Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Galic Ho]

a whole lot of codswallop.

I didn't read any of it. You're a troll and SkyPED fanboy. I don't block people, because unlike Wigans and will10, I am not a coward and sniveling punk.

But thanks for replying and outing yourself. Knew I'd forgotten some names. Do remind your ilk by PM that they can do the same. You are only here to troll. You're not serious about cleaning blatant doping up in pro cycling. Just throwing down excuses. Only ever the one argument, defend Team SkyPED.

So all the serious posters, kill this guys argument in the rear end by not responding to him. You're one of the guys who have repeatedly derailed this thread.

 

[nuggs1]

Bored now, come back with real proof not heresy.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Gallic Ho I have to say I agree with you and your post.

Especially the TT results...wiggins and Froome winning by just WAY too much time to seem reasonable compared to everyone else...it was just too far out of line.

And the 'wiggins complex' that is on display...'Napoleonic' describes the aggression pretty well....he is on edge and the tension there is palpable.

I agree, Nibs should totally keep it going...make this a real race.

Sorry to say that I think you are spot on

 

[BroDeal]

Bored now, come back with real proof not heresy.

It is now heresy to doubt The Mighty Sky. Burn the witches!

 

[taiwan]

Froome showing he is yet again far stronger than the team leader. Sky again showing that they strongly favour Wiggins at all costs. I’d love to see someone try to square that circle in terms of the logic of “systematic doping at Sky”. I’m still very much suspecting a lone doper in Froome, or at the very least, that he has a different supply to everyone else.

Wiggins is the long term project, the trusted name, Froome, concened about potentially losing his contract at the end of the season, tries somehing new at the Vuelta, and turns into Ricco. Naive fans are impressed at the awakening of this sleeping giant, and he becomes a big name. Sky obviously have to maintain he's clean, and he has forced his way into their plans.

Today once again confirmed that Wiggins would be extremely vulnerable without Froome to pace him up the mountains. Vulnerable even to “merely” very good climbers like Nibali. Imagine what an elite climber like a fit Schleck would have done on todays stage – and this on a climb whose relatively shallow ascent should have suited Wiggins.

This was arguably the most selective stage of the Tour, and Nibali is looking like the best climber outside of Sky. That was likely the most trouble Wiggins will have in the race, and his lead was never under threat - Nibali needed 2', and Wiggins wil spank him in the TT anyway.

Rogers (multi times World TT champ & Tour of California Winner) and Porte (GT top 10 and white jersey winner at age of 25 years) are being described as average riders by those of a certain persuasion here. Half the peloton would give their eye teeth for such modest career success! Maybe there are no climbs in California and Italy?

And for those suggesting Sky make Porte & Rogers peel off for appearances sake, did you not see how that made Wiggins vulnerable?

There are better examples you could have chosen for Rogers, but anyhow - he was on T-Mobile which had a team wide doping programme, and he says he's doing his best ever numbers (not sure if trolling though). Porte has not been consistent in his climbing - where was he in the mountains for Bert? - but he's in top form right on time for this Tour. How would it have looked if the final selection had been Pinot, Van Den Broeck, Nibali, Wiggins, Froome , Porte and Rogers? Would that have been desirable in order to protect Wiggins?

I’m also glad to see the Wiggins getting gapped on the final climb by a French lad who just turned 22 (and has already put in an effort for a stage win) hasn’t thrown our diligent Clinic bloodhounds off the scent, eh lads?

Oh that's right! Phew it all looks totally credible then.

 

[Jeremiah]

Bored now, come back with real proof not heresy.

Heresy? You think Sky are Gods?

 

[mastersracer]

I didn't read any of it. You're a troll and SkyPED fanboy. I don't block people, because unlike Wigans and will10, I am not a coward and sniveling punk.

But thanks for replying and outing yourself. Knew I'd forgotten some names. Do remind your ilk by PM that they can do the same. You are only here to troll. You're not serious about cleaning blatant doping up in pro cycling. Just throwing down excuses. Only ever the one argument, defend Team SkyPED.

So all the serious posters, kill this guys argument in the rear end by not responding to him. You're one of the guys who have repeatedly derailed this thread.

Actually, I presented REASONS for my view, but then you wouldn't know that because you don't read posts, apparently. Forums are supposed to be for exchanges - but go ahead with your monologues. Same old tinfoil hat histrionics.

