The Tour de Oprah (WT) (1 team of 1 rider) Live Thread

[airstream]

And vice versa. With LA's natural numbers he was never going to win the Tour. Period. Now, let's move forward.

Ah,one has to have proper numbers? Probably you have some data on who became a GT rider so to speak unfairly and undeservedly among nowadays riders?

 

[Ferminal]

Bit hard to say who is or isn't a GT rider when they are all blood dopers, no one knows when they started doping. Big mark against Lance though is that even with EPO he wasn't a contender, it was only with the magic of Schumi that he was able to take the next step.

 

[Benotti69]

Hmmmm.....



(apologies if I'm repeating what wonderboy wants me to have said)

Wondered when you would show up. Finished commentating on all the major news sites before comeing in here

 

[GJB123]

Bruyneel wasn't the best manager in terms of doping back then, I'm sure. I agree to admit, yes, extreme luck on the passage du gois helped Lance and very likely he was not clearly the strongest cyclist in the 1999 Tour if the rivals hadn't been eliminated because of crash. A natural situation — when the sport simply couldn't afford one more scandal after Festina affair and covered up him partially — helped him too. But as to lack of talent and doping edge, I'm disagree on these matters.

Ask Bassons what he thought of LA's exploits in the stage to Sestrieres. He rode in the '99 peloton and paid a hefty price for airing his opinion (which turned out to be correct).

 

[Arnout]

Hmmmm.....

Just watched the first hour of the interview on youtube. I feel able to have a pretty dispassionate view on this, never having been a fan of the man, but equally not saddled with the bizarre burning hatred that some here have (It's just sport guys)

Some thoughts. Firstly, I think some people are hearing what they want to hear rather than what is being said, one of those being Lemond (of whom I am a massive admirer). He is reported as being outraged that LA said it isn't possible to win the Tour clean. Except that isn't what he said. Listen carefully and you'll hear the words 'at that time'.... and he is almost certainly right about that. I don't think he is referring to anything other than the 99-05 era.

I found the interview compelling. The man is compelling. I think his replies were a mixture of truth, but also a few more evasions and lies. I don't think he was telling the truth about coercing team mates to dope if they wanted to ride the tour. I think he is well aware of the reading between the lines that riders had to do, as he wrote the script. I'm also curious as to why he refused to openly admit the hospital scene, even though tacitly admitting to it by referring to his phonecall to the Andreus.

Above all, the feeling I'm left with is that once he undertook the path of cheating, lying and covering his tracks with lawsuits he set himself on the path that he had to follow and this is one of the two possible consequences of it. It is all quite logical, but it is the logic of the psychopath.

(apologies if I'm repeating what others have said)

LeMond should know better than to open his mouth. I know of only one more self-centered person than him and that is Armstrong. LeMond has the tendency to see everything as an attack on himself.

Edit: let me make it clear: I think Lemond is genuine, but I don't like his personality.

 

[Epicycle]

Basson thinks Armstrong is heading for a political career. I dont think it is possible. He has too many skeletons.

His name will forever be associated with cheating and not just in sport.

I think he will take infamous just as much as being famous. In 10 years will being infamous mean he will still be rich. I hope not.

Seems to me that this may be Lance's ultimate dream:

- Do Oprah and following interviews, work himself back in the public's good graces again by showing what a flawed human he is.

- Become Mr. Livestrong again.

- Win Ironman Hawaii or even somehow make the 2016 Olympic triathlon team, be celebrated for overcoming great adversity a second time.

- Become governor of Texas.


Right now it looks like the only thing he's going to accomplish is confirming to the public what a flawed, creepy something-not-quite-human he is.

 

[airstream]

OMG, read up. For a scientific experiment a number of samples of the '99 Tour were retested for EPO. All samples were tested anonymously and not only LA's samples were tested. A journlaist of L'Equipe managed to link some of the tested samples to LA. 6 of LA's samples were positive for EPO.

It means the others rode on other stuff. Anyway I can admit he had a better doping. Though, it often relates to all of GT winners.

 

[spalco]

Armstrong less likable after Oprah interview

The media's not buying his ****.

 

[GJB123]

LeMond should know better than to open his mouth. I know of only one more self-centered person than him and that is Armstrong. LeMond has the tendency to see everything as an attack on himself.

Edit: let me make it clear: I think Lemond is genuine, but I don't like his personality.

Well with regards to LA me thinks LeMond is quite justifiably p!ssed off. The man cost him his bike business. But hey, LeMond should be bigger than that and let bygones be bygones. LeMond has more class and more personality in his little pinky toe than Armstrong can ever hope to have. My guess is that you don't like the personality as LA's camp portrayed it. That picture is far from the truth though.

 

[GJB123]

It means the others rode on other stuff. Anyway I can admit he had a better doping. Though, it often relates to all of GT winners.

Why do you find it so difficult to say you're sorry and you were wrong?

 

[Joachim]

A lot of people have been very wronged by Armstrong. Lemond is way up there on that list. Let's not forget he was massively and nastily wronged by Landis too.

I have to disagree with Arnout's assessment of Lemond, he is one of the few people who comes out of this without looking like he had much in the way of self-interest...quite the opposite, in fact.

 

[Briant_Gumble]

I'd like to hear Sheryl crows take.

