Teams & Riders The "MVP" Mathieu Van der Poel Road Discussion Thread

[Dekker_Tifosi]

he was good enough in cx worlds. I guess he peaked a bit more for CX worlds than Van Aert. So VDP first has to go "off" that peak with a week rest and then rebuild for spring.
While vna Aert was already building for spring and rode CX in not optimal form but with the road in mind.

Hence the difference now. I don't see it so bad for VDP yet for the flanders classics. But MSR will be too soon

 

[jono]

Due to injury and other circumstances (poor management from his team -- Giro/Tour double??), he hasn't been properly prepared for his big targets since prior to Olympics 2021. As one who believes bike racing is more interesting when he is racing well, I hope this season, which looks to have a better sequence of training and targets, will represent a return to 2019/early 2020 form.

 

[stonerider]

Realistically, MVDP has not been near top form since the 2022 Giro. Lets see if he can retain his mojo.

I'd hardly say he was at top form in 2022 Giro...he had to go to the max to beat some 2nd rate racers. All the best racers were in the Tour de France and we know what happened to him there in 2022.

 

[Sciatic]

The best lies are close to the truth.

Not true in this country anymore—but that’s discussion I know I’m supposed to avoid here.

 

[Sciatic]

he was good enough in cx worlds. I guess he peaked a bit more for CX worlds than Van Aert. So VDP first has to go "off" that peak with a week rest and then rebuild for spring.
While vna Aert was already building for spring and rode CX in not optimal form but with the road in mind.

Hence the difference now. I don't see it so bad for VDP yet for the flanders classics. But MSR will be too soon

Do you think riders even “peak” (an overused term anyways) for MSR the way they would for the cobbled classics? It’s just one race rather than a series of races, and it’s such a crapshoot that even when a rider is absolutely the strongest (Cancellara, Sagan some of those years) they still only have a small chance of winning. It seems the more likely issue is whether a rider is willing to take a brief break in their buildup to RVV/PR to be fresh enough to have a shot at MSR.

 

[Red Rick]

Do you think riders even “peak” (an overused term anyways) for MSR the way they would for the cobbled classics? It’s just one race rather than a series of races, and it’s such a crapshoot that even when a rider is absolutely the strongest (Cancellara, Sagan some of those years) they still only have a small chance of winning. It seems the more likely issue is whether a rider is willing to take a brief break in their buildup to RVV/PR to be fresh enough to have a shot at MSR.

You don't need a peak for Sanremo. It's a really fresh effort, which means you only need the short efforts trained but not really the super high fatigue resistance.

Last year MvdP came back cold at MSR and got 3rd.

 

[Sciatic]

You don't need a peak for Sanremo. It's a really fresh effort, which means you only need the short efforts trained but not really the super high fatigue resistance.

Last year MvdP came back cold at MSR and got 3rd.

Thanks, that’s what I was thinking.

 

[Red Rick]

Thanks, that’s what I was thinking.

I feel like just because Sanremo is the longest race a lot of people mistakenly believe it's the one that needs the most endurance. You really don't. The watts in the first hours of Sanremo are absurdly low.

Spoiler

MvdP in Ronde:

• 338 W
  Weighted Avg Power
• 6,753 kJ
  Total Work
• 394
  Training Load
• 77%

MvdP in Sanremo

• 306.81 km
  Distance
• 6:50:25
  Moving Time
• 1,829 m
  Elevation
• 224
  Massive Relative Effort
• 293 W
  Weighted Avg Power
• 5,941 kJ
  Total Work
• 308
  Training Load
• 67%

Literally only like 85% of the total work load in Sanremo compared to Ronde.

 

[Gratemans]

I feel like just because Sanremo is the longest race a lot of people mistakenly believe it's the one that needs the most endurance. You really don't. The watts in the first hours of Sanremo are absurdly low.

Spoiler

MvdP in Ronde:

• 338 W
  Weighted Avg Power
• 6,753 kJ
  Total Work
• 394
  Training Load
• 77%

MvdP in Sanremo

• 306.81 km
  Distance
• 6:50:25
  Moving Time
• 1,829 m
  Elevation
• 224
  Massive Relative Effort
• 293 W
  Weighted Avg Power
• 5,941 kJ
  Total Work
• 308
  Training Load
• 67%

Literally only like 85% of the total work load in Sanremo compared to Ronde.

So if that's true (and I believe it is: you never hear them complain how tough MSR is, you only ever hear them complain how tedious the first 75% is) than it really is only about being in the front 5 near the top of the Poggio nowadays. So positioning.
Because well organized chases seem to be a thing of the past here.

