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Re: Re:
I have read this book - eye opening and rather scary. Should be on the must read list for Clinic readers / posters.
RobbieCanuck said:
I have read this book - eye opening and rather scary. Should be on the must read list for Clinic readers / posters.
Well well nothing odd here.
https://au.sports.yahoo.com/tennis/a/31047468/tennis-sharapovas-10-year-meldonium-treatment-not-normal/
https://au.sports.yahoo.com/tennis/a/31047468/tennis-sharapovas-10-year-meldonium-treatment-not-normal/
Re:
From the article:
`The drug's inventor, Ivars Kalvins, told Latvian newspaper Diena in a 2009 interview that meldonium was given to soldiers during the 1980s, when Soviet forces were fighting in Afghanistan.
"High altitudes. Oxygen deprivation. If they have to run 20 kilometres with all the gear, at the end they would get ischemia (a blood circulation condition)," Kalvins was quoted as saying.'
Can't think how this drug could possibly help in sport......
movingtarget said:
From the article:
`The drug's inventor, Ivars Kalvins, told Latvian newspaper Diena in a 2009 interview that meldonium was given to soldiers during the 1980s, when Soviet forces were fighting in Afghanistan.
"High altitudes. Oxygen deprivation. If they have to run 20 kilometres with all the gear, at the end they would get ischemia (a blood circulation condition)," Kalvins was quoted as saying.'
Can't think how this drug could possibly help in sport......
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2016/03/08/why-maria-sharapova-does-not-deserve-sympathy/
Paul Haywood writes in the Telegraph, worth a read.
He is taking quite an aggressive stance for a broadsheet in the UK.
Paul Haywood writes in the Telegraph, worth a read.
He is taking quite an aggressive stance for a broadsheet in the UK.
Re: Re:
Screw that. Just because he has a strong anti-doping pedigree doesn't mean he isn't acquiescent to political pressure, whether for the sake of his larger cause or his own career interests. Just look at the Coe thing I linked to in my post.
Edit: I refer you to the excellent Benotti69 thread, Are WADA Fit to "Police" Doping in Sport?
RobbieCanuck said:
Screw that. Just because he has a strong anti-doping pedigree doesn't mean he isn't acquiescent to political pressure, whether for the sake of his larger cause or his own career interests. Just look at the Coe thing I linked to in my post.
Edit: I refer you to the excellent Benotti69 thread, Are WADA Fit to "Police" Doping in Sport?
Surprisingly decent article in the guardian: http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2016/mar/09/maria-sharapova-error-excuse-drugs. Not a huge amount of new ground, but well written and gratifyingly skeptical.
Re:
Which would definitely include The Guardian, especially after the Edward Snowden affair.
Marina Hyde is almost always an enjoyable, sometimes hilarious, read, but where is the skepticism in her article? Rather, she is earning her crust, and, like a well-bread attack dog, headed for the target her editors point to: in this case, the Russian athlete and the rightness of her sanction; it's a takedown piece, meant to assuage any doubts the fan might have about the cheating nature of this athlete and the rightness of the world.
blackcat said:
Which would definitely include The Guardian, especially after the Edward Snowden affair.
Cannibal72 said:
Marina Hyde is almost always an enjoyable, sometimes hilarious, read, but where is the skepticism in her article? Rather, she is earning her crust, and, like a well-bread attack dog, headed for the target her editors point to: in this case, the Russian athlete and the rightness of her sanction; it's a takedown piece, meant to assuage any doubts the fan might have about the cheating nature of this athlete and the rightness of the world.
"Sharapova, like some other veteran players, was already looking at 2016, which includes the Summer Olympics in Rio de Janeiro, as a potential endgame. A two-year ban would keep her out of the sport until early 2018, which might be too long to keep the internal flame alight, particularly in view of her recurring injuries.
But her legal team intends to argue for a much shorter suspension, and the feeling in the Sharapova camp Tuesday was that a ban of one year or less was achievable.
“That would be the first thing I [[a sports lawyer interviewed for the article]] would counsel her to do, is to apply for a retroactive T.U.E.,” he said. “It’s a tough standard to meet, a much harder standard than a forward-going T.U.E., but I’ve had a case in the past where that happened, and I’ve gotten retroactive T.U.E.s. that have wiped out adverse analytical findings. It’s not impossible.”
John Haggerty, Sharapova’s lawyer, was asked about that possibility. “Maria and I are looking at all our options,” he said. He also declined to comment, citing confidentiality, on whether Sharapova had listed meldonium, which is also known as mildronate, on her doping control form when she had given samples in the past.
The nature of Sharapova’s long-term usage should be critical to her case. If she can prove it was for legitimate medical purposes, the case for leniency is stronger. There is also the fact that she has plenty of company in 2016, with athletes across a range of sports — from figure skating and speed skating to track and weight lifting — testing positive this year for meldonium, whose use was reportedly widespread before the ban, particularly in Russia."
