The official debate: Should Contador have waited for Schleck?

[Angliru]

I still don't see how it's a "completely different situation" between this and stage 3 - do you wait for the MJ after a mechanical/crash or don't you? It can't be subjective.

Andy Schleck really can't have it both ways. Either you wait on the yellow jersey wearer or not. They (Saxo) didn't wait on Chavanel when he crashed while wearing the leaders' jersey on stage 3. They didn't even wait to see if Frank Schleck was okay when his crash caused Contador to lose the time the time that he did on that stage. Someone said "karma is a b!tch". That applies here also.

 

[indurain666]

Reaction coming in from experts and media around the world. Sounds like a full-fledged condemnation of Contador, mirroring Cycling News' sentiments itself.

Yet to find a single article defending Contador's attack.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/spo...full-of-anger-at-contador-who-gets-booed.html

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/SPORT/07/19/cycling.schleck.contador.tour/#fbid=FTvuKXA5UZq

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSLDE66I1WA20100719

http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/other/2010/0719/1224275064568.html

LOL...experts ??? you are quoting CNN and LA times to analyze cycling? give me a break!

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Reaction coming in from experts and media around the world. Sounds like a full-fledged condemnation of Contador, mirroring Cycling News' sentiments itself.

Yet to find a single article defending Contador's attack.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/spo...full-of-anger-at-contador-who-gets-booed.html

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/SPORT/07/19/cycling.schleck.contador.tour/#fbid=FTvuKXA5UZq

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSLDE66I1WA20100719

http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/other/2010/0719/1224275064568.html

really?? haven't read what riis said??

 

[scribe]

The 27-year-old said: “We stopped in Spa when he had a bad crash — today it was something different.

“I understand that he is disappointed for what happened today, but when that happened I was on the attack.

“At the moment I attacked the situation was very close, very tight. I attacked before I knew he had problems with his chain and I was already ahead. It was not possible to do what we did in Spa and stop the race.”

Contador^^^^

correction AC, when it happened, you were under a heavy Shrek assault.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Asked for their opinion on the incident, Laurent Jalabert, Bernard Thévenet and Bernard Hinault all described Schleck's incident as an inescapable part of racing and said they were looking ahead to see how Contador and Schleck will respond.

From the CN article.

 

[Anonymous]

Right, so he waited for Andy, not the others, then made sure the fastest descender was in front, just because. A right case of indecisiveness there.

You'd have a point if in any interview Contador had actually said he was waiting for Andy at all. He did not and he was not. I'm not dissing the action, but people said he supposedly was waiting, if he was waiting, it wasn't for Andy, but for someone to help him put even more time on him.
It appears to me to be an intelligent strategy, actually.

He waited, and when Samu and Menchov pulled through, he latched on. He made a decision at that point to ride with them for good or bad.

Yes, it would have been an EXTREMELY generous action to wait for Schlecklet at that point and lose time to Menchov and Samu. One that would be lauded for generations.

He didn't, and I just don't thing it was unforgivable, though if it were Armstrong who had done it, I would have never forgiven it. Hey, that is just how I roll.

 

[cyclestationgiuseppe]

Headlines will say

"Contador in Yellow due to a mechanical."

 

[benpounder]

A couple of observations:

I think the incident today is in no way analogous to stage three.

Looking at this video, it may be that Contador had no idea what happened. If you look closely, Vino, on the verge of bridging was glancing over his right shoulder when Andy's chain dropped (-0.42). Contador charged across a second after Vino rode by Schleck(-0.37). Note also that Schleck is still pedaling, but his looking down. In fact, if you watch further (-0.13), you see a normal Contador attack, and when he does look over his shoulder and sees Menchov and Sanchez coming across, he does a double take and looks down the road to where Andy is getting the push from a spectator and neutral support.

If you really want to blame someone, both Menchov and Sanchez were the ones that were riding by Schleck when he was getting off his bike. They knew something was amiss.

In all, I find it a unfortunate incident, but the fault of no-one including Andy. Dropping a chain when shifting on a climb is something that happens to everyone - it is not a rookie mistake.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

From the CN article.

Lol @ whoever posted that to schlecks defense

 

[irritated_cycling_fan]

Cycling Unwritten Rules

I've posted this before but today it needs to be posted again. Yes, this from back in 2003 but it's still the best written explanation that I've ever read. Whether couch cyclists are aware of them or not, there ARE unwritten rules in cycling. The mere fact that the media questions what happened, we here have devoted huge numbers of posts to it and that the riders in question are making excuses, show that there are and everyone knows about them.

http://articles.latimes.com/2003/jul/23/sports/sp-tour23

Unwritten rules mean there is no 'official' penalty when the rules are broken but ask any pro rider if he really wants the majority of a peloton angry with him. I sure wouldn't want to ride in any group that po'd at me!

