Teams & Riders Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

[Leinster]

I'm not talking about "everyone"

I'm talking about top level sport. To me this is a symptom of somebody that lacks the psychology to win this race. It's not like it is the first time we've seen this. He has DNFd more Tours than he has completed. That isnt just so-called 'bad luck'.

Again, I'm struggling to think of actual winners who would accept being hugged like this. Alaphilippe had a crap day too. No hugs, no dramas.

When Sean Kelly had to abandon the 87 Tour due to injury, his team all came back and rode with him, and even some leaders of other teams came back, put their arms over his shoulder, patted him on the back, and gave him encouragement.

SEAN KELLY.

Edit to tag on;

Races such as Paris-Nice mean nothing?

After Kelly had taken his first 2 Paris-Nice wins, people were still asking "but why can't he win a classic?"

 

[Armchaircyclist]

I'm a big fan of Pinot who I see as a rider with a huge heart for the sport, and an entertaining rider to watch. The only "mental problem" I can see him having is the ability to save his power for the right moment, conserve energy when he feels good. That seemed to be his downfall last year, as he injured himself maybe from going too hard when he did not have to. The critics here also seem to forget that he has been riding in an era of team dominance from way stronger teams than FDJ. I wish him all the best and hopes he can bring it all together next year

 

[macbindle]

^ which begs the question as to why he isnt riding for one of those stronger teams...

 

[Leinster]

^ which begs the question as to why he isnt riding for one of those stronger teams...

I think the "stronger team" thing is a red herring with Tibo. I think he's in just the right team environment to work to his strengths. He isn't a front-line GC contender, and that's what you have to be to captain a "bigger" team. He is, on his day, arguably the best of the next-tier contenders, so being the leader of a next-tier team that is willing to have patience with him, and build a team around him for reasonable objectives, is probably the right formula.

If there's one thing I would say, and with no knowledge of how the FDJ setup is, it's that, given his history, maybe they don't have the best medical team?

 

[HelloDolly]

I really dont understand how keyboard warriors can come on here and cast aspersions on the character of someone they never met and call them weak.A person who is for heavens sake riding the hardest sporting event on the planet

Pinot is injured.Its his back and it only kicks in when he is climbing ..hence how he can go well on the flat but not climb.

He has had the devils own luck both last year and this year ...but some people sitting on their asses think they are in a position to judge what kind of man he is or if he will ever wina GT when we know many like Thomas and Evans won late in l their careers and after several attempts

Do me a favour

 

[Eclipse]

I think the "stronger team" thing is a red herring with Tibo. I think he's in just the right team environment to work to his strengths. He isn't a front-line GC contender, and that's what you have to be to captain a "bigger" team. He is, on his day, arguably the best of the next-tier contenders, so being the leader of a next-tier team that is willing to have patience with him, and build a team around him for reasonable objectives, is probably the right formula.

If there's one thing I would say, and with no knowledge of how the FDJ setup is, it's that, given his history, maybe they don't have the best medical team?

Agree with this very much.

In a stronger team he might just be Wout Poels. A monument winner who can reel in the best riders but who spends his best years in pursuit of others ambitions.

I think he's had a good situation at FDJ and hopefully he'll be able to deliver some more significant results more before his career is over.

 

[Leinster]

In a stronger team he might just be Wout Poels. A monument winner who can reel in the best riders but who spends his best years in pursuit of others ambitions.

Could you imagine Pinot at Ineos, wasting away his best years domming like Kwiatkowski?

 

[macbindle]

I'm thinking of last year's TdF stage 9 or 10 (?) when he lost a chunk of time in crosswinds. (before his muscle tear) Would a stronger team have prevented that?

I'm trying to remember if any other teams have tried to poach him. Anybody know?

 

[Leinster]

I'm thinking of last year's TdF stage 9 or 10 (?) when he lost a chunk of time in crosswinds. (before his muscle tear) Would a stronger team have prevented that?

I'm trying to remember if any other teams have tried to poach him. Anybody know?

I'm trying to think back and remember if he had a mechanical or something that led to him being caught out. They fixed it this year.

Lots of big teams have been caught out by crosswinds. Tinkoff caught Sky out in 2013. Movistar got hammered on day 1 in 2015 (and ultimately lost more time that day than Froome's final margin of victory). We've seen Jumbo get caught out in the Vuelta last year, and in the Tour 2 years ago.


Brailsford has talked about how he'd like to win the Tour with a Frenchman, so I have no doubt that he has at least put the feelers out to Pinot and Bardet, and a few others.

 

[RedheadDane]

I'm trying to think back and remember if he had a mechanical or something that led to him being caught out. They fixed it this year.

It was the infamous wrong way 'round the roundabout thing.

 

[Tonton]

I'm thinking of last year's TdF stage 9 or 10 (?) when he lost a chunk of time in crosswinds. (before his muscle tear) Would a stronger team have prevented that?

I'm trying to remember if any other teams have tried to poach him. Anybody know?

FDJ took the wrong side of the roundabout, they were in the 30th-40th places and found themselves 80th or 90th. Echelon in the next kilometer, five guys before Pinot you were in...he was out.