Decent analysis from the NYT...... https://t.co/KS3svkprR5
Haggerty's statement is at odds with what Lindsey Davenport said previously based on her meeting with Sharapova and her Laywer
........
Establishing the plausibility of her long term usage being for legitimate medical reasons is the nub of this situation...
But her legal team intends to argue for a much shorter suspension, and the feeling in the Sharapova camp Tuesday was that a ban of one year or less was achievable.
“That would be the first thing I [[a sports lawyer interviewed for the article]] would counsel her to do, is to apply for a retroactive T.U.E.,” he said. “It’s a tough standard to meet, a much harder standard than a forward-going T.U.E., but I’ve had a case in the past where that happened, and I’ve gotten retroactive T.U.E.s. that have wiped out adverse analytical findings. It’s not impossible.”
John Haggerty, Sharapova’s lawyer, was asked about that possibility. “Maria and I are looking at all our options,” he said. He also declined to comment, citing confidentiality, on whether Sharapova had listed meldonium, which is also known as mildronate, on her doping control form when she had given samples in the past.
The nature of Sharapova’s long-term usage should be critical to her case. If she can prove it was for legitimate medical purposes, the case for leniency is stronger. There is also the fact that she has plenty of company in 2016, with athletes across a range of sports — from figure skating and speed skating to track and weight lifting — testing positive this year for meldonium, whose use was reportedly widespread before the ban, particularly in Russia."
Decent analysis from the NYT...... https://t.co/KS3svkprR5
Haggerty's statement is at odds with what Lindsey Davenport said previously based on her meeting with Sharapova and her Laywer
........Establishing the plausibility of her long term usage being for legitimate medical reasons is the nub of this situation...
Re:
A long term user would have some kind of heart problem wouldn't they? I thought people with heart problems were told to refrain from strenuous exercise?
arcus said:<snipped>
Haggerty's statement is at odds with what Lindsey Davenport said previously based on her meeting with Sharapova and her Laywer
Establishing the plausibility of her long term usage being for legitimate medical reasons is the nub of this situation...
A long term user would have some kind of heart problem wouldn't they? I thought people with heart problems were told to refrain from strenuous exercise?
Vogue magazine talking doping in tennis. Didn't think I'd see that in my lifetime . It's a positive thing that doping in sports has bled so much into the mainstream consciousness over the past year, even if naivety is still rampant.
http://www.vogue.com/13413611/maria-sharapova-doping-banned-drug-retirement-meldonium/
. It's a positive thing that doping in sports has bled so much into the mainstream consciousness over the past year, even if naivety is still rampant. http://www.vogue.com/13413611/maria-sharapova-doping-banned-drug-retirement-meldonium/
"The chair of Grendiks’ (Meldonium's manufacturer) board of supervisors, Kirovs Lipmans, is also president of the Latvian Hockey Federation and an executive member of the Latvian Olympic Committee. His dual role as a Latvian sports official and director of a company that produces a performance-enhancing drug raised eyebrows with at least one US anti-doping official. “It’s weird,” says the official, on background."
lol
http://www.wired.com/2016/03/meldonium-became-doping-drug-choice/
lol
http://www.wired.com/2016/03/meldonium-became-doping-drug-choice/
The chances of Maria Sharapova obtaining a retrospective TUE are close to zero. What exceptional circumstances or emergency to justify such a grant, would there be? That she was being legitimately treated with the drug? She had ample opportunity to go through the TUE process.
If she was being legitimately prescribed the drug, as she claims, would she have had to declare its (non-banned) use on a doping control form? As far as I can see such a declaration of drug use is purely advisory.
If she was being legitimately prescribed the drug, as she claims, would she have had to declare its (non-banned) use on a doping control form? As far as I can see such a declaration of drug use is purely advisory.
The chief sports writer may have taken a harsh line, but the tennis correspondent is much more sympathetic: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2016/03/09/maria-sharapova-could-be-saved-by-therapeutic-use-exemption/
Zebadeedee said:
She will claim that she used a valid, legal prescription for 10 years, but slipped-up for 3 weeks, not realizing her 'health-saving medication' was suddenly banned... Personally, I'm not buying that for one second.
IIRC, athletes are required to list all prescription and non-prescription drugs (banned or otherwise), as well as all ingested supplements, on doping-control forms.... I believe it's mandatory.
Zebadeedee said:
she can afford a few massive bribes. <think Gorski Nike 1999 Verbruggen 500k>
Re:
He did similar on athletics. He's fairly good but as I said with the athletics scandal, I seen a lot of football journalists who couldn't wait to have an opinion on it but couldn't be bothered to ask questions and do the digging in their own sport. It's been no different this time. Seen it all over twitter. Lets see if the reports are true about Chelsea, will they question or write about Conte and his high haematocrit at Juve.