 

[Red Rick]

So if that's true (and I believe it is: you never hear them complain how tough MSR is, you only ever hear them complain how tedious the first 75% is) than it really is only about being in the front 5 near the top of the Poggio nowadays. So positioning.
Because well organized chases seem to be a thing of the past here.

I heared Van Avermaet complain once it was no use attacking on the Poggio because the first 285km had been too easy. Basically there's no endurance element to sitting in the peloton on a flat road.

I think the bad chase is more the short distance to the finish. Do you ever see a good chase in other races in the final 2km that didn't happen before?

 

[Gratemans]

No I thought about that when I was typing. 2 km is very short indeed. They did succeed in the past though, but that was a long time ago.

 

[Ricco']

If Philipsen is still a part of the front group when they enter the last quarter of the Poggio, which would be the tactic that will give, in theory, the best outcome for the team?

a) have SKA or MVDP in an attacking role to create a small group that would stick to the finish, leaving Philipsen following wheels by himself;
b) have MVDP in that role and SKA close to Philipsen so he could tow him back in the flat towards VDP if the move doesn't work;
c) keep all three quiet so they could end the descent together and form a mini lead-out in the last k's

 

[Sciatic]

If Philipsen is still a part of the front group when they enter the last quarter of the Poggio, which would be the tactic that will give, in theory, the best outcome for the team?

a) have SKA or MVDP in an attacking role to create a small group that would stick to the finish, leaving Philipsen following wheels by himself;
b) have MVDP in that role and SKA close to Philipsen so he could tow him back in the flat towards VDP if the move doesn't work;
c) keep all three quiet so they could end the descent together and form a mini lead-out in the last k's

I don’t really recall that kind of tactical thinking being part of San Remo. It’s more like someone (Alaphilippe, MVDP, Pog, etc) puts in a vicious attack in the top 1/3 of the Poggio, another rider perhaps counters and then whoever has the legs that day hangs on. Sometimes a couple of riders might close a small gap to the first group right at the top of the climb and the beginning of the descent. And that’s the finishing group. It seems like the only team strategy is to make sure the team leaders are very close to the front when the attacks start. Or perhaps like UAE last year, pushing the pace on the Cipressa, though that didn’t seem like much of a factor that I remember.

 

[senna6541]

he was good enough in cx worlds. I guess he peaked a bit more for CX worlds than Van Aert. So VDP first has to go "off" that peak with a week rest and then rebuild for spring.
While vna Aert was already building for spring and rode CX in not optimal form but with the road in mind.

Hence the difference now. I don't see it so bad for VDP yet for the flanders classics. But MSR will be too soon

Wait a minute, I thought WVA (along with MVDP) stated pretty clearly at the start of the CX season that the only race that mattered was the WC? Then the week of the race Wout hedges and downplays (after getting smoked the week prior)? Meanwhile, MVDP (who clearly has more of champion/winner mentality) says straight up nothing but winning is good enough - and then goes out and gets the job done. MVDP has plenty of time to get right for RVV and PR - as does Wout. So why exactly wasn't Wout peaking for CX Worlds? Bottom line is that was a HUGE race for both of them given the head to head nature and build up - and per usual, MVDP came out on top when it mattered most.

 

[Skijumper Roglic fan]

I just noticed Sbaragli rides as domestique for Mathieu tomorrow.

Sbaragli was Ciolek‘s domestique when Ciolek won THIS great(est) edition of Sanremo in 2013, in epic conditions.

Now ten years later, another time for Sbaragli to celebrate? He‘s a really good rider himself, just to be at the startline tomorrow. Of course he‘s Italian which helps here, but he proved he‘s strong, more than once.

 

[tobydawq]

Champion!

 

[jmdirt]

MvdP!

 

[Ricco']

You did it, you beast!

I'm literally crying.

 

[waku waku]

Great win! Showing once again that when it matters he's better than WVA.

 

[Gigs_98]

3rd monument to his name. Starting to accumulate the wins to end his career as one of the best classics riders.

 

[Red Rick]

Why does this have to be about MvdP vs Van Aert.

I just wanna enjoy a magical win.

 

[Elos Anjos]

Congratulations Mathieu!

 

[tobydawq]

Why does this have to be about MvdP vs Van Aert.

I just wanna enjoy a magical win.

You're the first to mention Van Aert?

 

[KZD]

Proving the doubters wrong once again. This could be a historic season for Van der Poel. 5th CX world title, MSR win and I think another big win will still come.

 

[Red Rick]

You're the first to mention Van Aert?

I'm not