Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

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Afrank

Afrank

Aug 16, 2011
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Bernie's eyesore said:
Good to see that Jimmy and Thehog are now friends.

On the subject of Sky in the classics, were they really that bad? 4th in the Omloop, 6th in MSR, 3rd and 9th in DDV, 4th in E3 and 7th in GW. Probably a par set of results given their riders. It's only being classed as a disappointment because it doesn't match up to their record in stage races and because certain people here thought they would return from Tenerife riding like Superman.
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They were only bad if your of the opinion that Sky are now going to easily dominate everything and can pick and choose which races they want to win.

For having no top classics riders, they have done well enough.
 
DirtyWorks

DirtyWorks

Feb 10, 2010
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MatParker117 said:
I have a strong suspicion that Sky may just throw money at Cancellara to solve there classics problems.
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Who says not winning one-day races is a problem? Per Afrank's post, they did well!

It's far easier to plan and execute a podium placing in Grand Tours and stage races.

Get the Watts/Kilo ratio to some fantastically high number, hit the front on the climbs, do at least okay on TT's and there's your podium.

We can thank Ferrari for really simplifing the "how" of winning stage races.
 
Catwhoorg

Catwhoorg

Aug 24, 2011
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Uran and Henao ?

Neither in the top #20 by CQ or UCI points, but both heavily sought after at the time Sky signed them
 
The Hitch

The Hitch

Jun 14, 2010
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keithmcmahon said:
OK, not quite top 20, but what about this more controversial one?

mr #23 2010
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/rider.asp?riderid=114

probably, if not the best, one of the best, team captains in the peloton.
something needed after the sham 2010 season
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Rogers less so than EBH. Unlike EBH Rogers did come to my mind. One could say Gerrans as well, but neither are quite Cancellara level.

Catwhoorg said:
Uran and Henao ?

Neither in the top #20 by CQ or UCI points, but both heavily sought after at the time Sky signed them
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I didn't say they don't sign good riders. But Cancellara is something else. The poster said he wouldnt be surprised if they signed Cancellara and others have in the past said that Sky bought all the best riders. Signing Cancellara in order to guarantee success at the big races.

Have Sky ever done that?
Have they ever signed anyone with a proven record of challenging and winning at the top races (What today would be Boonen, Gilbert, Cancellara, Purito, Valverde, Contador, Sagan, Greipel, Cavendish Nibali, Froome, Wiggins, Tony Martin maybe even Hejsedal Sanchez and Schleck.)

Cavendish is the only one they signed but that was as much because he was one of them and a Brit, not to win big races. In fact Sky made clear that he was allowed to choose as his main season goal, a race that he wouldnt even ride with the trade team.
 
Catwhoorg

Catwhoorg

Aug 24, 2011
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There is no chance they will sign Fabian, a "known" Fuetes client.

Him signing the zero tolerance policy would be the final nail in its coffin. The Public (not the clinic) would see it as a joke at that point.
 
K

keithmcmahon

Jan 4, 2013
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The Hitch said:
Rogers less so than EBH. Unlike EBH Rogers did come to my mind. One could say Gerrans as well, but neither are quite Cancellara level.



I didn't say they don't sign good riders. But Cancellara is something else. The poster said he wouldnt be surprised if they signed Cancellara and others have in the past said that Sky bought all the best riders. Signing Cancellara in order to guarantee success at the big races.

Have Sky ever done that?
Have they ever signed anyone with a proven record of challenging and winning at the top races (What today would be Boonen, Gilbert, Cancellara, Purito, Valverde, Contador, Sagan, Greipel, Cavendish Nibali, Froome, Wiggins, Tony Martin maybe even Hejsedal Sanchez and Schleck.)

Cavendish is the only one they signed but that was as much because he was one of them and a Brit, not to win big races. In fact Sky made clear that he was allowed to choose as his main season goal, a race that he wouldnt even ride with the trade team.
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At the end of the day, it depends more upon the sponsors views than db.

I suspect that both the main sponsors news corp / pinarello would be happier with winning the giro (don't forget sky italia is part of newscorp) than doing anything in the Classics. Personally, I think the transfer policy of 2012 was buying better quality domestiques to support two GT's worth of SkyTrains.

Having said that db knows that there is more in cycling fans hearts than just the GT's. Bear in mind, ebh is expensive and at the moment it looks as if he won't deliver a classics win. Releasing him will free up lots of money. re has already said ebh needs to justify his wages - in so many words.

Also, if Wiggo wins the Giro, I think his main target for 2014 will be paris-roubaix and lbl. So EBH may get a reprieve to help him.

One way or another, I think the transfer scenario of buying a classics winner may only occur e if nothing has happened by spring 2014 with the current squad.
 
L

Lanark

May 12, 2010
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Catwhoorg said:
There is no chance they will sign Fabian, a "known" Fuetes client.

Him signing the zero tolerance policy would be the final nail in its coffin. The Public (not the clinic) would see it as a joke at that point.
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The public have no idea about those Fuentes rumours. The fact that Knaven signed that 'policy' is ludicrous enough, nobody with a brain thinks that zero tolerance policy is anything but window dressing.
 
the sceptic

the sceptic

Jul 21, 2012
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Catwhoorg said:
There is no chance they will sign Fabian, a "known" Fuetes client.

