The "I can't believe" Mikel Landa thread

[Netserk]

Re:

Perhaps you'd stop if you had better stuff available. In no way I'm implying things are "cleaner" just because a particular doping method may have lost its edge to newer PEDs, just to be clear.

I agree Aru's 2015 Giro looks like a classic blood bag affair, though.

Unless the better stuff is also some kind of blood doping, why not do both? I find it highly implausible that (smaller) bags aren't used by every single GT contender.

 

[vedrafjord]

Yes, it depends on the method - if there was an undetectable EPO analogue or other O2 vector method, obviously that would be preferrable to transfusions in terms of logistics (although you'd still need a way to keep HcT low such as saline drips or plasma transfusions).

Weight loss/metabolism modulator drugs on the other hand boost performance a totally different way, so would complement red blood cell/O2 methods - I imagine riders would do both if they had access to both.

 

[Eyeballs Out]

I think Aru was genuinely under the weather for a week in last year's Giro. There were rumours of that and some quotes seemed to point to them trying to conceal it (and not doing a great job of it). Not to discount transfusions which I would think are still very much part of a GC rider's MO but I don't see how they would account his performances assuming that the rest days are transfusion days. If anything transfusions should make you more consistent (unless of course something goes wrong with storage in which case you are virtually a hospital case)

 

[Benotti69]

Landa apparently has Viral Gastroenteritis, contagious, and wasn't kept away from the team and was then doing press!

and we are expected to believe this BS?

 

[King Of Molehill]

Re:

Landa apparently has Viral Gastroenteritis, contagious, and wasn't kept away from the team and was then doing press!

and we are expected to believe this BS?

What causes viral gastroenteritis?
Four types of viruses cause most cases of viral gastroenteritis.

Rotavirus
Rotavirus is the leading cause of gastroenteritis among infants and young children. Rotavirus infections are most common in infants 3 to 15 months old. Symptoms usually appear 1 to 3 days after exposure. Rotavirus typically causes vomiting and watery diarrhea for 3 to 7 days, along with fever and abdominal pain. Rotavirus can also infect adults who are in close contact with infected children, but the symptoms in adults are milder.

Caliciviruses
Caliciviruses cause infection in people of all ages. Norovirus is the most common calicivirus and the most common cause of viral gastroenteritis in adults. Norovirus is usually responsible for epidemics of viral gastroenteritis. Norovirus outbreaks occur all year but are more frequent from October to April. People infected with norovirus typically experience nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, abdominal cramps, fatigue, headache, and muscle aches. The symptoms usually appear 1 to 2 days after exposure to the virus and last for 1 to 3 days.

Adenovirus
Adenovirus mainly infects children younger than 2 years old. Of the 49 types of adenoviruses, one strain affects the gastrointestinal tract, causing vomiting and diarrhea. Symptoms typically appear 8 to 10 days after exposure and last 5 to 12 days. Adenovirus infections occur year-round.

Astrovirus
Astrovirus primarily infects infants and young children, but adults may also be infected. This virus causes vomiting and watery diarrhea. Symptoms usually appear 3 to 4 days after exposure and last 2 to 7 days. The symptoms are milder than the symptoms of norovirus or rotavirus infections. Infections occur year-round, but the virus is most active during the winter months.

-----------------------------

So based on this info we can probably rule out two of the four virus types which leaves Astrovirus and Norovirus. We've all read about Norovirus outbreaks on cruise ships etc.. it tends to wreck havoc with close quarter living. So yes, one would expect to see more cases popping up with Sky or others in the next few days if, for whatever reason, Landa was 'ground zero'.

In my experience (three kids under 10), the stomach bug can be mild enough that you puke once, have a good sleep and you can be good to go again the next day or bad enough that you puke and poop all night long and are in bed for three days eating nothing but rice cakes and toast. I've never seen a GI bug where you DON'T puke or get diarreah and only a fever and some pains, that seems a bit odd to me but I'm sure it's possible.

 

[bikenrrd]

There is a vaccine against Norovirus. I know, because my two year old daughter had it when she was really little (8 weeks, I think). It was free, in the UK, on the NHS. I would think that a pro cycling team would pay for their riders to be vaccinated against Norovirus.

 

[CheckMyPecs]

Re:

There is a vaccine against Norovirus. I know, because my two year old daughter had it when she was really little (8 weeks, I think). It was free, in the UK, on the NHS. I would think that a pro cycling team would pay for their riders to be vaccinated against Norovirus.

For all you know, Landa is vaccinated against norovirus and simply caught gastroenteritis from some of the other zillion microbes that can cause it.

 

[King Of Molehill]

Re:

There is a vaccine against Norovirus. I know, because my two year old daughter had it when she was really little (8 weeks, I think). It was free, in the UK, on the NHS. I would think that a pro cycling team would pay for their riders to be vaccinated against Norovirus.

There isn't a vaccine for Norovirus (yet) but there is for Rotavirus as it tends to cause more of the serious side-effects in children (dehydration etc..).

 

[B_Ugli]

1991 Tour PDM

Before the tenth stage, two cyclists from PDM gave up. During that stage, two more gave up, and one came in late. The team revealed that the remaining four cyclists (including Breukink, Kelly and Alcala, ranked in the top ten of the general classification) were also sick, and the next morning the entire team abandoned. There were rumours that a doping program had gone wrong, but no official penalties were given.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

On eurosport Sean Kelly rules out the BBQ theory.
curiouser and curiouser

 

[thehog]

Re:

On eurosport Sean Kelly rules out the BBQ theory.
curiouser and curiouser

Honestly, I don't think we'll ever know what occurred to Landa. Its extremely suspicious, be interesting to see how he performs in the upcoming races post Giro.

