Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[lavieclaire]

Yes, Will. That's a bit odd isn't it. He could at least get his story straight. I seem to recall a fair few riders getting their Maths wrong when dismissing the Armstrong era as 15 years ago

 

[will10]

"Here (at Tirreno-Adriatico) people said we were riding to numbers but they should do their homework before saying things like that. The guys rode with compact chain sets on Sunday and Monday and so didn’t have SRM's on their bikes," Brailsford pointed out.

And yet they left the head units on, odd.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/tirreno-adriatico-2013/stage-5/photos/255625

 

[The Hitch]

Brailsford is upset about Sky allegations.

I also noticed that a while ago when looking at this pic

scary

maybe im confusing inner beauty with outer beauty but this is the resemblence I see

 

[Catwhoorg]

A genuine reason for the 80 days 40 days could be

Contracted to work a maximum of 80 days
Only actually worked for 40 days

But I think thats a bit of a stretch myself.

 

[mastersracer]

where did you get this?

Do you have any backup to this whatsoever?. Why would a clean peloton not have attack?

without doping, slipstream is less (since speeds are slower)

Msr became a borefest in the epo era as sprinters began to get over the hill easy. Similarly ittrs can be doped to stay in the mountains and teams of itt riders can be doped to form trains.

In the 80s before the epo era cycling was just as if not more aggressive.

The 80's comparisons are naive. Cycling, like many other sports, increasingly draws from a larger pool of riders due to its internationalization. The result is less variance in the performance of riders. The attacks in the 80s and before were in part due to the fact that a small pool of riders (team leaders) were significantly better than the rest of riders and incentive structures were different before contracts were tied to rider point systems. Team leaders could win GC jerseys and points jerseys (last done by Hinault - Merckx won all 3 jerseys in a single tour). The irony is that if a rider today dominated a race the way team leaders used to this forum would go apoplectic.

 

[thehog]

A genuine reason for the 80 days 40 days could be

Contracted to work a maximum of 80 days
Only actually worked for 40 days

But I think thats a bit of a stretch myself.

“We have no problems in answering questions on Leinders, we’ve got nothing to hide”

Silence.

“Panadol, strepsil, that’s all he gave me. In 80, I mean 40 days, just Panadol. Just like any other Doctor at Saxo or wherever.”

 

[lavieclaire]

“We have no problems in answering questions on Leinders, we’ve got nothing to hide”

Silence.

Do we know if any questions were actually asked at the press conference? If so, what were they and did he not answer them?

 

[Franklin]

I agree that the tactic is not a sign of clean cycling, but nor is it a sign of doping, it is more a tactic that particularly suits wiggins riding stlye

Well, Mr. Brailsford claims it is a sign of cleaner cycling

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

The 80's comparisons are naive. Cycling, like many other sports, increasingly draws from a larger pool of riders due to its internationalization. The result is less variance in the performance of riders. The attacks in the 80s and before were in part due to the fact that a small pool of riders (team leaders) were significantly better than the rest of riders and incentive structures were different before contracts were tied to rider point systems. Team leaders could win GC jerseys and points jerseys (last done by Hinault - Merckx won all 3 jerseys in a single tour). The irony is that if a rider today dominated a race the way team leaders used to this forum would go apoplectic.

The raceleaders in the eighties were raceleaders because they were so much better. Nowadays we have domestiques who are better than raceleaders, that is the difference. Incroyable. Why is Sammy Sanchez dropped by a domestique from SKY. Bad form? We saw his form 2 days ago, nothing wrong with the form matey. Just like on la Planche. Domestiques dropping climbers like a rock.

The only ones being naive are the blind ones.

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

And yet they left the head units on, odd.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/tirreno-adriatico-2013/stage-5/photos/255625

Do the head units still function as speedos/HRMs without the power data feed?

 

[JMBeaushrimp]

Do the head units still function as speedos/HRMs without the power data feed?

Henao's got SRM cranks in that photo...

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

Why is Sammy Sanchez dropped by a domestique from SKY. Bad form? We saw his form 2 days ago, nothing wrong with the form matey. Just like on la Planche.

Reality check here - 2 days ago was 2 days ago. La Planche was 9 months ago. Form fluctuates. Sanchez had a stinker that day on La Planche, and his results in the run-up to the Tour last year were not consistent with his usual levels.

 

[mastersracer]

The raceleaders in the eighties were raceleaders because they were so much better. Nowadays we have domestiques who are better than raceleaders, that is the difference. Incroyable. Why is Sammy Sanchez dropped by a domestique from SKY. Bad form? We saw his form 2 days ago, nothing wrong with the form matey. Just like on la Planche. Domestiques dropping climbers like a rock.

The only ones being naive are the blind ones.

maybe you need to look up the meaning of variance.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Reality check here - 2 days ago was 2 days ago. La Planche was 9 months ago. Form fluctuates. Sanchez had a stinker that day on La Planche, and his results in the run-up to the Tour last year were not consistent with his usual levels.

Come on Wallace, it was the same and you know it. SS does not come in form in 2 days unlike other miracle riders.

maybe you need to look up the meaning of variance.

Maybe u should just open your eyes while looking at the teevee.