Him signing the zero tolerance policy would be the final nail in its coffin. The Public (not the clinic) would see it as a joke at that point.
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Noone cared when they signed Rogers so why should it be any different with Cancellara. As long as they havent tested positive, that means they are clean.
 
C

Cyivel

Aug 5, 2012
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Well if the blood bags get released then it could come out that he is which wouldn't be good for him/them, if nothing comes out then yeah public wont know/care.
 
J

JimmyFingers

Jul 17, 2012
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Lanark said:
The public have no idea about those Fuentes rumours. The fact that Knaven signed that 'policy' is ludicrous enough, nobody with a brain thinks that zero tolerance policy is anything but window dressing.
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Not one media report has mentioned Luigi, not one media report has had anything but praise for Cancellara's performance.
 
J

JimmyFingers

Jul 17, 2012
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The Hitch said:
Rogers less so than EBH. Unlike EBH Rogers did come to my mind. One could say Gerrans as well, but neither are quite Cancellara level.



I didn't say they don't sign good riders. But Cancellara is something else. The poster said he wouldnt be surprised if they signed Cancellara and others have in the past said that Sky bought all the best riders. Signing Cancellara in order to guarantee success at the big races.

Have Sky ever done that?
Have they ever signed anyone with a proven record of challenging and winning at the top races (What today would be Boonen, Gilbert, Cancellara, Purito, Valverde, Contador, Sagan, Greipel, Cavendish Nibali, Froome, Wiggins, Tony Martin maybe even Hejsedal Sanchez and Schleck.)

Cavendish is the only one they signed but that was as much because he was one of them and a Brit, not to win big races. In fact Sky made clear that he was allowed to choose as his main season goal, a race that he wouldnt even ride with the trade team.
Click to expand...

I think Sky's generalpolicy is to sign potential rather than proven talent, plus there is a clear policy of developing as much British talent as possible. However that is tempered by ruthlessness and a devotion to numbers.

They may go for a marquee signing but Cancellara is too tainted now, they contradicted their own policy in the past granted, I think now they are aware they can't fudge the matter, and it will come back and bite them further down the track.
 
Dear Wiggo

Dear Wiggo

Sep 29, 2012
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keithmcmahon said:
Having said that db knows that there is more in cycling fans hearts than just the GT's. Bear in mind, ebh is expensive and at the moment it looks as if he won't deliver a classics win. Releasing him will free up lots of money. re has already said ebh needs to justify his wages - in so many words.
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re = Rod Ellingworth?

Any chance for a link to where he was saying or hinting at this?
 
K

keithmcmahon

Jan 4, 2013
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Dear Wiggo said:
re = Rod Ellingworth?

Any chance for a link to where he was saying or hinting at this?
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It was actually in a Sunday Times article by David Walsh so is not available publically, but here is the quote

Ellingworth is an affable former rider who has risen through the ranks of Team Sky’s management structure and though he smiles a lot, his good humour comes with constant reminders that the team are in a results business.

“Edvald [Boasson Hagen] is on a good contract and he needs to win more than he has . . . Pete Kennaugh is a very good rider with a lot of potential but it has to be turned into performances . . . our two young Americans Joe [Dombrowski] and Ian [Boswell] are talented but they haven’t had the physical development they should have had over the last two years. They will need a little time. Young Josh [Edmondson] has performed extremely well this week but we had to talk to him about things, like not answering his phone.”
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Sky also insisted on ebh changing coaches for this year as well to someone internal to the team.
 
Dear Wiggo

Dear Wiggo

Sep 29, 2012
12,197
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keithmcmahon said:
It was actually in a Sunday Times article by David Walsh so is not available publically, but here is the quote

Sky also insisted on ebh changing coaches for this year as well to someone internal to the team.
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Thanks. That's interesting. The dichotomy of the GT team training and results and Rod basically saying these other guys are not up to scratch.

Funny to read Rod has "risen through the ranks" considering he coached Wiggins to a TdF 4th in 2009. Would have thought he'd be starting in the inner circle from the beginning...
 
L

Lanark

May 12, 2010
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Ferminal said:
Do we add Flecha to the list of flinchers?
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You mean in the sense that he was afraid to sign the Sky zero-tolerance policy?

As a rider of Vacansoleil he had to sign a similair document saying he never doped. He obviously isn't afraid to lie.
 
F

Ferminal

Jul 3, 2009
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Lanark said:
You mean in the sense that he was afraid to sign the Sky zero-tolerance policy?

As a rider of Vacansoleil he had to sign a similair document saying he never doped. He obviously isn't afraid to lie.
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Ah, that policy has certainly worked for VCD :eek:

Was Flecha's contract up at Sky?

Doesn't look like it:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/flecha-knees-barry-renew-contracts-with-sky
http://www1.skysports.com/news/17564/7237650/

I wonder if you got a payout for admitting? Good financial decision if so.
 
mattghg

mattghg

Feb 19, 2013
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Ferminal said:
I wonder if you got a payout for admitting? Good financial decision if so.
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IIRC there was some statement from Sky that this is the case. When they were getting everyone to (re-)sign the declaration last year, people were saying this was really bad for transparency because no-one would admit to doping in the past if they knew they'd be sacked as a result. Possibly as a result, some statement came out saying that anyone who admitted it then and there would at least get a payoff, whereas if anything came out later they'd be sacked immediately and without a payoff (thus apparently creating some motivation for people to be honest).
 
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