Tennis

[AmRacer]

From what I've read about the case, the fairest outcome would probably have been no ban at all. The reason he did get one is that the rules are very strict.

9 mont at least would be good enough.

 

[kingjr]

Sure,you didn’t read my previous posts. Sufficient to establish the excuse is even replicable.

I did read it, it's just difficult to make sense of. For instance, "They just paid scientists who indicated it was scientifically plausible." <-- Who is "they"?

I also don't understand the part about "burden of proof", he was only required to establish that the route of administration as outlined by him was "more likely than not." Take it up with the rule-makers.

 

[kingjr]

9 mont at least would be good enough.

And why nine months?

 

[AmRacer]

And why nine months?

8.5 then

 

[kingjr]

8.5 then

Ok, at this point I'm assuming you're just having a laugh and aren't interested in a discussion.

 

[Sciatic]

I did read it, it's just difficult to make sense of. For instance, "They just paid scientists who indicated it was scientifically plausible." <-- Who is "they"?

I also don't understand the part about "burden of proof", he was only required to establish that the route of administration as outlined by him was "more likely than not." Take it up with the rule-makers.

Who is they, you asked. His defense attorneys of course. You may not be getting that I don’t care if he doped or not. If he doped and didn’t get caught U wouldn’t care. What I do care (probably too much I admit) is having my intelligence insulted.

 

[AmRacer]

Ok, at this point I'm assuming you're just having a laugh and aren't interested in a discussion.

I'm not laughing at a sensless ban.

 

[kingjr]

Who is they, you asked. His defense attorneys of course. You may not be getting that I don’t care if he doped or not. If he doped and didn’t get caught U wouldn’t care. What I do care (probably too much I admit) is having my intelligence insulted.

Is that so?

The Tribunal notes that three independent experts have been consulted to test the
plausibility of the Player’s explanation. Two were instructed by the ITIA and one by the
Player.

The Player’s identity was not known by two of the experts


"If he doped and didn't get caught U wouldn't care" <-- If he doped and didn't get caught I wouldn't know about it. I obviously want all dopers to be caught, ideally.

"What I do care (probably too much I admit) is having my intelligence insulted." <-- Who is doing that?

 

[kingjr]

I'm not laughing at a sensless ban.

I note that you didn't disagree with the second point.

 

[Sciatic]

Is that so?

The Tribunal notes that three independent experts have been consulted to test the
plausibility of the Player’s explanation. Two were instructed by the ITIA and one by the
Player.

The Player’s identity was not known by two of the experts


"If he doped and didn't get caught U wouldn't care" <-- If he doped and didn't get caught I wouldn't know about it. I obviously want all dopers to be caught, ideally.

"What I do care (probably too much I admit) is having my intelligence insulted." <-- Who is doing that?

I’ve explained exactly what bothered me about the short ban. And I’ve explained why it bothered me.

I serve as an expert in court cases (environmental contamination). Following each expert report I submit I then sit through 6 hours of questioning in deposition by the opposing attorney challenging my opinions. If I argued something was “plausible” theoretically but never showed I had demonstrated or replicated the tangible steps to show that the sequence of events could happen in reality, then the court would not even allow the expert report to be used in testimony—they would throw it out. Plausibility is pretty lame as evidence.

And, yes, I know that is was not that kind of legal case, but I’m trying to show where Im coming from. I’ve explained everything I can, if you’re not satisfied with that you’re welcome to comment all you want, but I don’t have anything else to say.

 

[AmRacer]

I note that you didn't disagree with the second point.

You note too much.

 

[kingjr]

I’ve explained exactly what bothered me about the short ban. And I’ve explained why it bothered me.

I serve as an expert in court cases (environmental contamination). Following each expert report I submit I then sit through 6 hours of questioning in deposition by the opposing attorney challenging my opinions. If I argued something was “plausible” theoretically but never showed I had demonstrated or replicated the tangible steps to show that the sequence of events could happen in reality, then the court would not even allow the expert report to be used in testimony—they would throw it out. Plausibility is pretty lame as evidence.

And, yes, I know that is was not that kind of legal case, but I’m trying to show where Im coming from. I’ve explained everything I can, if you’re not satisfied with that you’re welcome to comment all you want, but I don’t have anything else to say.

