patches on the road as Kirby acclaimed him for in commentary!!

The test is Big Tom.

Shame he ain't here to beat these Sky boys into shape.

Wait...he did at the Giro!!

Nah, Geraint T must have been hurt so bad he had to quit the Giro, but somehow, wins a short chrono by 7 seconds.

If he suddenly sucks in the mountains fair deal.

But all season, Sky, on paper, apart from Landa, Kirenka and Kwiatkowski have been massively below their huge levels.

IF you princesses are so convinced Sky are clean and can be expected to place 4 guys in the top 10 and it not be suspicious, where were you in the racing thread?

Porte not being at 16'20" is explainable...but to lose that much form on all of Sky, a team he rode for, in 3 weeks?

Yeah...you better hope the mountains revert back to the previous season results because Sky, just shot themselves in the foot. A blind person can see that is super suspicious.

Alas, with no Tom here to put the sword into Geraint, I guess it was to be EXPECTED he'd win was it not?

Note: that last sentence is sarcasm. No it wasn't to be expected.

Kung was the favourite. Martin was questionable. The only way you'd convince us otherwise would have been to have Rohan Dennis there. He had the form recently in the Tour de Suisse...heck, how many BMC riders won ITT at nationals? Wasn't it like every rider they have?

Strange things happen in a week though!!

 

[Galic Ho]

Re: Re:

Not Clean.

Crap all year, all of the team except Kwiatkowski and Kirienka.

Turns up to Dusseldorf and their Dauphine complete and utter lack of form team wise relative to 2016; it is just too much to take.

Seriously Team Sky? Did you have to go to the absurd. Porte is the gauge.

Dauphine destroyed your whole team alone.

4 riders on their squad put 35-40 seconds into him today! 40 seconds.

It's the fact the team as a whole has sucked all year long and now boom! We've got the form.

Not clean. Looks beyond dirty.

Either be on form all year, or drop the charade. Didn't believe it with Armstrong, so not buying this.

You guys had better go back to sucking as a team asap!! Your number is up...

The reason they put 40 seconds into Porte is because he decided to be very careful after seeing Roche crash, he said it himself in an interview. Sky took a different view of the stage and took more risks. Your use of Porte as gauge is a load of bs.

Did you watch the stage? Froome was treading carefully around corners also and even if he hadn't been, safe cornering would account for 10-15 seconds at most in a 14k TT. Froome was clearly taking a huge chunk of time on all his main rivals in the straights. Ominous. Or maybe it was just because he sought out the dry patches on the road as Kirby acclaimed him for in commentary!!

Froome is around 5-10 Kgs heavier. Obviously he'll take time on Porte on the flats. :surprised:

Argghhhh.

The loyal Sky fanboy in the other threads comes to defend his champions!!

Which one is your favourite? Shouldn't you know the EXACT weight of every rider?

Dude...you smell like you've got something to hide...be honest...you're like Flo but worse. Sheesh kiddo, keep it real in the Clinic. If you thought Sky were clean, WHY would you even browse the Clinic?

Because you get a high from defending them?

To whom? The guys who never leave here?

You'll never agree with them!! So don't waste your time...it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck...it's probably a duck. This looked dodgy. So did AX3 in 2013 and Porte looked dodgy there!! I call it fairly...you won't.

Always look for the fanboy badge. You outed yours in the pro racing thread.

Now, to business:

Explain for me, how Porte beat Tony Martin by 17 seconds in the Dauphine, who is 75kg and at least 6-7kg heavier than Froome and NOW, all of a sudden, loses time on the straight?

Shouldn't Richie, have lost time, because of his weight (because you made a rule out of it...so it MUST BE RIGHT!!) in the Dauphine? Wait...he beat Froome by 37 seconds there. So Froome, today, bridged that time difference and took some 35 seconds himself out of Porte. Granted, the length was different and the weather plays a part. But not on Contador as well.

Every GC hopeful was within 7 seconds at 35-42 seconds behind Froome. A Froome who all season sucked.

I don't care about last year. I care about this seasons form. It looked wrong. Froome should have shut his mouth and not painted Porte as so strong. I hold HIM to his WORD. He said Richie is the favourite! Blame your boy on Sky. It's his standard I am holding him to! And that measure is Porte.

And by this seasons results, Porte under performed but Thomas and Froome were beyond GOOD.

The only way that would have looked okay, would have been Richie being near Froome on time. He wasn't.