Given she said Armstrong getting stripped by USADA was "hard to watch", I can't imagine what she thinks of his performance on Oprah:

"To be honest Oprah we sued so many people, I can't remember"

"I called you crazy, I called you a ***** ..... but I never called you fat *proudly picks himself up 3 inches in his chair at this point*".

 

[mountainrman]

Armstrong less likable after Oprah interview

The media's not buying his ****.

Some of that is premature:

Juliet Macur says "Armstrong failed to do the one thing many people had been waiting for: He failed to apologize directly to all the people who believed in him, all the cancer survivors and cycling fans who thought his fairy-tale story was true,"

In as far as we know, or so Oprah says: others affected - Livestrong, Fans, Family and so on are the subject of tonights continuation, so she should hold off judgement on that issue until she sees all.

 

[Joachim]

"I called you crazy, I called you a ***** ..... but I never called you fat *proudly picks himself up 3 inches in his chair at this point*".

I wondered if that was an attempt at humour from Armstrong

 

[Amsterhammer]

I wondered if that was an attempt at humour from Armstrong

It obviously was a wasted attempt at using what his warped mind sees as 'humor' to make himself look more 'human'. You don't make a 'fat' joke to Oprah, that was a major **** up, and it only succeeded in ****ing off the growing numbers of the Betsy fan club even more.

 

[Briant_Gumble]

I wondered if that was an attempt at humour from Armstrong

I have no idea I half laughed/half cringed.

I think Anderson Cooper summed it up best when he said on CNN "When I heard that my jaw just hit the floor".

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=WTrkBRwT5Uc

 

[HL2037]

Have you called Betsy Andreu?

just calling her now................Yeh Baby...........!!!!!

thanks for Everyones insights during live stream.............here in the uk

no way was i going to watch live............in fact no way would i EVER

watch crap from oprah so i was lucky to catch up with the gossip

here

Yes, Oprah, I have. I have called her a crazy *****, a lunatic, a liar, a **** ****, a ******* cow and other things. But I have never called her fat. Giggle!

 

[Joachim]

It obviously was a wasted attempt at using what his warped mind sees as 'humor' to make himself look more 'human'. You don't make a 'fat' joke to Oprah, that was a major **** up, .

If it was humour, then it was awkward and crass.

Then again, given the man's pride, the whole situation must be a little...ahem...awkward

d it only succeeded in ****ing off the growing numbers of the Betsy fan club even more.

That sounds a bit too schoolyard for my liking. I think in this situation it is better to take a step back and try not to be a fan of anybody involved.

 

[HL2037]

"Professional victims" was an accurate comment on her and the rest of them.

And the worst professional victims of them all are the professional cancer victims, right?

 

[Oldman]

Just saw a promotion for CNN's planned "the World according to Armstrong" to air this weekend. It was immediately followed by a commercial for Low T! Amazing coincidence.
Watching CBS this morning with Johnathan Vaughters...JV was suggesting there is more to come and Lance must "testify under oath", but wasn't given much air time. He was less than comfortable as the CBS staff was augmented by Scott Pelley who featured Tyler Hamilton. It's clear that they intend to dig into why the DOJ dropped the charges and want to know about: fraud, drug trafficking and money transfers. The taint of international felony level charges are fast approaching Lance and I got this impression watching 10 minutes of broadcast across 3 channels.

 

[airstream]

Did you watch cycling in the nineties?

Just ask Paul Kimmage and David Walsh whether they felt it was logical that LA suddenly transformed into a GT-beast let alone contender.

And as far as your comments to AC. Yes, I think he doped and probablystill does. But he was already named as a possible GT-contender at a very young age. Now people may say he was already doing PED's at that time, truth is we don't know. And I have no problem whatsoever if he is caught again that he is banned again. Those are the rules and they also apply to AC.

So don't start this you are an AC-fanboi and that's why you tarnish Sky-nonsense. Anyone with half a working brain should ask questions on Sky's 2012 dominance as much as any sensible guy should have asked questions on LA in '99.

Only in remix.

They are only journalists. Why do I have to believe their subjective opinion? I follow for a long while too and have my subjective one.

Nonetheless, it doesn't interfere you to paint a precise line between rider who allegedly talent for GTs and others - who don't. I absolutely don't understand how you define this. Consistency and young age are only indirect indicators. Sometimes they work, sometimes not. The world doesn't consists of rules. There is ocean of exceptions. However, your vision of 'exceptions' works only for your riders. No wonder.


On the way you offended a significant part of the forum. Great job.


As for Sky, yes the guys demonstrate an outstanding cycling not without doping certainly as the greatest cyclists did. But your arguments about say lesser talent and more sophisticated doping are just laughable.

 

[GJB123]

Only in remix.

Blah-blah-blah.

I thought so. Thanks for confirming.

 

[D-Queued]

Yes, Oprah, I have. I have called her at crazy *****, a lunatic, a liar, a **** ****, a ******* cow and other things. But I have never called her fat. Giggle!

Ultimately, as much as we focus on the doping, this one statement is all that is required to expose Lance fully as a sociopath.

Everything, literally, falls apart from there.

Dave.

 

[GJB123]

As for Sky, yes the guys demonstrate an outstanding cycling not without doping certainly as the greatest cyclists did. But your arguments about say a lesser talent and more sophisticated doping are just laughable.

Could you please try again, because I have no clue what you are trying to say?

 

[airstream]

Could you please try again, because I have no clue what you are trying to say?

You clearly understand me. Want to ridicule the language? Then we'd better stop right now.