Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[MartinGT]

Lanark that is a great quote. The patterns are so obvious, imo.

Here's another pattern I am noticing recently:



There was a big discussion on cortisol and its release into the body and how getting sick is part and parcel of long GT races and long seasons. But these guys are getting sick before one day races, or the first couple of days of a multi-stage race.

Not necessarily doping-related, no.

But a big fuss was made of the team teaching their riders how to wash their hands properly (attention to detail), as well has hiring someone good with saddle sores, back in the day post-death of soigneur. When a bunch of Sky riders withdrew from the Vuelta in the first few days.

So it's April.

Short races.

And they're getting sick.

While other team members are floating to the top as the cream of the pro peloton.

I actually saw and spoke to Josh on Tuesday and rode with him as he is local to me. He actually has a cold and was coughing quite a bit.

 

[timmers]

I actually saw and spoke to Josh on Tuesday and rode with him as he is local to me. He actually has a cold and was coughing quite a bit.

Well did you ask him what "programme" team is on? Most of us don't have the opportunity. Did you suggest that he might want to change to a clean team as you know Sky is dirty?

 

[MartinGT]

Well did you ask him what "programme" team is on? Most of us don't have the opportunity. Did you suggest that he might want to change to a clean team as you know Sky is dirty?

Although I think Sky are the new USPS I want to continue riding on my standard Tuesday training session which Josh has been on since he was with Colpak and even prior. I do not want to be ousted by asking such questions.

If it helps, he isn't fond of BC or the Bald one so don't worry

 

[RownhamHill]

I actually saw and spoke to Josh on Tuesday and rode with him as he is local to me. He actually has a cold and was coughing quite a bit.

Me and all my family have got colds at the moment as well. Could be because we're all doping to win bike races, or could be because it's been the coldest March on record, and there's load of it around? Or a heady combination of the two, I suppose.

I also noticed that Contador got the flu after Tirenno Adriatico as well, and missed a race in Corsica. Presumably that's because he couldn't go with Nibali up that big hill, and lost the race, so he went for some emergency doping, rather than because he'd just ridden 200km at race tempo through freezing rain every day for a week, and got sick as a result?

 

[armchairclimber]

Funnily enough I was talking to a long time member of the BC set up recently. He has a clear anti-doping stance and said that he didn't see any evidence of doping...though, historically (other era), he was aware of a couple of rogue riders "freelancing" whose activities were curiously overlooked/tolerated...although even that was hearsay/suspicion.

That's not to say that SKY are clean, obviously.

 

[mattghg]

Me and all my family have got colds at the moment as well. Could be because we're all doping to win bike races, or could be because it's been the coldest March on record, and there's load of it around? Or a heady combination of the two, I suppose.

I also noticed that Contador got the flu after Tirenno Adriatico as well, and missed a race in Corsica. Presumably that's because he couldn't go with Nibali up that big hill, and lost the race, so he went for some emergency doping, rather than because he'd just ridden 200km at race tempo through freezing rain every day for a week, and got sick as a result?

You misunderstand. Everything Sky do or that happens to Sky is evidence of doping, somehow or other.

 

[JimmyFingers]

Me and all my family have got colds at the moment as well. Could be because we're all doping to win bike races, or could be because it's been the coldest March on record, and there's load of it around? Or a heady combination of the two, I suppose.

I also noticed that Contador got the flu after Tirenno Adriatico as well, and missed a race in Corsica. Presumably that's because he couldn't go with Nibali up that big hill, and lost the race, so he went for some emergency doping, rather than because he'd just ridden 200km at race tempo through freezing rain every day for a week, and got sick as a result?

I managed to dodge colds all through winter, then in March I've had two. I must be doping as well.

 

[MartinGT]

Funnily enough I was talking to a long time member of the BC set up recently. He has a clear anti-doping stance and said that he didn't see any evidence of doping...though, historically (other era), he was aware of a couple of rogue riders "freelancing" whose activities were curiously overlooked/tolerated...although even that was hearsay/suspicion.

That's not to say that SKY are clean, obviously.

Funnily enough I was chatting with a similar chap who roomed with a BC/Sky Coach when they were younger. I asked if he had doped and he said "Aye of course, its too much of a business not to"

BUT

That could be BS also trying to big himself up.

I was also told that when the track lads / lasses come off their training on the veledrome, they are made to wear silver blanket things (I assume like survival blankets) and sit on the sunbed for 20mins straight after a training session

 

[Bernie's eyesore]

At US Postal , the performances were phenomenal by every rider. Roberto Heras, Azevedo top 10 in TDF even when riding for Armstrong. After they left the team, the performances weren't the same again(not even close). They weren't able to duplicate them after leaving the team.
Same case with Sky. The performances at Sky should be duplicated by other teams if they are standard known legal non-cheating non-magical methods. Otherwise the stigma of suspicion will always be attached. Lets see what happens with Rogers, Flecha and others who left Sky.

