Teams & Riders The "MVP" Mathieu Van der Poel Road Discussion Thread

[Salvarani]

So riding like he does is the solution after being beaten quite convincingly two times by Pog? I just disagree, think he must rethink strategy against Pog in Ronde. Pog is so confident in his capabilites that he will push even if MvdP rides more conservative and doesn't contribute as much.

Tough luck for MVDP if he cant match Pog. Pog wont push and do all the work. It benefits everyone else if they play games with each other.

Hard race and drop the others is still his best strategy, for both of them. Then it will always be mano a mano between them. How he has the best chance to win.

 

[Medvind]

Tough luck for MVDP if he cant match Pog.

But hard race and drop the others is still his best strategy. How he has the best chance to win.
.

Again, trying to "outstrong" Pog won't work. RVV is naturally hard, no point in making it extra hard when Pog is in the race. Use other riders more, like van Aert, Pedersen, etc. and maybe attack like Wout did to get ahead before Kwaremont, or trust you have saved enough energy to follow Pog last time up Kwaremont. Again, we just disagree.

 

[AmRacer]

Again, trying to "outstrong" Pog won't work. RVV is naturally hard, no point in making it extra hard when Pog is in the race. Use other riders more, like van Aert, Pedersen, etc. and maybe attack like Wout did to get ahead before Kwaremont, or trust you have saved enough energy to follow Pog last time up Kwaremont. Again, we just disagree.

Again, Pog will follow every attack by Mathieu. And Pog won't cover every attack by other riders, Mathieu must help too if he wants to win.

 

[Medvind]

Again, Pog will follow every attack by Mathieu. And Pog won't cover every attack by other riders, Mathieu must help too if he wants to win.

Sure he must help some. It's not black or white. My point is that MVDP must have more energy left in the end to give himself a fighting chance against Pog, and I think that requires him to gamble a bit. That's just my view after seeing Pog winning convincingly two times against MVDP

 

[AmRacer]

Sure he must help some. It's not black or white. My point is that MVDP must have more energy left in the end to give himself a fighting chance against Pog, and I think that requires him to gamble a bit. That's just my view after seeing Pog winning convincingly two times against MVDP

Only way is to have a teammate with him. But when both Mathieu and Tadej are isolated like today, there's nothing else Mathieu can do.

 

[Salvarani]

Again, trying to "outstrong" Pog won't work. RVV is naturally hard, no point in making it extra hard when Pog is in the race. Use other riders more, like van Aert, Pedersen, etc. and maybe attack like Wout did to get ahead before Kwaremont, or trust you have saved enough energy to follow Pog last time up Kwaremont. Again, we just disagree.

He has been able to follow in the past and in multiple other races.

How would he use other riders?

Van Aert and Pedersen would use their teams/strength in numbers. If Pog and MVDP just looks at each other, it is a increasingly bigger chance for them to get away or anyone else. It would be a dream scenario for other teams if Mvdp and Pog dont banded together. They would be the biggest losers in such a scenario.

Dropping the others and working together is the best chance for either of them to win. Then it is just mano a mano.

 

[Medvind]

He has been able to follow in the past and in multiple other races.

How would he use other riders?

Van Aert and Pedersen would use their teams/strength in numbers. If Pog and MVDP just looks at each other, it is a increasingly bigger chance for them to get away or anyone else. It would be a dream scenario for other teams if Mvdp and Pog dont banded together.

Dropping the others and working together is the best chance for either of them to win. Then it is just mano a mano.

Mano a mano against Pog is his best chance... Alright, let's say I don't agree.
That's playing right into Pog's hands. He should ride more tactically if he wants to win, and yes that includes gamble a bit.

We just see it differently.

 

[Salvarani]

Mano a mano against Pog is his best chance... Alright, let's say I don't agree.
That's playing right into Pog's hands. He should ride more tactically if he wants to win, and yes that includes gamble a bit.

We just see it differently.

You dont have to agree, but that is the best chance to win. Eliminate as many riders as possible.

 

[Medvind]

I might change my mind if I get convincing evidence that his crash and sickness really set him down today. Otherwise I stand by my view that he needs a different strategy to beat Pog in Ronde.