Nadal:
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/rafael-nadal-says-weary-doping-rumors-042013486--ten.html;_ylt=AwrXnCc59.BWVQgA0r3QtDMD;_ylu=X3oDMTByb2lvbXVuBGNvbG8DZ3ExBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzcg--
Catwhoorg said:
He did similar on athletics. He's fairly good but as I said with the athletics scandal, I seen a lot of football journalists who couldn't wait to have an opinion on it but couldn't be bothered to ask questions and do the digging in their own sport. It's been no different this time. Seen it all over twitter. Lets see if the reports are true about Chelsea, will they question or write about Conte and his high haematocrit at Juve.
Nadal:
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/rafael-nadal-says-weary-doping-rumors-042013486--ten.html;_ylt=AwrXnCc59.BWVQgA0r3QtDMD;_ylu=X3oDMTByb2lvbXVuBGNvbG8DZ3ExBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzcg--
Not mandatory to disclose drug use at all. Predictably she'll claim very intermittent use to explain its non-appearance on her doping control forms. I can see lots of obfuscation developing in this story.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2016/03/09/maria-sharapova-meldonium-used-by-lots-of-tennis-players/
I like the pictorial in this article showing the amount of people testing 'positive' for Meldonium at the European Games (not illegal then though).
Exercising is clearly bad for you, look at the amount of athletes with bad hearts!
I like the pictorial in this article showing the amount of people testing 'positive' for Meldonium at the European Games (not illegal then though).
Exercising is clearly bad for you, look at the amount of athletes with bad hearts!
The Russian view of the drug seems to be fairly well explained in this article http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/10/sports/tennis/meldonium-russian-athletes-maria-sharapova-doping.html which seems well written. Interesting to see how they think. If it does improve recovery etc and not just have therapeutic uses claimed for it you can see why they used it while it was legal. They viewed its use as legitimate, not only because it had not been banned, but it seemed to help recovery. No, they weren't necessarily using it to treat heart conditions.
Obviously the ban will impact on Russia, Latvia, Lithuania and other countries where the drug is available and it looks as if they were targeted, save that it was a general ban on the drug's use intended to reduce any advantage to anyone from it. It seems unlikely that anyone, Sharapova included, would have been on it all the time, but perhaps mostly as they thought they should and when coaches saw fit to dish it out. It may have had no more significance to Russians than taking aspirin for a bad head or as an anti-platelet medicine.
None of this background detracts from her extreme negligence in still taking it after the ban. What are the chances that she cynically continued in knowledge of the ban? I assess them as less than the alternative explanation she offered.
Obviously the ban will impact on Russia, Latvia, Lithuania and other countries where the drug is available and it looks as if they were targeted, save that it was a general ban on the drug's use intended to reduce any advantage to anyone from it. It seems unlikely that anyone, Sharapova included, would have been on it all the time, but perhaps mostly as they thought they should and when coaches saw fit to dish it out. It may have had no more significance to Russians than taking aspirin for a bad head or as an anti-platelet medicine.
None of this background detracts from her extreme negligence in still taking it after the ban. What are the chances that she cynically continued in knowledge of the ban? I assess them as less than the alternative explanation she offered.
BullsFan22 said:
but Hersh has different mail
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v38/n01/seymour-m-hersh/military-to-military
deep state relations have been good since Perestroika
Where is Python(member) when you need him?
@blackcat.
i already posted upthread i dont think the meldronate-gate is a political thing and that i am skeptical of sharapova's story... 2 ukies got popped with the thing, a swede (of ethiopian roots) etc. the whole thing is flooding b/c the anti-doping machine has gone the line of least resistance. like the cops we see in the cities ganging up on the easy pray like pedestrians, homeless and cyclists...
that said, i truly don't like how the western media's gone into frenzy. i truly experience deep aversion to any, not just this psychosis, dog piling, chest thumping or any feel-good posturing b/c someone can be stomped into mud for their mistakes.
so i stay away as i find no need in cheap gloating or an entertained at anyone's expense.
i already posted upthread i dont think the meldronate-gate is a political thing and that i am skeptical of sharapova's story... 2 ukies got popped with the thing, a swede (of ethiopian roots) etc. the whole thing is flooding b/c the anti-doping machine has gone the line of least resistance. like the cops we see in the cities ganging up on the easy pray like pedestrians, homeless and cyclists...
that said, i truly don't like how the western media's gone into frenzy. i truly experience deep aversion to any, not just this psychosis, dog piling, chest thumping or any feel-good posturing b/c someone can be stomped into mud for their mistakes.
so i stay away as i find no need in cheap gloating or an entertained at anyone's expense.
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