Tejay Van Garderen Discussion Thread

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I have no idea what the deal is with Tejay. Maybe he needs a better team? Maybe he needs a new role with BMC or another team? Maybe it's his training/peaking? Maybe it's in his head? Or quite simply, he just isn't good enough to podium at a GT. He had two really good TDF's, in 2012 and 2013 (he missed a BIG chance at the L'Alpe D'Huez that year, losing out to Riblon), and I think that could have been career altering for him. Since then he's been close the first week or so in GT's, but then either slowly lost time and settled for a top 10, or imploded on or two stages and everyone forgot about him.

He showed promise at HTC and as I mentioned with BMC in the early years of his attempts at the Tour, but by now, late 20's, he should be at or very near his best. He also had Evans to learn from, and Hincapie, and a host of other really good riders. BMC may not be the biggest or wealthiest team out there, but it's pretty darn good. Like some have already said here and the official Giro 2017 threads, he will either change his role at BMC or go somewhere else. I don't see BMC wasting more resources to make sure he is the GC man at the GT's. Why doesn't he ever try to go for the breakaway's once he's lost his chance at high GC rank? Is he shy about it? Does he feel mentally toast to fight in a different situation? Is he advised not to?
 
You got the numbers a bit wrong, he was very good in 2012 and 2014. In 2015, it seemed he had taken another step, but it all went down from there and he has basically cracked on every demanding MTF ever since.

Lost cause.
 
Jun 30, 2014
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Valv.Piti said:
You got the numbers a bit wrong, he was very good in 2012 and 2014. In 2015, it seemed he had taken another step, but it all went down from there and he has basically cracked on every demanding MTF ever since.

Lost cause.
Yes, in 2015 he lost the Dauphine because of bad tactics (trying to respond to Froome's attack when he had been able to beat on the Pra-Loup stage by riding at his own pace) and then he had the bad meltdown at the Tour and since then he's no longer the same rider.
 
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Valv.Piti said:
You got the numbers a bit wrong, he was very good in 2012 and 2014. In 2015, it seemed he had taken another step, but it all went down from there and he has basically cracked on every demanding MTF ever since.

Lost cause.

Well yes, he was good in 2014, but in 2013 he had a real good shot at winning on L'Alpe, and he was in the GC mix for a while. Of course, 2014 it became wide open since Contador and Froome had to abandon early in the tour, and even when Nibali was riding away from everyone, Tejay could have done something to get on the podium, but the Frenchies were tough and he didn't quite have it. 2015 was supposed to be his year, again, but he completely blew up and yeah, hasn't recovered from it.
 
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Escarabajo said:
LOL. Why retirement?

I know he cannot podium in a GT anymore but there is a lot of room between GT podium and retirement.

There is no need to retire but there is a need to re -examine his role in ANY team

And I never remember TJ abandoning 3 days before Paris while lying in 3rd ? What race was that ?

He was 5th in 2 Tours but both Tours lacked (at the time) alot of top level competetion
He is in some ways a victim of his success as he has found it difficult to live up early results.
J Van den Broek has been 4th in 2 Tours but has adapted to be a dom ...but his problem was physical borne out of crashes..but still adapted

It is easy to see TJs is not physical (even though not the most explosive climber) ...its more mental

Just have a look at The Cycling podcast latest Friends special on Roche versus Vincentini in 1987 ...Everyone in the team agreed Vincentini was probably a better rider than Roche but he never really won a race again ..and never a GT
Mental strength is key to success and Van Garderen has not shown that ...after a bad day he has a worse day ....I think he has the physical ability....His team would know his numbers ...its just he is very fragile
 
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HelloDolly said:
And I never remember TJ abandoning 3 days before Paris while lying in 3rd ? What race was that ?
2015 Tour. He was in third place after stage 16, going into the second rest day--only 22 seconds behind Quintana.
He abandoned on stage 17.
Alexandre B. said five days before Paris, not three.
 