It's super dirty looking. Let me guess, you'll be back in the mountains to defend them if they are suddenly back to old Sky? Because, I must have missed the lack of a Sky train in all the stage races this season...but come July, good old Dave brings the boys with all the ammo!! Must be the water!!

Oh wait...it was raining. It was the water!!

I'll say it clearly: I don't dislike Sky. Don't hate them. Even enjoyed last years Tour immensely. Froome raced really well.

But on race form this year, today's results are super odd. That's not normal. Geraint and Froome...too good for their seasons. Of course, there is no Tom Dumoulin here to prove how good they truly were.

Oh and I guess Tony Martin is crap too!!

I guess when Kwiatkowski won a world champions jersey and Kirienka did as well, they were suddenly crap too! Nope. Tony is where he should have been relative to his recent results...close to the winner. Kung was where he should have been. Same with Kirienka. Solid. Specialists. A super domestique should not be winning a prologue ITT under 15-16km. Ever. That, ain't normal.

 

[Bolder]

The end is near for Sky? Really? Would love to see any sources for that.

Look, I don't believe they, or anyone, is clean, but c'mon now -- what are the chances of a Festina-style roundup in the next 3 weeks? Most likely what's going to happen is...nothing. The TUE is a cloud, for sure, but there has been absolutely NO action taken that will realistically put Sky in jeopardy. The reason they are the strongest is money as much as anything else. Their budget is 25 percent higher than BMCs (as of 2016, according to L'Equipe) and as much as 600 percent more than some of the lower-tier GT teams.

I am not going to armchair-quarterback today's TT, but given the conditions, I don't see anything out of the ordinary for Sky. The TdF is their No. 1 objective, they are clearly prepared both physically and technically, and their strong riders...rode strongly.

 

[silvergrenade]

Re: Re:

Not Clean.

Crap all year, all of the team except Kwiatkowski and Kirienka.

Turns up to Dusseldorf and their Dauphine complete and utter lack of form team wise relative to 2016; it is just too much to take.

Seriously Team Sky? Did you have to go to the absurd. Porte is the gauge.

Dauphine destroyed your whole team alone.

4 riders on their squad put 35-40 seconds into him today! 40 seconds.

It's the fact the team as a whole has sucked all year long and now boom! We've got the form.

Not clean. Looks beyond dirty.

Either be on form all year, or drop the charade. Didn't believe it with Armstrong, so not buying this.

You guys had better go back to sucking as a team asap!! Your number is up...

The reason they put 40 seconds into Porte is because he decided to be very careful after seeing Roche crash, he said it himself in an interview. Sky took a different view of the stage and took more risks. Your use of Porte as gauge is a load of bs.

Did you watch the stage? Froome was treading carefully around corners also and even if he hadn't been, safe cornering would account for 10-15 seconds at most in a 14k TT. Froome was clearly taking a huge chunk of time on all his main rivals in the straights. Ominous. Or maybe it was just because he sought out the dry patches on the road as Kirby acclaimed him for in commentary!!

Froome is around 5-10 Kgs heavier. Obviously he'll take time on Porte on the flats.

Argghhhh.

The loyal Sky fanboy in the other threads comes to defend his champions!!

Which one is your favourite? Shouldn't you know the EXACT weight of every rider?

Dude...you smell like you've got something to hide...be honest...you're like Flo but worse. Sheesh kiddo, keep it real in the Clinic. If you thought Sky were clean, WHY would you even browse the Clinic?

Because you get a high from defending them?

To whom? The guys who never leave here?

You'll never agree with them!! So don't waste your time...it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck...it's probably a duck. This looked dodgy. So did AX3 in 2013 and Porte looked dodgy there!! I call it fairly...you won't.

Always look for the fanboy badge. You outed yours in the pro racing thread.

Now, to business:

Explain for me, how Porte beat Tony Martin by 17 seconds in the Dauphine, who is 75kg and at least 6-7kg heavier than Froome and NOW, all of a sudden, loses time on the straight?

Shouldn't Richie, have lost time, because of his weight (because you made a rule out of it...so it MUST BE RIGHT!!) in the Dauphine? Wait...he beat Froome by 37 seconds there. So Froome, today, bridged that time difference and took some 35 seconds himself out of Porte. Granted, the length was different and the weather plays a part. But not on Contador as well.

Every GC hopeful was within 7 seconds at 35-42 seconds behind Froome. A Froome who all season sucked.

