Tour de France 2015 Stage 17: Digne-les-Bains-Pra Loup 161km

[Eyeballs Out]

Re: Re:

Quintana only attacked 100m from the finish

Riis' analysis, not mine. I'm aware (and Riis too, I'm, sure) that Quintana attacked from the start of the stage - even before we got TV pictures. But tactically Movistar didn't do much for the GC win. The right thing to do would to let either Valverde or Quintana go with Alberto and let Froome chase them down. Not just chas Alberto down. That was Riis' point.

Riis was also critical of Tinkoff's tactics though, as Flor pointed out earlier. Firstly, Alberto shouldn't attack so far out and having to do all the work by himself (Rogers didn't last long when Contador attacked on the 3rd climb from the finish). Secondly, Majka should have waited for Alberto after Alberto's crash.

Yeah I don't disagree with the criticism of Movistar but it's best for him to stick to the facts, otherwise it looks like he's not watching the race. If anything Quintana was too aggressive (4 attacks before the sprint). He needs to be more selective and go harder when he does go especially on a stage which isn't really that difficult

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

Rain predicted for next three days apparently. Another thing against Froome and favouring... Nibali, Quintana and Valverde?

Froome's form on this tour gives no reason to suspect him of handling weaknesses

No, I didn't mean that, just that Froome is at his best in the heat as we already saw in this year and in 2013. Whereas we know Quintana dislikes heat.

 

[dacooley]

in this tour froome shows up himself as a very schoolable rider. tactics, bike-handling, puncheur finishes, cobbles - all the qualities that supposedly had to weaken his tour perspectives, but we see the opposite. if a rider wanna improve, he rises above himself

 

[bala v]

Re: Re:

Nothing can be done in this Tour. The cyclist that is 2 levels above everyone else wins. As simple as that

Of course something can be done. It might be very very hard and very unlikely to succeed but nothing is impossible. Well it is only impossible if you dont try. Am so sick of strong teams (and most often Movistar) riding for secondary gc placements.

can you give an example of what can be done against a rider that is way better than all other contenders and has a strong team?

Isolate him (or close to) early in the stage. Just as they did some years back when the had him on isolated early. Like today have riders out front and then attack on and on early on and only let SKY and Froome close gaps, even if other rivals attacks. NEver ever do SKY's Work for them regardless of risking losing 3rd place. That Means a lot of teams would pin point their attacks agsint Sky and not eachother. If they went really hard on the first climbs all Froome would have left, if any, would be Thomas.

Today they should have let Berto go and let Sky deal with it and then counter a but later (but not to late)

Being ready to risk it all is key. It might very well not succeed. But maybe, just maybe, it will and you win big and become a legend. Cycling needs more riders with those kind of balls.

If you isolate a rider and then just take it in turns one after the other to attack, eventually one of them will get away. Froome is riding an incredible race, but he can't close down 20 different attacks. He can easily close down 3 though. Plus if you don't try to win the race, you won't win the race.

Just like in a video game, right?! 20 attacks, give me a brake !!!

 

[Sky'sthelimit]

Re:

Rain predicted for next three days apparently. Another thing against Froome and favouring... Nibali, Quintana and Valverde?

Would have thought it would be a leveller, curtailing and forcing teams to ride conservatively. The margins for error in this case are greater, making risk taking a lot less likely.

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

Rain predicted for next three days apparently. Another thing against Froome and favouring... Nibali, Quintana and Valverde?

Would have thought it would be a leveller, curtailing and forcing teams to ride conservatively. The margins for error in this case are greater, making risk taking a lot less likely.

20km descent tomorrow

 

[Poursuivant]

Re: Re:

I don't understand why Roche and Majka never sat up to help their leaders...

Why would Roche, Froome was fine.

What if had a pncture etc?

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

I don't understand why Roche and Majka never sat up to help their leaders...

Why would Roche, Froome was fine.

What if had a pncture etc?

Yeah very odd from Roche. What good was a 7th place?

 

[jaylew]

Damn, I had to go in to work and missed the last two climbs and the podium places are virtually decided. Sad for AC but I'm stoked that it looks like Valverde is going to get a podium.

I've never really been a big G fan but I think I'm becoming one. It's hard not to appreciate a rider who's as versatile as he is. It's really cool to see a rider who won E3 just off the podium at the Tour. What a nice year:

Tdf: (4th-7th, likely 5th)
Tour de Suisse: 2nd
Gent- Wevelgem: 3rd
E3: 1st
Paris-Nice: 5th
Volta Algarve: 1st

This is what Kwia wishes his year had been like (not that he's had a bad year).

 

[bassano]

Re: Re:

But the Giro has weaker fields. Only one of the big four at the Giro, but how many at the Vuelta? Maybe two plus a lot of others the Giro didn't have like Valverde, JRod, etc.

Yeah, but in which condicion arrived riders to Vuelta, ridiculous in compare to top that is a main difference, how they are aproach to Giro or Vuelta

 

[Escarabajo]

Re: Re:

Bjarne Riis' analysis on Danish TV: 'Movistar are handing the win to Froome. Movistar had 3 riders up front but still used Valverde to chase down Contador. And Quintana only attcked Froome 100 m from the finish. Movistar are not riding for the win' (not an exact quote, but the essence of what he said).

