The Patrick Lefevere Depreciation Thread

[saganftw]

i think roundabout is just honestly confused about business relationships in DQS, not wasting time

 

[IndianCyclist]

. One single rider like Kopecky doesn't change that.

One single rider does change the cycling history of a nation- i.e Wiggins, Vino, Pogacar, Quintana etc
Also the way the same PL stalked Remco from the beginning for a signing is also notable

 

[roundabout]

he has a right to refuse as an owner of the business, what is the confusion about, if you own a bakery you can decide what to bake - that doesnt prevent the sponsor from seting up ladies team even under same title sponsor perhaps, but obviously not with lefevre

i think the whole idea is that Lefevre himself would be setting up ladies team as an experienced and succesful manager, so he would also run the operations which he obviously refused

if Deceuninck decided to make a ladies team, thats perfectly fine within their rights, they can hire a DS and there you go

I don't see where it is said that Lefevere is against running the team in the piece on the front page. And I don't see where Lefevere's possible role in a potential ladies team is discussed at all.

All I see is that he doesn't want to do the development work that may be required to bring a possible ladies team to a level where it becomes interesting for him to be involved.

 

[yaco]

One thing I don't understand is why Lefevere is talking like he is the one putting money into the team.

I am just curious if the sponsor was to say, ok we're investing in a ladies team , what could Lefevere do about it.

LeFevre would have no choice if the sponsor was strong in their commitment to women's cycling.

 

[roundabout]

People who flat-out misrepresent and invent stuff shouldn't be too worried about tone. I'm sorry if my bluntness calling you out displeases you - you'll have to deal with it though.






Yeah, and it's 100% correct. Obviously he doesn't have the experience, time, money or desire to be the one investing in getting Belgian girls to take road cycling seriously - as he says, he's not the OCMW. Nobody in their right mind would take exception to that quote.


Do you actually have any point at all here or is it this just wasting time?

The news piece presented this as an answer to the question about the teams investment.

Of course being confused and just wasting your time (no idea why you replied if that is the case), I am still left wondering where the "I" comes in from a person who is at best a minority shareholder in the company operating the team .

 

[RedheadDane]

I am just curious if the sponsor was to say, ok we're investing in a ladies team , what could Lefevere do about it.

There would be nothing stopping a sponsor from also sponsoring a women's team, even if said team had nothing to do - organisationally - with the men's team.

 

[roundabout]

i think roundabout is just honestly confused about business relationships in DQS, not wasting time

Yes, I am confused. I don't know why Lefevere seemingly decides on behalf of Bakala who owns the majority of the team how the money should be invested.

Edited: added seemingly for clarity

 

[saganftw]

Yes, I am confused. I don't know why Lefevere decides on behalf of Bakala who owns the majority of the team how the money should be invested.

because he is CEO and im just guessing here but probably not much that whoever is majority owner of the team wouldnt go against lefevere

so when lefevere doesnt want to do it, then its not being done...the other alternative would be what? fire lefevere (or buy him out) because he doesnt want ladies team?

Bakala or whoever can create their own ladies team, with another DS

 

[Bullrun]

The news piece presented this as an answer to the question about the teams investment.

Of course being confused and just wasting your time (no idea why you replied if that is the case), I am still left wondering where the "I" comes in from a person who is at best a minority shareholder in the company operating the team .

Once again, no matter how much you lie about this, Lefevere wasn't even referring to the creation of a professional women's team; rather about the development aspect of creating a critical mass of Belgian pro riders.

And the "I" comes from him saying he, himself, doesn't have the expertise, qualifications, money, etc, to do that work - I should think 100% of people without some sort of severe cognitive issues would agree with him. That was the point he was making - there's work that needs to be done; i'm sorry but I can't do it myself. How on earth did you get to the point this troubles you? Honest question.

Did you even watch the interview?

 

[Bullrun]

One single rider does change the cycling history of a nation- i.e Wiggins, Vino, Pogacar, Quintana etc
Also the way the same PL stalked Remco from the beginning for a signing is also notable

What does that have to do with Lefevere's point there aren't enough high-level Belgian cyclists to make sense for him to create a professional team under the DQS organization at this point? Kopecky isn't the female Remco and Lefevere already had a team before Remco.