 

[Cobblestones]

Still Bertie should have just followed DM and SS.

I'm not arguing either way, just translating what Riis said.

He also said:

Every professional rider has a damned obligation to check his equipment.

What it clarifies is that it wasn't an unlucky 'mechanical', it was a screwup by Andy.

 

[Biological Entity]

though if it were Armstrong who had done it, I would have never forgiven it. Hey, that is just how I roll.

Yeah a hypocrite who doesn't understand the sport.

 

[Anonymous]

Well, Riis disagrees with him, but what does he know?

Riis is courting AC to be on his team next year, so of course he is going to side with Bertie.

 

[roundabout]

When you get up and change gear, no matter whether you're in front or in the back, you have to watch it.

Every riders knows this. And this is Andy's responsibility. It's only Andy's fault said Bjarne Riis.

He also said that he didn't see what happened on TV and the car was too far back.

Here's also something you can translate

http://tour2010.tv2.dk/article.php/id-32296617:riis-contador-begår-en-fejl.html

 

[jilbiker]

Yes, I do believe the claims that Andy was going to bury Alberto on the climb is completely wrong. And right or wrong with Alberto riding away, he's got yellow. Anything we say here will not change the standings.

Did you notice Vino chased AS and AC sat back? Astana had a plan for today. That wasn't by accident. I am not sure what the logic was, maybe they would wait for AS attack and Vino will burn him out then AS would crush whatever remains

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

He also said that he didn't see what happened on TV and the car was too far back.

Here's also something you can translate

http://tour2010.tv2.dk/article.php/id-32296617:riis-contador-begår-en-fejl.html

he said this after he seen the videos

 

[MKirilenko]

"Contador in Yellow due to a mechanical."

Contador in yellow due to Schleck's inability to decent any good

 

[Biological Entity]

"Contador in Yellow due to a mechanical."

I'm surprised that AC fanboys don't even care about wanting to be SEEN to win in the right way. Wouldn't they prefer AC to get the yellow by riding Schleck off the wheel?

They're not really in the spirit of things. I guess they just want to support whoever is the winner and how it's done doesn't matter.

 

[Anonymous]

Riis is courting AC to be on his team next year, so of course he is going to side with Bertie.

Yea, and Andy is leaving him even though he has new sponsors. No honor among thieves anywhere is there?

Well, one thing for sure, this has been an entertaining Tour.

 

[scribe]

I've posted this before but today it needs to be posted again. Yes, this from back in 2003 but it's still the best written explanation that I've ever read. Whether couch cyclists are aware of them or not, there ARE unwritten rules in cycling. The mere fact that the media questions what happened, we here have devoted huge numbers of posts to it and that the riders in question are making excuses, show that there are and everyone knows about them.

http://articles.latimes.com/2003/jul/23/sports/sp-tour23

Unwritten rules mean there is no 'official' penalty when the rules are broken but ask any pro rider if he really wants the majority of a peloton angry with him. I sure wouldn't want to ride in any group that po'd at me!

A situation of attacking a stronger rider on a mechanical, at a critical point of the race, cheapens the efforts of all involved in the race.

 

[indurain666]

I really feel bad for Alberto. Last year he had to ride the whole Tour with the whole LA/JB crap on his dinner table every single day. The guy makes a mistake (ok I don't think he should have waited after nobody waited for him...but lets call it a mistake for argument's sake) and now we have thousands or LA fanboys, french cynics and haters writing thousands of garbage articles. These are basically the same guys that were criticizing him last year for not sticking to JB's "plan"

I know the guy is easy to hate for American audiences (i.e. humble, down to earth, soft spoken, Spanish) but come on...

I can't wait to see AC crushing AS during the TT

 

[Biological Entity]

Riis is courting AC to be on his team next year, so of course he is going to side with Bertie.

True, but he also seems to have given two different opinions of what happened. First saying he didn't see it but this is just part of the sport, but then saying after he saw it that he thinks AC did not play fairly. That's what was said further up this thread but don't have either of the quotes for this yet.

 

[theovaf]

They could have waited
a. on the descent
b. if they thought AS had a mechanical problem, not if they regerded it as AS's fault.

 

[roundabout]

he said this after he seen the videos

How's an opinion made after actually seeing what happened is worse than one made without seeing?

Rolleyes to you too, sir.

 

[saganftw]

Contador in yellow due to Schleck's inability to decent any good

do you realize that if andy and alberto were descending together andy wouldnt loose the time do you?