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So sad to see this but that's just the way it is right now. He deffo needs some sort of shakeup. New team minimum, some Euro quality team or Orica would be great. Also physically and mentally more aggressive man should be found.

Tomorrow he'll do a decent timetrial I guess but..then what? :rolleyes:
 
I can't believe it is simply mental. Sadly I think Tejay is the complete opposite to Chris Horner - an early bloomer. He seems past his best at just 28 when most riders would be approaching their best years at that age. It is obvious his 2012 TdF form whilst still just 23 years of age can no longer be replicated let alone improved upon. I think he cops a lot of undue criticism.
 
I guess 2012 is pretty self-explanatory: heavy TT route.
2014 is a whole other deal, but the field was weaker.
Anyway, if we analyze it, Pinot improved from a 10th place in 2012 to a 3rd place in 2014. The remaining field wasn't really that strong (for the year, because Bardet has also improved significantly along with Mollema), but there was also Zubeldia and Ten Dam, who were hardly top-10 GT material at that moment.

I believe TJ Van Garderen's value has always been hyped and people tend to be oblivious to that, because there was a good set of circumstances that helped his good GT placements in 2012 and 2014: either a heavily TT route, or a relatively weak field.
If Froome and Contador had not abandoned in 2014, the mountain stages would have been ridden way harder and I deeply believe that TJ would have lost way more time than he did.
 
It's hard to see BMC putting him in a team leader role in another GT if he doesn't show something in the Giro. I think BMC already have Dennis in mind as his replacement even though Dennis is no sure thing to make it as a GC rider either. Without a marked improvement in this race and for the rest of his contract period I think BMC will cut him loose and have Dennis ride with Porte to learn and replace TJVG with another GC rider who is more consistent and can also win stages to lead the team in the Giro and maybe the Vuelta. Or have Dennis do the Giro where there is less stress and media attention. Possibly a younger rider as well because Porte is already in his thirties and probably only has another three seasons before age starts to effect him. TJVG should be at his peak physically but the performances have slipped badly since 2015 and as a GC rider he is still young. His 2016 Tour ride showed all the signs of a mental collapse. He wasn't ill as he admitted himself and he went into the race without injuries and was well prepared.
 
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Escarabajo said:
LOL. Why retirement?

I know he cannot podium in a GT anymore but there is a lot of room between GT podium and retirement.
Plenty of room to do what ? You think BMC will continue to pay him good money to win a stage of the TDS or the Tour of Turkey ? He wouldn't even win the TDU. He can't sprint, his TT is not what it was and he struggles to keep it together for three weeks. The only alternative is to do what Nicholas Roche did and give up GC aspirations and be a domestique for a better GC rider but can you see him doing that, wanting to do that or even being good at it ?
 
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Here is the moment his career changed. The newborn child and winning the Tour of California along with a bit of fame and a fat check from him employer turned him into a lazy slacker that thought everything will come easy ...

 
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Jancouver said:
Here is the moment his career changed. The newborn child and winning the Tour of California along with a bit of fame and a fat check from him employer turned him into a lazy slacker that thought everything will come easy ...

Well it's obviously a life changer. When Andy Schleck was thinking of a comeback and then became a father he adjusted to his new life pretty quickly it seems and he was happy. Maybe the pro circuit is not what TJVG craves anymore. Each to their own.
 
I don't understand why the management still have faith in him, but I can understand why they still want to have faith in him. He showed a lot of potential at an early age, has finished fifth in the Tour twice and only two years ago he had to abandon the tour because of illness, sitting in third place with four stages to go.
 
Jul 4, 2015
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hrotha said:
I always get this vibe from him that he thinks he's better than he actually is and that things will simply go his way.
To be fair, I think a lot of people(Media, managers, fans?) might have had something to do with that.

I think he heard, and was probably directly told, that's he's a lot better than he actually is/was.
 

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