Sky certainly have become a mystery team, strange things always occurring.

 

[Nick C.]

Re: Re:

Looks like Landa got caught and instead on having a doping positive tarnish the race, the team was told to pull the rider. I kind of think the same thing happened to Dumoulin this year, and last.

That is my default first thought. Of course, that would imply that there is testing.

 

[Rob27172]

Re: Re:

Landa apparently has Viral Gastroenteritis, contagious, and wasn't kept away from the team and was then doing press!

and we are expected to believe this BS?

What causes viral gastroenteritis?
Four types of viruses cause most cases of viral gastroenteritis.

Yes there are four types of virus
There is also another option
Do a google search for "side effects of EPO"
one of the classic side effects of EPO use is gastro intestinal distress - or an upset stomach to you and me
Vomiting, Nausea and discomfort, pain and swelling of the stomach are all known side effects and amazingly fit very nicely with a standard gastroenteritis excuse for pulling out of the race

 

[thehog]

Landa already shaping up for the Tour, has already travelled home, conducted interviews but too sick to finish the stage

“If they took me to the Tour to help Chris, it would be a pleasure,” Landa said in an interview with Spanish newspaper AS the day after his abandonment.

“It is still too early to speculate about new plans. I need to recuperate and then I will decide on where I will compete.”

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/racing/mikel-landa-join-chris-froome-tour-de-france-225856#bEGXPaUg9OFOhtlo.99

 

[Random Direction]

One wild theory - Sky could know that something is wrong with Froome and pulled Landa so he could lead at the tour. 99% chance this is wrong.

 

[Rollthedice]

Nibali says nothing about Landa's illness:

"Yesterday’s stage was hard and so quickly revealed Mikel’s problems. When he was dropped he opted to quit, I can understand that. It was a tough moment for him.”

Unzue is also puzzled:

“I don’t know what happened to Landa but the truth is one of the big favourites is out. But that’s cycling,”

To me it seems they don't quite buy the gastroenteritis excuse.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Re:

One wild theory - Sky could know that something is wrong with Froome and pulled Landa so he could lead at the tour. 99% chance this is wrong.

I imagine Geraint Thomas would be their back-up man in that situation.

 

[thehog]

Re: Re:

One wild theory - Sky could know that something is wrong with Froome and pulled Landa so he could lead at the tour. 99% chance this is wrong.

I imagine Geraint Thomas would be their back-up man in that situation.

We can only hope Landa doesn't understand the team orders and attacks the Dawg!

 

[Rollthedice]

Re: Re:

One wild theory - Sky could know that something is wrong with Froome and pulled Landa so he could lead at the tour. 99% chance this is wrong.

I imagine Geraint Thomas would be their back-up man in that situation.

We can only hope Landa doesn't understand the team orders and attacks the Dawg!

He took out his earpiece when Martinelli was yeling to wait for Aru in Vuelta so it's quite possible.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Re:

Nibali says nothing about Landa's illness:

"Yesterday’s stage was hard and so quickly revealed Mikel’s problems. When he was dropped he opted to quit, I can understand that. It was a tough moment for him.”

Unzue is also puzzled:

“I don’t know what happened to Landa but the truth is one of the big favourites is out. But that’s cycling,”

To me it seems they don't quite buy the gastroenteritis excuse.

I heard different
An interview with Nibali on the RAI where he said he understood Landa's problem quite well
because in last years TdF he lost 4 mins in the day after the rest day.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Re: Re:

One wild theory - Sky could know that something is wrong with Froome and pulled Landa so he could lead at the tour. 99% chance this is wrong.

I imagine Geraint Thomas would be their back-up man in that situation.

We can only hope Landa doesn't understand the team orders and attacks the Dawg!

I hope he does: Dog eat Dawg

 

[Random Direction]

Re: Re:

One wild theory - Sky could know that something is wrong with Froome and pulled Landa so he could lead at the tour. 99% chance this is wrong.

I imagine Geraint Thomas would be their back-up man in that situation.

We can only hope Landa doesn't understand the team orders and attacks the Dawg!

I hope he does: Dog eat Dawg

It would be so, so, precious if Landa pulled a Manuel from Fawlty Towers on Brailsford and Froome at the tour while dropping Froome up a mountain: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6EaoPMANQM

 

[pastronef]

Re: Re:

One wild theory - Sky could know that something is wrong with Froome and pulled Landa so he could lead at the tour. 99% chance this is wrong.

I imagine Geraint Thomas would be their back-up man in that situation.

We can only hope Landa doesn't understand the team orders and attacks the Dawg!

oh how things change eh?

we were hoping Froome didnt follow the orders and attacked Wiggins 4 years ago

 

[dacooley]

on arcalis it might be something like 1. froome 2. landa 3. thomas 4. porte. hog, store up cardiac pills

 

[thehog]

Re:

on arcalis it might be something like 1. froome 2. landa 3. thomas 4. porte. hog, store up cardiac pills

If they get that team to the Tour (I'm subbing Poels for LRP), Sky will be unstoppable, if they have Stannard for the flat stages and the rest for climbing its going to be an insanely strong team. The only problem is keeping a lid on Landa and Thomas.