 

[Medvind]

You dont have to agree, but that is best chance to win.

So you think. That's the best to come 2nd. I was talking about him actually winning.

 

[Salvarani]

He can try a different strategy but he would rely a lot more on luck to win.

 

[AmRacer]

So you think. That's the best to come 2nd. I was talking about him actually winning.

He will win if he can follow Pogi as in 2022.

 

[Salvarani]

So you think. That's the best to come 2nd. I was talking about him actually winning.

No, it is the best way to win for both of them.

Instead of racing against other strong teams and getting tactically outplayed.

 

[kn0s]

A MvdP without crash or sickness can't go up last Kwaremont 12 seconds faster than Stuyven? Would be very surprised if any tactics could make up for his setbacks.

 

[Medvind]

He will win if he can follow Pogi as in 2022.

Come on. Pog 2025 is a different animal and that was Pog's first Ronde. What we have seen from Pog last couple of years is just another level. Winning worlds with a 100k solo attack, Strade with a 80k attack. That's just otherwordly. Trying mano a mano against Pog in Ronde is a losing strategy I believe.

No point in continuing this, we just disagree and that's fine.

 

[AmRacer]

Come on. Pog 2025 is a different animal and that was Pog's first Ronde. What we have seen from Pog last couple of years is just another level. Winning worlds with a 100k solo attack, Strade with a 80k attack. That's just otherwordly. Trying mano a mano against Pog in Ronde is a losing strategy I believe.

No point in continuing this, we just disagree and that's fine.

I do agree, Trying mano a mano against Pog in Ronde is a losing strategy.

 

[Salvarani]

MVDP also has multiple long solos under his belt.

How he has won most of his big wins are from attacking. Hard race and solo.

Both Pog and him have had the same recipe for a lot of their wins.

So of course, they both realize that if they work with and not against each other... they will both have the same opportunity to win. Otherwise... someone else will have a bigger chance to win. Their chance of wining decreases if they refuse to work with each other.

Hence they been trading wins in most of the monuments in the last few years. They simply been the strongest and best riders.

Pog might be able to drop MVDP, but at the same MVDP will always have advantage if it comes down to a sprint.

 

[Netserk]

A MvdP without crash or sickness can't go up last Kwaremont 12 seconds faster than Stuyven? Would be very surprised if any tactics could make up for his setbacks.

Stuyven was the rider who had it easiest until Kwaremont. That matters, and is why it would have mattered too if Van der Poel had worked less.

 

[Salvarani]

Stuyven was the rider who had it easiest until Kwaremont. That matters, and is why it would have mattered too if Van der Poel had worked less.

Doesnt explain how Van Aert was able to ride past MVDP.

He had worked a lot and also attacked right before.

Styuven had also definitely done a lot of work.

 

[AmRacer]

Stuyven was the rider who had it easiest until Kwaremont. That matters, and is why it would have mattered too if Van der Poel had worked less.

If Mathieu had worked less, Visma and Trek had joined earlier.

 

[Salvarani]

If Mathieu had worked less, Visma and Trek had joined earlier.

And they would have attacked much earlier than Van Aert did to use their numbers.

 

[Red Rick]

If Mathieu had worked less, Visma and Trek had joined earlier.

Perfectly fine. Just react to Pogacar on the hills, that's all you need to do.

 

[Medvind]

Mathieu:

Just before the second pass on the Oude Kwaremont, I was hit by a car, which meant I had to come from far away.

That explains it. I thought it strange he was so far back when I 15s before, in another screenshot, saw him just beside Pog.

 

[Salvarani]

Perfectly fine. Just react to Pogacar on the hills, that's all you need to do.

This implies or taking for granted that nobody else is doing anything or wouldnt take advantage of the situation.

It sets up the perfect scenario for someone else to counter.

 

[Red Rick]

I am straight memeing *** into existence now. I call Pogacar a luck merchant and voila - his main rival gets hit by illness, a crash, and a car, all in one race.

I should perhaps try to manifest some positive *** for once.