At least seems the loony mob has abandoned the "Lefevere was being misogynist and hates women cycling" by simply making up stuff he didn't say (reminder that Lefevere has put his own money on women's cycling, probably a larger contribution to the sport than any made by his wild-eyed self-righteous critics here) for trying to parse his comments in search of something.

 

[roundabout]

Once again, no matter how much you lie about this, Lefevere wasn't even referring to the creation of a professional women's team; rather about the development aspect of creating a critical mass of Belgian pro riders.

And the "I" comes from him saying he, himself, doesn't have the expertise, qualifications, money, etc, to do that work - I should think 100% of people without some sort of severe cognitive issues would agree with him.

Did you even watch the interview?

Are you Lefevere himself? You seem to take this way too close to heart.

And I think you may have the same severe cognitive issues yourself as it seems that you are unable to comprehend the first sentence in the post that you quoted.

 

[roundabout]

because he is CEO and im just guessing here but probably not much that whoever is majority owner of the team wouldnt go against lefevere

so when lefevere doesnt want to do it, then its not being done...the other alternative would be what? fire lefevere (or buy him out) because he doesnt want ladies team?

Bakala or whoever can create their own ladies team, with another DS

"I" don't have the money is still a strange comment.

 

[Hugh Januss]

People who flat-out misrepresent and invent stuff shouldn't be too worried about tone. I'm sorry if my bluntness calling you out displeases you - you'll have to deal with it though.

Ok dude fess up are you actually Lefevere posting here under another name, you remind me of some of the Armstrong defenders.

 

[Bullrun]

Are you Lefevere himself? You seem to take this way too close to heart.

A couple of weeks ago I was Efapel DS because I called out silly fantasies in a topic; now I'm Patrick Lefevere because I'm pointing out people are misrepresenting and lying about what he actually said. Mediocre minds are always alike.

I don't like liars and fantasists.

Once again, there's nothing wrong whatsoever about that statement. The fact you seem to take exception about the man using the word "I" while talking about what he himself can or cannot do is flat out surreal.

In fact, I suspect you're so unserious that you didn't even watch the interview and won't admit to it.

 

[BlueRoads]

Ok dude fess up are you actually Lefevere posting here under another name, you remind me of some of the Armstrong defenders.

Actually, looking at a few of his older posts that seems to be a general tone of his and not confined to the PL topic. Doesn't make it much better.

 

[BlueRoads]

I didn't watch the interview, I read a transcript, and I still think he comes across as very ignorant concerning women's cycling.

 

[saganftw]

"I" don't have the money is still a strange comment.

i assume its a figure of speech

yes technically speaking its not "his" money, but what he meant was that he still decides where the money goes because he is CEO

is that understandable? i dont think he puts his own private money into it

 

[Bullrun]

I didn't watch the interview, I read a transcript, and I still think he comes across as very ignorant concerning women's cycling.

Yeah, the man who had his own company sponsoring a women's professional cycling team is "very ignorant concerning women's cycling" because he gave a realistic assessment of the current state of Belgian cycling.

What we can't contemplate is the possibility that you might be wrong.

 

[happytramp]

What does that have to do with Lefevere's point there aren't enough high-level Belgian cyclists to make sense for him to create a professional team under the DQS organization at this point? Kopecky isn't the female Remco and Lefevere already had a team before Remco.

At least seems the loony mob has abandoned the "Lefevere was being misogynist and hates women cycling" by simply making up stuff he didn't say (reminder that Lefevere has put his own money on women's cycling, probably a larger contribution to the sport than any made by his wild-eyed self-righteous critics here) for trying to parse his comments in search of something.

I'm still not sure where all this 'mob' stuff is coming from... Does a couple of people calling into question somebody's code of conduct constitute being part of a mob?... And if you're looking for people to act with more respect for one another when speaking in the media, shouldn't that be a good thing?

 

[roundabout]

A couple of weeks ago I was Efapel DS because I called out silly fantasies in a topic; now I'm Patrick Lefevere because I'm pointing out people are misrepresenting and lying about what he actually said. Mediocre minds are always alike.

I don't like liars and fantasists.

Once again, there's nothing wrong whatsoever about that statement. The fact you seem to take exception about the man using the word "I" while talking about what he himself can or cannot do is flat out surreal.

In fact, I suspect you're so unserious that you didn't even watch the interview and won't admit to it.