I don't care about last year. I care about this seasons form. It looked wrong. Froome should have shut his mouth and not painted Porte as so strong. I hold HIM to his WORD. He said Richie is the favourite! Blame your boy on Sky. It's his standard I am holding him to! And that measure is Porte.

And by this seasons results, Porte under performed but Thomas and Froome were beyond GOOD.

The only way that would have looked okay, would have been Richie being near Froome on time. He wasn't.

It's super dirty looking. Let me guess, you'll be back in the mountains to defend them if they are suddenly back to old Sky? Because, I must have missed the lack of a Sky train in all the stage races this season...but come July, good old Dave brings the boys with all the ammo!! Must be the water!!

Oh wait...it was raining. It was the water!!

I'll say it clearly: I don't dislike Sky. Don't hate them. Even enjoyed last years Tour immensely. Froome raced really well.

But on race form this year, today's results are super odd. That's not normal. Geraint and Froome...too good for their seasons. Of course, there is no Tom Dumoulin here to prove how good they truly were.

Oh and I guess Tony Martin is crap too!!

I guess when Kwiatkowski won a world champions jersey and Kirienka did as well, they were suddenly crap too! Nope. Tony is where he should have been relative to his recent results...close to the winner. Kung was where he should have been. Same with Kirienka. Solid. Specialists. A super domestique should not be winning a prologue ITT under 15-16km. Ever. That, ain't normal.

So, do you mouth away and talk *** to whoever you like? :lol:
If you'll read my other posts in the clinic as well as the PRR you might get some answers to what you ask.
As usual, you wont and will keep talking crap.
Just a word of advice..Show some respect around here.. Being an ass never helps.
Cheers Kiddo!

 

[Galic Ho]

Re:

The end is near for Sky? Really? Would love to see any sources for that.

Look, I don't believe they, or anyone, is clean, but c'mon now -- what are the chances of a Festina-style roundup in the next 3 weeks? Most likely what's going to happen is...nothing. The TUE is a cloud, for sure, but there has been absolutely NO action taken that will realistically put Sky in jeopardy. The reason they are the strongest is money as much as anything else. Their budget is 25 percent higher than BMCs (as of 2016, according to L'Equipe) and as much as 600 percent more than some of the lower-tier GT teams.

I am not going to armchair-quarterback today's TT, but given the conditions, I don't see anything out of the ordinary for Sky. The TdF is their No. 1 objective, they are clearly prepared both physically and technically, and their strong riders...rode strongly.

When was the last time you witnessed, a team place 4 riders, into the top 10 on a stage in a race?

I have to say, 2009 Astana is the only memory that comes close outside of Mapei in the 90s.

Sure, it's day 1. They might suck the rest of the race.

The tell with team Sky is Landa.

He has been on fire this year. SO STRONG.

If he suddenly, is not even firing, then that is an alarm bell.

I called it here. Look at how Landa goes. Then Kwiatkowski who won a monument.

Poels last season had amazing form. He's gone. So too Stannard and Kennaugh.

On paper, this Sky, looked the weakest and had the weakest form they've ever shown.

Dauphine 2016 on the last stage, Froome had 3 domestiques with him to the finish.

This year, Kwiatkowski, who Sky EXCLUDED from their 2016 Tour roster, was the ONLY RIDER ABLE TO KEEP UP WITH FROOME ON SKY!!

Tell me that's not strange.

Where are Kennaugh and Stennard? Where is Poels? They look normal suddenly.

Who leaves Kwiatkowski out of their main grand tour lineup?

Bizarre hey?

No...form doesn't lie. It always paves the way and reveals what is happening. And Froome did empty the tank at the Dauphine. He really, really, should not have said Porte was the favourite. Because if he is miles better...again, that looks dodgy.

 

[The Hegelian]

I'd grant that the 4 Sky riders in the top 10 all have the pedigree to be there - let's bracket the Froome question - so, nothing suss.

Except: there's something so crushingly familiar about it. By that it I mean: Sky or British track riders peaking at precisely the right time to absolutely demolish everyone else who's merely trying to peak at the right time.

That's what's suss for me. And the last time it happened - the Olympics - we could only speculate, but we have quite a deal more proper knowledge now.

 

[talbet]

Do cyclists really compete or is this a show like professional wrestling, with good guys and bad guys?