Sir Dave tried to poach him. As the story goes, he would have had to move to the Nice-Monaco area, but he won't leave his small town. So that was the end of the discussions. And Thibaut won't even move 30 miles eastwards to Switzerland and save a ton in taxes. Money is nothing to him. And we chuckle about his goats and donkeys, but if you ask me, he's right: he's free.

 

[DanielSong39]

Dude has a back injury, riding in the Tour de France is usually not the recommended treatment

 

[Leinster]

It was the infamous wrong way 'round the roundabout thing.

God yeah. That was the one where EF managed to miss the split they created too, right?

 

[memyselfandI]

Could you imagine Pinot at Ineos, wasting away his best years domming like Kwiatkowski?

These two are actually quite same in head to head comparison, except Kawasaki is a world champion. Dunno how much MK have lost compared against Pinot, guessing his wallet ain't too thin.

 

[Tonton]

God yeah. That was the one where EF managed to miss the split they created too, right?

Yeah, they all went right and hit the gas pedal, except that Uran had gone left .

 

[Leinster]

These two are actually quite same in head to head comparison, except Kawasaki is a world champion. Dunno how much MK have lost compared against Pinot, guessing his wallet ain't too thin.

Well that’s it, Kwiat was a World Champ and Amstel winner, Paris Nice and LBL podium, before going to Sky.

Now, no doubt his wallet is fatter than it would ever have got staying with Lefevere, and his MSR win was a beaut, but there’s a GT stage-win shaped hole in his palmares, that any other team in the sport would no doubt have worked a lot harder for him to fill long before now.

 

[memyselfandI]

Well that’s it, Kwiat was a World Champ and Amstel winner, Paris Nice and LBL podium, before going to Sky.

Now, no doubt his wallet is fatter than it would ever have got staying with Lefevere, and his MSR win was a beaut, but there’s a GT stage-win shaped hole in his palmares, that any other team in the sport would no doubt have worked a lot harder for him to fill long before now.

Maybe he see himself being an athlete that is not that perfect, for a gt contender role. Being realistic that is. Being super dom in top tier team opens him resources to be top contender outside gt races. Sound decent, maybe even chosen plan.

 

[Tonton]

Maybe he see himself being an athlete that is not that perfect, for a gt contender role. Being realistic that is. Being super dom in top tier team opens him resources to be top contender outside gt races. Sound decent, maybe even chosen plan.

Hell no! Tibopino can put it together and win big, super dom is giving away your dreams. Last year showed that he can win a GT. Maybe not the Tour...but let's not overreact, gloom and doom after this.

But I want him to do LBL, AGR. Thibaut Pinot can win these bike races...

 

[movingtarget]

Hell no! Tibopino can put it together and win big, super dom is giving away your dreams. Last year showed that he can win a GT. Maybe not the Tour...but let's not overreact, gloom and doom after this.

But I want him to do LBL, AGR. Thibaut Pinot can win these bike races...

No reason he can't do what he did a few seasons ago and win stages of the Vuelta and and a classic. Just needs some recovery time for his injury. I thought he made a mistake attacking yesterday. Yes it was nice to see but maybe a little unrealistic and didn't help his chances of staying in the race. Gaudu showed how to do it and he looked in even greater pain than Pinot.

 

[red_flanders]

Hell no! Tibopino can put it together and win big, super dom is giving away your dreams. Last year showed that he can win a GT. Maybe not the Tour...but let's not overreact, gloom and doom after this.

But I want him to do LBL, AGR. Thibaut Pinot can win these bike races...

I was rooting for him but I don’t think dismissing him is an overreaction at this point...his performances have been pretty...odd...at least not confidence-inspiring. Agreed on the one day races.

 

[Leinster]

I just checked his past results on PCS. Has Tibopino genuinely never done the Ardennes? Like, not even a Flèche here or there? It seems like an odd omission for a rider of his characteristics.

 

[IndianCyclist]

Hell no! Tibopino can put it together and win big, super dom is giving away your dreams. Last year showed that he can win a GT. Maybe not the Tour...but let's not overreact, gloom and doom after this.

But I want him to do LBL, AGR. Thibaut Pinot can win these bike races...

Yes it is easier to be perfect for a day than for 3 weeks. His won record shows that. He is a monument winne but he has not won a mjor week long race. But somebody has to tell it to him. He has way too much heart. If he tries too hard, gets tired and fatigued, the next goals will be compromised for this season with this " season" being so short( within 2 months everything 3 GTs, 3 monuments is over). if he chooses perfectly he may win another monument and GT in this year.

 

[Red Rick]

Problem is the Italian fall classics are the only classics that really suit him. It's a bit of a sad state in cycling IMO that great climbers literally have nothing but GTs to aim for

 

[Leinster]

I’ve seen no evidence that Liege “wouldn’t suit” Pinot. If anything, his record at Lombardia makes me think he should definitely try the Ardennes. If Fuglsang, Poels, Martin can all win there, he can.

 

[75Driver]

Saw where PeeNo is in the twenty something club. 24th place, 28 minutes back.