My mediocre mind at least probably no longer suffers from the megalomania of being the only one who knows the truth.

But anyway, I do not believe that the question was about what Lefevere himself can do. And of course obviously nobody expects Lefevere alone using his own money and his own time to fix the issues in Belgian cycling, so as much as it pains you judging by your hysteria, the rational interpretation of the question was whether QS as an organization should invest money in development of ladies cycling.

 

[BlueRoads]

Yeah, the man who had his own company sponsoring a women's professional cycling team is "very ignorant concerning women's cycling" because he gave a realistic assessment of the current state of Belgian cycling.

What we can't contemplate is the possibility that you might be wrong.

Just because he had some financial involvement with women's cycling doesn't mean he doesn't come across the way I said? He might also have some shares of an Alpaca farm and still not be interested in Alpacas. And if he talks like that about women's cycling that's not a "realistic assessment." Actually I think that especially in women's cycling it wouldn't be too hard to build a successful Belgian based team if he was interested in it. If it's not what he wants to do - fine for me. But he shouldn't talk like it's not worth it in general, meaning for others as well, like there aren't enough talented young women in Belgium and Europe.

I will always contemplate the possibility that I'm wrong when I see a reason to do so. Here I don't.

 

[Bullrun]

I'm still not sure where all this 'mob' stuff is coming from... Does a couple of people calling into question somebody's code of conduct constitute being part of a mob?... And if you're looking for people to act with more respect for one another when speaking in the media, shouldn't that be a good thing?

What would be a good thing? Since when making up and misrepresenting what anyone said to then make unhinged, angry, ignorant accusations is a good thing? How on earth will that "increase respect for one another"?

I don't care if people rightfully call out Lefevere's "code of conduct" or whatever. Just don't invent stuff to justify your self-righteous anger. Is this really that hard to understand? It seems pretty easy to me.

As for the mob, I quoted some 7 or 8 comments from about that many people that varied between misrepresentation, invention, inanity and uncharitable re: Lefevere actual interview.

Now the same people who have no trouble with being so uncharitable they completely misrepresent and lie about someone's comments are very troubled about a far less acrimonious tone of posts - because it's directed at them.

If you were genuinely worried about "respect for one another", you'd start by actually calling out the people who completely misrepresented Lefevere views - I mean, they can actually read you and your words have an impact. If you can't even bring yourself to do that, it's more than fair to assume you don't actually care about it.

 

[roundabout]

i assume its a figure of speech

yes technically speaking its not "his" money, but what he meant was that he still decides where the money goes because he is CEO

is that understandable? i dont think he puts his own private money into it

I don't know the ins and outs of QS business relationships like you, so I am not going to guess whether this is actually the case. It is still strange for me that Lefevere would have the final word over the majority shareholder and the sponsor about the money allocation, but fine. Let it be.

 

[Hugh Januss]

Another team director might say "Bennett broke our internal rules" or "We have no plans to start a Women's team at this time", but not Lefevere. At every opportunity he manages to come off sounding like nothing more than an angry ill tempered drunk.

 

[Bullrun]

Just because he had some financial involvement with women's cycling doesn't mean he doesn't come across the way I said?

You didn't even watch the interview, how would you even know how he came across?

He might also have some shares of an Alpaca farm and still not be interested in Alpacas. And if he talks like that about women's cycling that's not a "realistic assessment."

What does "talk like that" even means? He talked like he talked and was roughly accurate.

His assessment of the Belgian women cycling existing state of affairs was spot on.

Again, there's a single rider in the UCI top-100.

And even if he was wrong, it'd just be a disagreement over the current crop of female Belgian cyclists - hardly a reason to call someone ignorant unless you're a loon who believes the reason anyone can disagree with you is because they're ignorant.

Actually I think that especially in women's cycling it wouldn't be too hard to build a successful Belgian based team if he was interested in it.

Well, then feel free to do it yourself; instead of calling ignorant to anyone who disagrees with your views.

. But he shouldn't talk like it's not worth it in general,

He never did that. You made it up.

How could he even say that when he's invested in the past (I actually think he still sponsors a cyclo-cross team)? He was talking about a Belgian pro team right now - his entire point was actually that it'd be worth it in different circumstances.

If you were actually an honest person, you'd admit to that. You won't.