Presumably the performances of JTL and Dombrowski can also be taken as evidence that Sky aren't doping?

 

[JimmyFingers]

Funnily enough I was chatting with a similar chap who roomed with a BC/Sky Coach when they were younger. I asked if he had doped and he said "Aye of course, its too much of a business not to"

BUT

That could be BS also trying to big himself up.

I was also told that when the track lads / lasses come off their training on the veledrome, they are made to wear silver blanket things (I assume like survival blankets) and sit on the sunbed for 20mins straight after a training session

The sunbed is a new one, but the track people have been using heated leg warmers between races for a while now

 

[Ferminal]

Presumably the performances of JTL and Dombrowski can also be taken as evidence that Sky aren't doping?

Sky has nothing on the Merckx special.

 

[ebandit]

pants on fire

Yes.

It appears to spike up when the testers arrive in Teneriife. But then subsides when they leave.

He's the only rider to have a TUE for blood transfusions laced with EPO.

why continue to lie? is there not enough genuine reasons for suspicion?

Mark L

 

[timmers]

Funnily enough I was chatting with a similar chap who roomed with a BC/Sky Coach when they were younger. I asked if he had doped and he said "Aye of course, its too much of a business not to"
:

Well get on the phone to UKAD! Why not name him here as its only an internet forum and you are anonymous!

 

[xcleigh]

Although I think Sky are the new USPS I want to continue riding on my standard Tuesday training session which Josh has been on since he was with Colpak and even prior. I do not want to be ousted by asking such questions.

If it helps, he isn't fond of BC or the Bald one so don't worry

uh-oh what did they offer you? A free satelitte dish and a years SKY HD subscription. First Walsh has been bought...now members of the clinic! Everyone has a price. Noooooooooooooo.

 

[heart_attack_man]

yep almost all the SKY fan boys joined the forum recently

I certainly joined because of SKY, but I can guarantee I'm no fan boy...

In fact, SKY were the reason I first came to The Clinic... I've been following cycling casually for about 15 years, but in the last couple have started following it in a bit more detail.

SKY = USPS. I commented during last years tour to my partner "This looks exactly like US Postal"... That was no compliment.

Deja vu anyone?

 

[JimmyFingers]

I certainly joined because of SKY, but I can guarantee I'm no fan boy...

In fact, SKY were the reason I first came to The Clinic... I've been following cycling casually for about 15 years, but in the last couple have started following it in a bit more detail.

SKY = USPS. I commented during last years tour to my partner "This looks exactly like US Postal"... That was no compliment.

Deja vu anyone?

Yes. You are definitely the first person to make that comparison here.

 

[The Hitch]

You misunderstand. Everything Sky do or that happens to Sky is evidence of doping, somehow or other.

There have over the last few pages been a few interesting contributions, especially lanarks about the history of "superior training". Yet the only respnse you and a bunch of other sky fans have offered have been the same lame sarcastic "oh even my dog must be doping according to the clinic : smiley."

Lanark's post was very interesting and very relevant to the discussion considering how popular the belief is that sky brought in superior training. Do any of you have any opinion on it, or would that not be part of the game?

 

[heart_attack_man]

Yes. You are definitely the first person to make that comparison here.

Did I say I was the first? Was just trying to point out that even though a lot of fan boys joined around that time, I also joined but for the exact opposite reason.

 

[JimmyFingers]

Did I say I was the first? Was just trying to point out that even though a lot of fan boys joined around that time, I also joined but for the exact opposite reason.

Fair enough but do some back reading and you'll find that comparison has been made hundreds of times here, hence my reaction. Indeed Sky themselves have made that comparison. Also one of the forum's nicknames for them is UKPostal.

Jussayin'

 

[heart_attack_man]

Fair enough but do some back reading and you'll find that comparison has been made hundreds of times here, hence my reaction. Indeed Sky themselves have made that comparison. Also one of the forum's nicknames for them is UKPostal.

Jussayin'

I've done plenty of back reading - Read through this whole thread and hundreds of others in fact. Have been following the sport generally for years.

Never tried to say I was the first to say it - I just said it at the time I was watching it (as many others obviously did).

They're doing what USPS did. That's all. I personally don't need anyone to hold my hand to draw whatever conclusions I deem appropriate. History will no doubt prove one of us right. I'm quite prepared to put my belief in what I'm seeing with my own eyes. You very clearly have a different opinion, and to that you're entitled - however it is foolish and naïve to think that your opinion should sway anybody to believe anything in much the same way it would be foolish of me to think my opinion will change anybody's mind. My opinion is my opinion.