5.9w/k, my ar@e

 

[Franklin]

You would have saved yourself a bit of bother if you'd read my post. I said 'take Sky out of the equation'.

Sure J.

Now of course his rightuous anger was because of what people say about Sky, but, "Let's take Sky put of the equation".

1. Logic fallacy, unless he wants to say Leinders cheated at Sky.
2. 15 years domination at the OS. Flat out fantasy.

Oh my... his rightuous anger is still based on falsehoods, even if I spin it as much as you want.

Without doping cycling will not see blistering attacks and getaways on the mountains. It will see well-drilled teams comprised of talented riders with powe meters knowing exactly how hard they can go and for how long.

Now of course we could look at history... OH MY! You are describing doped cycling as well.

As for Sky, they are certainly as described above, no doubt about that whatsoever. Whether they also have some chemical assistance, who knows.

So you actually agree that Dave brailsford is talking absolute nonsense after all? So your "he' right" is actually, yes, you guys are correct, Dave Brailsford is sprouting absolute BS here.

So why are you arguing on his behalf anyway? You agree the facts show he is a liar... so what is your goal here while defending him?

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

Henao's got SRM cranks in that photo...

I'll take your word for that. My budget has never justified getting up close and personal to SRM kit! I'm no mechanic either. Would you change chainset along with cranks or just the chainset? I genuinely don't know.

Someone is going to have to go for the nuclear option and count the teeth on that big chainring and check that the photo is actually on one of the "Compact Days".

 

[peloton]

Nothing to see here, move along

[/IMG]

 

[bobbins]

The Brailsford interview was a car crash!

Because I didn't dope the track team I can't have doped my road team.

He needs to remember that the general public aren't as thick as the dumb corporate acolytes that he is surrounded by these days.

If they are clean (and I hope they are) then FFS prove it to us Sir Dave.

These reasons he is coming out with are making it look more and more suspicious.

 

[thehog]

Nothing to see here, move along

Good to see the Froome-Dawg.... errrrr... looking down!

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

Come on Wallace, it was the same and you know it. SS does not come in form in 2 days unlike other miracle riders.

I really fail to understand why you're trying to claim Sanchez was in good form on La Planche in the Tour last year. He patently wasn't and barely beat Cancellara to the finish.

There's enough unfavourable data relating to Sky without you having to pretend that an armada of Sky domestiques crushed an in form Sanchez last year.

 

[mastersracer]

Come on Wallace, it was the same and you know it. SS does not come in form in 2 days unlike other miracle riders.Maybe u should just open your eyes while looking at the teevee.

5.9w/k, my ar@e

In other words, you have no evidence for your claims -just subjective emotional nonsense. The SRM files, climb times, etc are all available. Go ahead, try to counter a bit of objective evidence that shows you're flat wrong.

 

[thehog]

In other words, you have no evidence for your claims -just subjective emotional nonsense. The SRM files, climb times, etc are all available. Go ahead, try to counter a bit of objective evidence that shows you're flat wrong.

From the guy who said Froome gained time on the decent on Monday!

Lol!

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

In other words, you have no evidence for your claims -just subjective emotional nonsense. The SRM files, climb times, etc are all available. Go ahead, try to counter a bit of objective evidence that shows you're flat wrong.

I posted a nice set of data just a few pages ago on the w/k, I guess you just dit not see them.

Wiggins 5.98w/k versus 5.97w/k for Armstrong. Go search. At the same time, Evans was waaaaaaay back to that figure. Never mind the numbers, masterbot.

Science is PR.

 

[SundayRider]

I posted a nice set of data just a few pages ago on the w/k, I guess you just dit not see them.

Wiggins 5.98w/k versus 5.97w/k for Armstrong. Go search. At the same time, Evans was waaaaaaay back to that figure. Never mind the numbers, masterbot.

Science is PR.

were did those numbers come from FGL? Thanks

 

[lavieclaire]

Sure J.

Now of course his rightuous anger was because of what people say about Sky, but, "Let's take Sky put of the equation".

1. Logic fallacy, unless he wants to say Leinders cheated at Sky.
2. 15 years domination at the OS. Flat out fantasy.

Oh my... his rightuous anger is still based on falsehoods, even if I spin it as much as you want.




Now of course we could look at history... OH MY! You are describing doped cycling as well.



So you actually agree that Dave brailsford is talking absolute nonsense after all? So your "he' right" is actually, yes, you guys are correct, Dave Brailsford is sprouting absolute BS here.

So why are you arguing on his behalf anyway? You agree the facts show he is a liar... so what is your goal here while defending him?

I think you might be reading more into my post than was there.

I'm saying that I think clean cycling in the modern era would be muted. No more looks from Armstrong then an unassailable attack, no more Ricco episodes, or Contador for that matter.

Whether what we are seeing now is clean cycling I'm really not sure, but it sure as hell looks more muted than the EPO era.

I said leave Sky out of the equation because it is pretty obvious that some of you guys have lost all sense of perspective over this. I think the hysterical reactions when you think somebody is 'defending Brailsford' says it all. You guys can think what you want about that, but I'll speak as I find, good and bad.