What's causing you to doubt this sequence of events could happen in reality?

 

[Sciatic]

What's causing you to doubt this sequence of events could happen in reality?

One last try: I didn’t say I doubted them, I said as far as what’s reported his team of coaches/attorneyd never showed or indicated they tried to repeat the exact set of circumstances. You don’t even need a bunch of experts to do that.

 

[kingjr]

One last try: I didn’t say I doubted them, I said as far as what’s reported his team of coaches/attorneyd never showed or indicated they tried to repeat the exact set of circumstances. You don’t even need a bunch of experts to do that.

But it's already been shown years before that this kind of cross-contamination can happen with that substance...

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Latin Lovers don't Dope.

Berrettini and anti -doping controls: "I must always report where I sleep, even when I am with a girl"

As reported in Italiano here:

Berrettini e i controlli antidoping: «Devo sempre segnalare dove dormo, anche quando sono con una ragazza»

Dopo il caso Sinner-Clostebol, anche l'azzurro dice la sua sulla rigidità dei controlli:«Come avere degli stalker che mi seguono e mi chiedono le urine. Al terzo warning scatta la squalifica, immaginate la paranoia»

www.corriere.it

 

[pastronef]

Latin Lovers don't Dope.



As reported in Italiano here:

Berrettini e i controlli antidoping: «Devo sempre segnalare dove dormo, anche quando sono con una ragazza»

Dopo il caso Sinner-Clostebol, anche l'azzurro dice la sua sulla rigidità dei controlli:«Come avere degli stalker che mi seguono e mi chiedono le urine. Al terzo warning scatta la squalifica, immaginate la paranoia»

www.corriere.it

ma dove vive? has he never heard of how cyclist are doing this since years?

 

[Mayomaniac]

Latin Lovers don't Dope.



As reported in Italiano here:

Berrettini e i controlli antidoping: «Devo sempre segnalare dove dormo, anche quando sono con una ragazza»

Dopo il caso Sinner-Clostebol, anche l'azzurro dice la sua sulla rigidità dei controlli:«Come avere degli stalker che mi seguono e mi chiedono le urine. Al terzo warning scatta la squalifica, immaginate la paranoia»

www.corriere.it

Poor tax evading Tennis players, not even safe in Montecarlo. I forgot, Berrettini, the hero of the Italian housewifes, only moved there because he could no longer enter a bar undisturbed...

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Nice testimoniale for Sinner on his return

Serena Williams on Jannik Sinner doping case: 'I would have been banned for 20 years'

Serena Williams says she would have been banned for 20 years had she committed a doping offence similar to that of men's player Jannik Sinner.

www.bbc.com

 

[Rackham]

A woman whose blood type is now probably literal EPO doesn't really have much credibility on the issue of doping.

 

[Unchained]

A woman whose blood type is now probably literal EPO doesn't really have much credibility on the issue of doping.

Based on what? She did get a positive test result for drug that was prescribed in the US from chronic ringing in your ears.

 

[Rackham]

Based on what? She did get a positive test result for drug that was prescribed in the US from chronic ringing in your ears.

Maybe my irony detector is wonky this evening but I assumed it was common knowledge (to a lol worthy level) that Serena was juiced to the point of ultimate juiciness. I mean where do we even begin? Maybe that one incident when she locked herself in her panic room because the evil drug tester knocked on her door. There's lots more as well.

 

[Unchained]

Maybe my irony detector is wonky this evening but I assumed it was common knowledge (to a lol worthy level) that Serena was juiced to the point of ultimate juiciness. I mean where do we even begin? Maybe that one incident when she locked herself in her panic room because the evil drug tester knocked on her door. There's lots more as well.

No certainly not assumed that either Williams were using PEDs, much of their careers were spent with accusations of systematic racism that couldn't be proven, was Serena tested more than her competitors at the time? Yes.
Was it because of her race? The short answer is nobody can know, but because she was winning more than all others, would be more logical assumption.
And as you point out.. There was that.... One....incident. Most of the clinic is just smear and not much substance.
Williams was often subjected to more than 10 tests a month from different authorities..Would it have been less had she not played in the Olympics for 10 or 12 years? Who knows maybe.. Was she tested more because she won near $100,000,000 in prize money and likely near that in endorsement contracts? Who knows? Maybe..Did she get tested so much as a function of time? Probably.. Started as a pro in 1995 for almost 30 years!! That's a lot of drug testing!!!