 

[Galic Ho]

Re: Re:

So, do you mouth away and talk **** to whoever you like? :lol:
If you'll read my other posts in the clinic as well as the PRR you might get some answers to what you ask.
As usual, you wont and will keep talking crap.
Just a word of advice..Show some respect around here.. Being an *** never helps.
Cheers Kiddo!

No.

I just called you a fanboy.

You are a Sky fan are you not?

And do you think the usual Clinic posters, who cry foul and don't like cycling care one iota about a Sky fan, suddenly, at the first sign of Sky looking dirty, care about you?

They don't.

I don't care. I just came here to call Sky dirty and had you posing the preposterous idea that Porte being lighter than Froome explains his time loss.

You didn't answer my questions because it means admitting your logic is faulty.

I'll call doping out, but don't bemoan it happening.

I'm stating, with the idiocy in Britain (you're a Brit aren't you? ), Cookson being usurped by a Frenchman, an Aussie and former Sky rider being the rival for Froome (he said it now didn't he! ) and the British press arising from a 5 year slumber, and questions about the all powerful team Sky (financed by a company founded in Australia...the irony), and the national patriotism and utter stubborn refusal of almost every Brit on this forum in the past to even consider Sky doping...they've gone too far.

DO you know what happened in 2013 after Froome and Porte went 1-2 on AX3? This forum, mysteriously crashed and fans everywhere were saying it was dirty!!

This forum crashed for 3 weeks!

This forum, had someone, with a lot of money, shut it down, for 3 weeks.

Someone paid for this forum, to be shut down and it went offline.

Richie was going to come second that year. Heck, the fact he went into obscurity for 3 seasons afterwards as a GC potential in a GT was ODD!!

Yet, here he finally is.

Do you remember the forum re-emerging in 2012 AFTER the Tour and the Sky fanboys crying foul?

I do.

Do you remember Froome going sideways in the 2009 Giro and being unable to turn his crank going uphill? Simon Gerrans won that stage.

A lot has changed.

Gosh it would be nice to have the leverage to shut the one place that called you dodgy shut down! Heck, do you remember the stage after AX3 where Porte suddenly lost 15 minutes. He came in with Ryder Hesjedal, who was spent and covered in sweat.

Richie, was fresh as a daisy. Not sweating. Not in trouble. He got the nod and the ASO told Sky to KEEP IT REAL.

That's all I am saying.

In fact, as a clear fan (no shame is meant in being a fanboy or fangirl...at least you cheer, most in the Clinic actually hate cycling), I am doing you a favour.

Sky need to keep it real because serious questions are being asked about them.

All they've done is shoot themselves in the foot. Lots of people are questioning them. Just like that day in 2012 on AX3 when this forum crashed and was offline all Tour...what a coincidence!! I hadn't seen riding like that since stage 17 of the 2006 Tour...

of course...you knew all this right?

Just like you knew Froome's weight but ignored Tony Martin being heavier by the same margin differnce Froome has on Porte!!

 

[Benotti69]

Re: Re:

A fairly incredible first 10 minutes of coverage of the TDF by the UK's ITV where the great Imlach and his colleagues Boardman and Dave Millar absolutely speared Sky. Making it clear that whilst technically they may not have breached rules, their entire conduct stank to high heavens both before and after the Wiggins TUE revelations broke. A very brave move by a broadcaster to question the credibility of leading performers at the outset of three weeks of wall to wall coverage.

I'd expect nothing less from the outstanding Imlach but I'm still amazed that the broadcasters let them do it. I can see there being very real consequences for Brailsford and Sky from such impartial coverage.

Inside knowledge that the end is near and putting the boot in now takes no courage. Like kicking a man when he is down and out.

They are 5 years too late.

Do you think the end is near for Sky?

Based on people like Millar, Walsh and others in British media calling for the head of Brailsford's to roll. Yes and I dont think Sky will continue without Brailsford.

It might stop for a year regroup with someone else at the helm.

 

[Cervelo77]

I dunno, it's not like the Sky riders at the top of the table haven't had good results in TTs before, and Tony Martin isn't exactly stellar at TT's anymore despite the narrative the TV hosts want. I'm not really shocked by anything anymore (though maybe that moto parked at the side of the road at the Giro).

 

[Electress]

All they've done is shoot themselves in the foot. Lots of people are questioning them.

Yes. But nothing sticks. The white-wash of the bullying report....the absurdity of the excuses re. the jiffy bag...the appalling governance compared to all their marginal gains BS. The admissions which amount to misappropriation of public money. And yet, here we are again.