 

[taiwan]

Still on

Michelle Cound ‏@michellecound
Anybody else spot the rope-a-dope today or was it that convincing?? ))

Michelle Cound ‏@michellecound
for clarity rope-a-dope: strategies in which one party purposely puts itself in what appears to be a losing position

Don't understand what tactical advantage it could give Wiggins to ride ~50m behind his GC rivals. If that's what she's talking about. Apart from to look more credible, but I assume that's not what she meant.

 

[Kender]

Don't understand what tactical advantage it could give Wiggins to ride ~50m behind his GC rivals. If that's what she's talking about. Apart from to look more credible, but I assume that's not what she meant.

she's saying that froome put himself into a losing position even though he's the strongest rider... maybe

 

[taiwan]

Mind you, considering who the team's sponsor is, they may not be above deliberately courting controversy. Any publicity is good publicity and all that. But I may be getting a bit 'tinfoil' here. The stuff the team says. "VAM", "US Postal", "Banesto", "best ever numbers", "c**ts"...

 

[DirtyWorks]

This would carry more weight if those condemning Sky relentlessly in fast proliferating threads on this site offered any evidence for their view

Here we go, yet again with requests for evidence. You have established that you alone decide what qualifies as evidence and what does not. And thus, a perfectly circular discussion where you get to reject very suspicious trips to Tenerife, Rabbo doctors, and super-star performances out of nowhere as somehow insufficient evidence.

Finally, this is not the place to drop phrases like "null hypothesis" and "random distributions." There's precious little science/stats that can be applied in this scenario. Bottom line: it doesn't make your unyielding position any better.

 

[Kender]

if not she'd be implying wiggo did it on purpose.

he's just not that sort of character to willingly give ground. he genuinely popped when froome accellerated. Sky's radio was going crazy telling froome to throw out the sand bags

 

[Zam_Olyas]

she's saying that froome put himself into a losing position even though he's the strongest rider... maybe

I agree with this.

 

[Benotti69]

Bored now, come back with real proof not heresy.

How about TeamSky come up with some transparency!

 

[Kender]

How about TeamSky come up with some transparency!

i want to know what training data they gave to ASO

 

[stampedingviking]

Ahhh. The old dolphin. If the guy you were listening to was paying attention, he could have dropped the other photos. You know, the 'other' photos. Alberto Contador was in some...on their joint holiday AFTER the 2009 Tour de France.

How about a mod reminds the troll to not play in the serious threads. That's what you are doing. You have no excuse, you've been a member here since 2009. Oh snap, the post count is down. Let me guess, we'd check and find majority have been made this season when Wigans (reverting back to this spelling because he deserves zero respect) was racing. If you'd paid attention around here in 2009, you'd have realised where the pictures were from and where. Check the hair for starters. Different hair cuts. You'd also realise the biggest Andy Schleck fan used the picture for most of 2010 as his avatar pic.

What you've done is try and perpetuate another lie on behalf of team Sky. The lie LA used, that the opposition are lazy and out of form. Yeah, because Nibali, Evans and every other major GC rider, is so out of form, they have been half-@rsing it this season. Deliberate trolling just like team SkyPED is deliberately doping. Go back to the pro forum, or one of the UK forums and stay with your ilk.

Oh and I would ask all the people here who seriously want to talk about doping to COMPLETELY ignore the blatant clowns who have come here to troll, who offer no rational argument and no answers to the questions posed. Just excuses and hammering of the team SkyPED deceitful PR blabber. Majority are new to the forum, the rest are blind fanboys, like Gloin22, Waterloo, someone with a tag beginning with F (there are 2, one is pro the other is anti SkyPED) etc. They belong in the pro forum, and ironically ONLY post in anything to do with Sky. That's because they are trolling fanboys. Do make a distinction for those who appear to be curious, like SaxonUK. Why? 100+ pages in three days and at least 50% of it is disruptive garbage. The posting synonymous with what Arbiter/BPC, Polish and ChrisE have done in the past and we all know the effect that had. Ignore them and they will post less frequently. They are taking advantage of the mods leniency.

You mean anyone who disagrees with your point of view?