 

[Sciatic]

No certainly not assumed that either Williams were using PEDs, much of their careers were spent with accusations of systematic racism that couldn't be proven, was Serena tested more than her competitors at the time? Yes.
Was it because of her race? The short answer is nobody can know, but because she was winning more than all others, would be more logical assumption.
And as you point out.. There was that.... One....incident. Most of the clinic is just smear and not much substance.
Williams was often subjected to more than 10 tests a month from different authorities..Would it have been less had she not played in the Olympics for 10 or 12 years? Who knows maybe.. Was she tested more because she won near $100,000,000 in prize money and likely near that in endorsement contracts? Who knows? Maybe..Did she get tested so much as a function of time? Probably.. Started as a pro in 1995 for almost 30 years!! That's a lot of drug testing!!!

You’re in the weeds a bit with details that might substantiate or diminish doping claims about Serena. I guessing I’m not the only one here who thinks about in a different framework: we know tennis is rife with PEDs (too bad we never learned of all the Puerto blood bags) and in that environment she absolutely crushed her opponents with physical domination. Even amazing physical outliers don’t demolish elite competition that is doping.

 

[Unchained]

You’re in the weeds a bit with details that might substantiate or diminish doping claims about Serena. I guessing I’m not the only one here who thinks about in a different framework: we know tennis is rife with PEDs (too bad we never learned of all the Puerto blood bags) and in that environment she absolutely crushed her opponents with physical domination. Even amazing physical outliers don’t demolish elite competition that is doping.

No weed or weeds for me!! Because of body metamorphosis during puberty, she was immediately accused of doping as a child. She also had out of the ordinary accomplishments as a youngster.
Her family and management were constantly complaining about what they saw as excessive testing. She later would suggest that she was treated, reprimanded differently because of her race. They also used very veiled language about the motivation behind multiple tests per months for almost 30 years ( according to Williams her career started 1995-2022) Certainly not much if any details about her getting tested pre 95. Not much mention of it in the 7 or 8 books written about or by her. She has obviously done hundreds of hours of video interviews and doesn't dwell on it.
Again Bigfoot, Lochness monster, Chuppacabra tooth fairy, Santa, balanced budget, and Williams doping positives ..all things to believe in. Her training and physical preparation, divine gifts have to at least have to factor into an educated guess. In other female sports being described as " big boned" is pejorative.. In her case her constant training to refine her muscle mass for maximum efficiency, effectiveness was truly phenomenal!! I remember watching an post match video analysis of her at French Open or tournament in Switzerland or US open and she took 2,3 steps less than other players to cover lateral distances of the baseline. Other pro athlete friends of hers commented that she did as much running and agility drills as pro mens basketball and football players.

 

[BullsFan22]

No weed or weeds for me!! Because of body metamorphosis during puberty, she was immediately accused of doping as a child. She also had out of the ordinary accomplishments as a youngster.
Her family and management were constantly complaining about what they saw as excessive testing. She later would suggest that she was treated, reprimanded differently because of her race. They also used very veiled language about the motivation behind multiple tests per months for almost 30 years ( according to Williams her career started 1995-2022) Certainly not much if any details about her getting tested pre 95. Not much mention of it in the 7 or 8 books written about or by her. She has obviously done hundreds of hours of video interviews and doesn't dwell on it.
Again Bigfoot, Lochness monster, Chuppacabra tooth fairy, Santa, balanced budget, and Williams doping positives ..all things to believe in. Her training and physical preparation, divine gifts have to at least have to factor into an educated guess. In other female sports being described as " big boned" is pejorative.. In her case her constant training to refine her muscle mass for maximum efficiency, effectiveness was truly phenomenal!! I remember watching an post match video analysis of her at French Open or tournament in Switzerland or US open and she took 2,3 steps less than other players to cover lateral distances of the baseline. Other pro athlete friends of hers commented that she did as much running and agility drills as pro mens basketball and football players.

You sound like a Lance apologist