I guess Riis is still biased but that's how I see it too.

He also criticized Tinkoff's tactics fwiw

Of course he did. Not that he was objective!!

Uh, it was actually quite objective the way he did it. But please tell me what you found unreasonable about his criticism?

I am talking about the Saxo part not the Movistar.

 

[Escarabajo]

Re: Re:

Just like in a video game, right?! 20 attacks, give me a brake !!!

+1.

People think this is a video game.

 

[bassano]

Re: Tour de France 2015 Stage 17: Digne-les-Bains-Pra Loup 1

Yeah I'm sure Sergey Honchar was really going to smash LA.

Like froome would be smashed on Giro, conditions (weather, rain) are really different from this year Tour (hot, dry easy and predictable) they both with LA are loosers comparing to Contador or Nibali

 

[Escarabajo]

Re: Re:

Quintana only attacked 100m from the finish

Riis' analysis, not mine. I'm aware (and Riis too, I'm, sure) that Quintana attacked from the start of the stage - even before we got TV pictures. But tactically Movistar didn't do much for the GC win. The right thing to do would to let either Valverde or Quintana go with Alberto and let Froome chase them down. Not just chas Alberto down. That was Riis' point.

Riis was also critical of Tinkoff's tactics though, as Flor pointed out earlier. Firstly, Alberto shouldn't attack so far out and having to do all the work by himself (Rogers didn't last long when Contador attacked on the 3rd climb from the finish). Secondly, Majka should have waited for Alberto after Alberto's crash.

Yeah I don't disagree with the criticism of Movistar but it's best for him to stick to the facts, otherwise it looks like he's not watching the race. If anything Quintana was too aggressive (4 attacks before the sprint). He needs to be more selective and go harder when he does go especially on a stage which isn't really that difficult

Quintana is not as strong as we think he is. that is the problem.

And Angliru is wrong about letting Valverde or Quintana go because Sky or Froome is not going to let him get away very far if a few meters. They'll Valverde go but not Quintana.

 

[TMP402]

Re:

Damn, I had to go in to work and missed the last two climbs and the podium places are virtually decided. Sad for AC but I'm stoked that it looks like Valverde is going to get a podium.

I've never really been a big G fan but I think I'm becoming one. It's hard not to appreciate a rider who's as versatile as he is. It's really cool to see a rider who won E3 just off the podium at the Tour. What a nice year:

Tdf: (4th-7th, likely 5th)
Tour de Suisse: 2nd
Gent- Wevelgem: 3rd
E3: 1st
Paris-Nice: 5th
Volta Algarve: 1st

This is what Kwia wishes his year had been like (not that he's had a bad year).

Talking of reversing Kwia, Thomas has to be at least a * favourite for the WC this year.

 

[rzombie1988]

Re: Re:

Lots of pessimism but still three days left with more mountains to isolate Froome.

I am afraid it will never happen. Only Movistar may still be in position to contest the win to Froome now, and their behaviour today showed they do not plan to do that.

It's impossible to see them managing to crack Froome right now when they haven't made a ding nor tried to make a ding in the last three weeks. Froome is the only one trying to win. The others are trying not to lose their podium places. Thomas being up there and Porte doing good are not helping the cause.

 

[Escarabajo]

Cimber, Froome won't follow all attacks. maybe Quintana only. So taking turns to attack him is worthless because he won't follow all of them. Besides he is stronger than the guys that are attacking him.

The parcours for the Tours should not be that much backloaded.

 

[Kwibus]

Well Froome certainly proofed all the "he can't handle his bike" people wrong this TdF.

Also Sky tactically once again solid and Froome as well. Back in the days they did silly stuff, but this year they seem to have worked it out.

Grats Geschke.

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Movistar went full *** today

First Valverde just sits on Contadors wheel, when he went across to him on the cat. 2, instead of going away with him - and then they sit 4 Movistar against Froome on his own, and pull him up the final climb.

They are most definitely not riding for the win anymore - cowards.

Not that Tinkoff did any better, with first Rodgers letting himself fall behind after Contadors crash, and Majka not waiting for his captain.

Sky is going to breeze to the win in Paris.

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Is Majka leaving the team?

This seems odd:

https://twitter.com/reneemeijer02/status/623877032611594240

 

[ILovecycling]

Re: Tour de France 2015 Stage 17: Digne-les-Bains-Pra Loup 1

one word after cooling down 3 hours...Disgusted.

by Majka
by Unzue
by Valverde
by Quintana

only joy is a Geschke win.


Awesome ride by Froome on the descent and tactically (ok it was against Movi )

 

[Kwibus]

http://nos.nl/tour/video/2048387-nos-camera-ziet-contador-opkrabbelen.html

Camera almost catches contador crash. Not much can be concluded from it.

 

[gazr99]

Pity this didn't come out in time to help Pinot

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eytp-kWBw-M

 

[May0maniac]

Re:

Who would win on a descent race featuring Pinot v Wiggins?

With rain both would probably beat Geniez

 

[huge]

Nibali said he wasn't pushing too much on the descent. The road was very bumpy and there was no point to take extra risks.
He added he was not surprised that Froome managed to keep his wheel. Easy to follow someone else lines...

...and I add that Froome is definitely proving himself a better bike handler than many of us thought.