 

[Zam_Olyas]

 

[The Cobra]

@inrg:
''One for the sports scientists, Janez Brajkovic was 8th on today's stage with an estimated 5.3W/kg on the final climb''

Christ 5.3W/kg!! The EPO era really has returned with a vengeance!! Lord only knows what crazy power Froome dog had, 5.5W/kg or something the crazy doped up mofo. Lance would be proud of those numbers.

I repeat what I said in the power estimates thread. The riders that are actually releasing their data are showing some of the lowest power numbers we've ever seen for final climbs in the Tour. You guys are crazy with Sky hate and ignoring reality. The stage was done at a slow pace. The power numbers are low. Where's the evidence of doping?? If sky turned up with this kind of form a few years ago they'd all get slaughtered on the first climb!

The Sky train know they don't have to ride till the end so they can bury themselves then sit up when other riders are trying to keep something back for later on in the stage. The biggest thing here is the level of competition they are facing. This year has been very poor no doubt. If Contador was here in top shape or Andy Schleck this thread wouldn't even exist. I have seen nothing to suggest rampant team doping so far based on reality not irrational sky hatred.

 

[DirtyWorks]

...
Does this prove Sky is clean? - no.
Are these performances at the top end of Porte & Rogers abilities? - yes.
Are they strong indications of a teamwide doping programme? - for me, no.

If Rogers and Porte had done a Stage 7 up the final climb today I'd have likely been jumping sides in this debate.

I can respect this kind of thinking, but I like the phrase CN used of Froom "breaking the script" today. They did it twice already, and can't do it again. So, viewers like you won't switch sides. But, these results are so one-sided that it's reminiscent of an Armstrong and Rasmussen (chicken) once-a-year performance.

Unfortunately, I think we see a cat-and-mouse game where no one gains time on Wiggans and Froome until some ridiculous results at the stage 19 TT. Effectively the last stage of the TdF. http://www.cyclingnews.com/tour-de-france/stage-19

 

[Zam_Olyas]

It is now heresy to doubt The Mighty Sky. Burn the witches!

lolzzzzz

 

[Parrot23]

"With three kilometres left I could hardly climb at all."

http://www.cyclingnews.com/tour-de-france/stage-11/results

 

[ferryman]

You mean anyone who disagrees with your point of view?

No, he means people like you. Didn't you get it or are you going to come back and counter the points he made about people like you?

 

[Galic Ho]

Hey, I thought of that excellent line all by myself! Damn, you mean I'm still bone idle and without achievement? I thought I had a budding career as a fortune cookie writer with that excellent chestnut. Back on the dole queue for me.

As caruut and rhubroma were saying, the media is complicit because they have a product to sell. P&P certainly more so than others, but all are compromised to some degree. Then there's others who are too stupid to realise they're being manipulated: a Greek-Aussie witless wonder called Mike Tomalaris.

Believe it or not. Tomo and Tan Man, aka, the A Team (A-hole really) have actually put some articles up that show they are starting to question the myth. Tan Man even brought it up on the SBS podcast. Talked about doping. Tomo was saying Wigans will not be a popular winner. Even was questioning the riding the other night and how Sky were so good. They're slow on the uptake, but not entirely ridiculous. They're thinking differently than in 2008 when Saunier, Ricco, Pieoploi and Cobo were making a joke of the other riders.

 

[Parrot23]

I repeat what I said in the power estimates thread. The riders that are actually releasing their data are showing some of the lowest power numbers we've ever seen for final climbs in the Tour. You guys are crazy with Sky hate and ignoring reality. The stage was done at a slow pace. The power numbers are low. Where's the evidence of doping?? If sky turned up with this kind of form a few years ago they'd all get slaughtered on the first climb!

The Sky train know they don't have to ride till the end so they can bury themselves then sit up when other riders are trying to keep something back for later on in the stage. The biggest thing here is the level of competition they are facing. This year has been very poor no doubt. If Contador was here in top shape or Andy Schleck this thread wouldn't even exist. I have seen nothing to suggest rampant team doping so far based on reality not irrational sky hatred.

+1, of course. You're right.

 

[ferryman]

I agree with this.

It's the Ali v Foreman fight she is referring to. Ali deliberately took a beating, mainly on the ropes, for the first half of the fight to sap Foreman's strength. He (Ali) then unleashed a brutal attack to knock out Foreman under incredible odds for the win. What is this woman telling us