I know what I'm seeing.

I forgot to add: I'm sorry I don't believe in miracles.

 

[JimmyFingers]

I've done plenty of back reading - Read through this whole thread and hundreds of others in fact. Have been following the sport generally for years.

Never tried to say I was the first to say it - I just said it at the time I was watching it (as many others obviously did).

They're doing what USPS did. That's all. I personally don't need anyone to hold my hand to draw whatever conclusions I deem appropriate. History will no doubt prove one of us right. I'm quite prepared to put my belief in what I'm seeing with my own eyes. You very clearly have a different opinion, and to that you're entitled - however it is foolish and naïve to think that your opinion should sway anybody to believe anything in much the same way it would be foolish of me to think my opinion will change anybody's mind. My opinion is my opinion.

I know what I'm seeing.

I forgot to add: I'm sorry I don't believe in miracles.

Good, I respect this and welcome that you acknowledge differing opinions, a fairly rare attribute in here.

 

[horsinabout]

There have over the last few pages been a few interesting contributions, especially lanarks about the history of "superior training". Yet the only respnse you and a bunch of other sky fans have offered have been the same lame sarcastic "oh even my dog must be doping according to the clinic : smiley."

Lanark's post was very interesting and very relevant to the discussion considering how popular the belief is that sky brought in superior training. Do any of you have any opinion on it, or would that not be part of the game?

Training at an elite level is superior by it's very act, and all those who participate in elite sport will be doing superior training. So to do more superior training, which is Sky's implication is an oxymoron. Nothing more than the usual rhetoric I suggest.

 

[Taxus4a]

Tim Kerrison disagrees:
''The number one reason we go there is that it’s a climbing camp, it happens to be at altitude and one of the things we expect to see is an acclimatization to the altitude because one of the demands of the Tour is that you have to be able to perform at altitude. So we don’t go there as an altitude training camp to stimulate red blood cell production, we go there to adapt to be able to perform at altitude. Then there’s just the effect you get from being at a training camp, you are very isolated, there’s nothing you can do there except train and recover. And finally there’s heat acclimatization, it’s generally a lot hotter than anywhere else in the rest of Europe and that’s something else you need to be able to cope with at the Tour and we know that was something that Brad struggled with during the 2012 Tour. He’s now, of our riders, one of the best ones at handling the heat.”'
http://www.biscuittinmedia.com/tim-kerrison-training-wiggins/

Thats why the classic squad was called to attend Teide?

They go for all that thinks, everybody try to train in altitude for stimulate boold cells as well, why Kerrison said another thing, I dont mind, Kerrison say a lot of stupid things.. maybe for to get confused the rivals.. I dont know... he is not clever saying stupid things in a team that lot of people is always looking... but I wouldnt give that a lot of importance

 

[will10]

I certainly joined because of SKY, but I can guarantee I'm no fan boy...

In fact, SKY were the reason I first came to The Clinic... I've been following cycling casually for about 15 years, but in the last couple have started following it in a bit more detail.

SKY = USPS. I commented during last years tour to my partner "This looks exactly like US Postal"... That was no compliment.

Deja vu anyone?

Last year, I cheered for Wiggins at Paris Nice.
I cheered for Wiggins at Romandie.
I cheered for Wiggins as he smashed the opposition in the ITT at the Dauphine.
And then I distinctly remember getting home on the day of the Joux Plane in the Dauphine, scraping around for a stream, and finding a decent one just in time to see 4 Sky riders killing it down to a group of 10 and being genuinely taken aback. Deja vu indeed.

 

[armchairclimber]

It's funny, I first came to the forums a couple of years ago, though had been reading the front end of CN for years prior. I certainly didn't come because of SKY, having a massive antipathy to the brand and deep misgivings about their association with BC.
Those things remain, although my feelings are complicated by the fact that I have enjoyed watching British cyclists like Cav and Wiggins having success on the road....Froome too, for that matter.
When I first came to the clinic I found it depressing...then funny. I'd always worked from the presumption that the sport was filthy and that almost everyone at the front end was using PEDs of one sort or another. It was only when reading the sports science guys' analysis of climbing power output and reading Ashenden (when he was still involved) that gave me reason the think that things were improving.
The entrenchment of the views is what makes the place entertaining...some of The Hog's most spurious claims in particular just make for amusement. It's like the snug of the local pub that has been invaded by argumentative types with a low boredom threshold who all happen to like cycling. There are some on here who hold a contrary view to mine who I respect greatly....others are just mad people who want to win the internet (I won't name names).
Why do I come here? Because it's more fun than the main forum.