Which leads me to believe that they have some heavy duty protection, which is why I believe we'll see more days like today. And more interviews with the world's smuggest man intoning and hand-waving about lessons learned etc etc etc

I think this is basically tied up with the Olympics. If they take Sky down, they'll have to take BC down. And if they do that, the whole 2012 mythology is up in smoke. Who in the UK Sport wants that?

But I do think this will be their final year. I suspect they've had a shot across the bows. This year will be to 'clear the air and leave on a high note'. Then DoB will retire and the narrative will move on.

 

[Rollthedice]

Sky about to do a "Mapei" in a GT. Now that's gonna be something.

 

[SeriousSam]

Even Team Sky's Dave Brailsford couldn't resist gloating at the line.

"We look vulnerable don't you think? That's what everybody's been saying," he said.

 

[Galic Ho]

Re:

I dunno, it's not like the Sky riders at the top of the table haven't had good results in TTs before, and Tony Martin isn't exactly stellar at TT's anymore despite the narrative the TV hosts want. I'm not really shocked by anything anymore (though maybe that moto parked at the side of the road at the Giro).

Yes and it was Wilco Kelderman who struck the bike and coincidentally, dislodged both Sky leaders.

Hmmnnn. Wasn't his team mate, some dude, called Tom Dumoulin?

Not sure it was his plan to try and sabotage Sky by crashing into a stationary bike (that wasn't really as badly placed as some made out) and thereby sabotage Tom Dumoulin later on!

I am fairly confident, at Dump Gate, Tom needed some help. It would have helped to have at least had someone hand him some toilet paper right?

Thomas and Froome, were stronger than they should have been based on their season form (and Giro injury).

Porte was under his late April to early June form...quite a bit under.

Is Sky suddenly having the goods a shock? No.

Froome being under form all season though is a shock.

It's not rocket science. His form has been really odd. Either go full throttle 100% of the time, or risk mimicking Armstrong's approach and being called out on the similarity. He really should not have attacked Porte at the Dauphine. It makes today look so bizarre. It just doesn't look right.

As I said, Froome should have been on form all the time.

What's he got to lose by being on form all season?

It's the huge jump that is suspect.

Take Valverde for example. On form all year until the Dauphine. Was really good.

Does anyone try and defend accusations against him?

Why bother when he is so good consistently! It's drops in form that look suspect when they suddenly turn around in July.

 

[SeriousSam]

Re: Re:

Its not really out of the ordinary. Its a wet opening time trial, there are so many variables that aren't directly linked to pure power. Lets wait for the mountains, but they do look incredibly strong.

Absolutely the time gaps from Froome to other GC men were significant for a 14km TT. He took 35 seconds on all his main rivals which is crazy in a short TT. Lance in his live stream after said it was a very strong message and Contador said in interview afterwards it was crazy to lose 40 secs in this stage. I expect ASO also thought there would be 10-20 seconds max between GC contenders.

Wait, Lance is a commentator now?

He knows something about Tour ITTs for sure. I believe he's never been worse than 3rd, an absolutely insane stat

 

[ontheroad]

Whilst Cookson and Brailsford remain in position the dominance will continue by Sky. I also believe they have high level protection and with an army of PR people around them, I believe that short of getting caught red handed administering an injection, that they will get away with it. The Jiffy bag story is a prime example of how they feel as though they are accountable to absolutely no one. Pooley in a different country, importing Fluimacil, Brailsford offering to stitch up other teams to a journalist, no medical records, most of sky staff taking steroids, using corticos OOC, using Tramadol, Freeman taking his work laptop on holidays to Greece and having it stolen, Freeman feigning illness to avoid sitting in front of MPs. If they can get away with that fairytale they can get away with anything. And you just know that with a Cookson led UCI, the relationship with sky is one of tail wagging dog. They continue to take an unsuspecting public for fools.

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Not Clean.

Crap all year, all of the team except Kwiatkowski and Kirienka.

Turns up to Dusseldorf and their Dauphine complete and utter lack of form team wise relative to 2016; it is just too much to take.

Seriously Team Sky? Did you have to go to the absurd. Porte is the gauge.

Dauphine destroyed your whole team alone.

4 riders on their squad put 35-40 seconds into him today! 40 seconds.

It's the fact the team as a whole has sucked all year long and now boom! We've got the form.

Not clean. Looks beyond dirty.

Either be on form all year, or drop the charade. Didn't believe it with Armstrong, so not buying this.

You guys had better go back to sucking as a team asap!! Your number is up...

The reason they put 40 seconds into Porte is because he decided to be very careful after seeing Roche crash, he said it himself in an interview. Sky took a different view of the stage and took more risks. Your use of Porte as gauge is a load of bs.

Did you watch the stage? Froome was treading carefully around corners also and even if he hadn't been, safe cornering would account for 10-15 seconds at most in a 14k TT. Froome was clearly taking a huge chunk of time on all his main rivals in the straights. Ominous. Or maybe it was just because he sought out the dry patches on the road as Kirby acclaimed him for in commentary!!

That's just an assumption, though, nothing else. Froome looked to be taking corners with a fair bit more oomph than Richie. It was a weirdly good performance from sky, but let's wait for Wednesday to get an affirmation of everything.

 

[ontheroad]

Re: Re:

Not Clean.

Crap all year, all of the team except Kwiatkowski and Kirienka.

Turns up to Dusseldorf and their Dauphine complete and utter lack of form team wise relative to 2016; it is just too much to take.

Seriously Team Sky? Did you have to go to the absurd. Porte is the gauge.

Dauphine destroyed your whole team alone.

4 riders on their squad put 35-40 seconds into him today! 40 seconds.

It's the fact the team as a whole has sucked all year long and now boom! We've got the form.

Not clean. Looks beyond dirty.

Either be on form all year, or drop the charade. Didn't believe it with Armstrong, so not buying this.

You guys had better go back to sucking as a team asap!! Your number is up...

The reason they put 40 seconds into Porte is because he decided to be very careful after seeing Roche crash, he said it himself in an interview. Sky took a different view of the stage and took more risks. Your use of Porte as gauge is a load of bs.

Did you watch the stage? Froome was treading carefully around corners also and even if he hadn't been, safe cornering would account for 10-15 seconds at most in a 14k TT. Froome was clearly taking a huge chunk of time on all his main rivals in the straights. Ominous. Or maybe it was just because he sought out the dry patches on the road as Kirby acclaimed him for in commentary!!

That's just an assumption, though, nothing else. Froome looked to be taking corners with a fair bit more oomph than Richie. It was a weirdly good performance from sky, but let's wait for Wednesday to get an affirmation of everything.

Don't take my word for it. Lance Armstrong said exactly this in his post stage commentary (he is doing a stage by stage analysis that you can view and it's pretty insightful) and he knows a thing or two about TTs. I seen no discernible evidence watching it that Froome was taking any unnecessary risks going into corners and the majority of time gain would certainly have come in the straights.

 

[zlev11]

do you have a link to the Lance audio?

 

[ontheroad]

Re:

do you have a link to the Lance audio?

https://soundcloud.com/user-411867241/episode-01-stage-1-stages-a-tdf-podcast-with-lance-armstrong

Go to around 12:00 for the conversation about Froome time gaps which debunks the argument about Froomes cornering being responsible for the time gap.

And just in case you don't trust Lance just read Froomes own post race comments where he states that he travelled cautiously into corners.

It's amazing though what lengths some of Froomes fans will go to, to try and claim that his superiority is down to anything other than sheer physical supremacy.

 

[Galic Ho]

Re: Re:

Its not really out of the ordinary. Its a wet opening time trial, there are so many variables that aren't directly linked to pure power. Lets wait for the mountains, but they do look incredibly strong.

Absolutely the time gaps from Froome to other GC men were significant for a 14km TT. He took 35 seconds on all his main rivals which is crazy in a short TT. Lance in his live stream after said it was a very strong message and Contador said in interview afterwards it was crazy to lose 40 secs in this stage. I expect ASO also thought there would be 10-20 seconds max between GC contenders.

Wait, Lance is a commentator now?

He knows something about Tour ITTs for sure. I believe he's never been worse than 3rd, an absolutely insane stat

Lance once lost 6 minutes to Big Mig.

6 whole minutes.

That was pre cancer though.

1999 to 2005, you might be right.

Lance dropped 40 seconds to Cancellara in the first stage in Monaco in 2009. Was 10th overall. He had 3 team mates go faster than him. Contador lost 18 seconds and came second and eventually beat Cancellara in the final time trial.

A 28 year old Cancellara.

We've seen stuff like that happen today. Tony Martin getting beaten along with Keung; that's odd.

It would have been nice to have Rohan Dennis here to see how fast he was. He was the on form ITT rider the last 2 months other than Dumoulin and Porte.