Tour de France 2017 stage 4: Mondorf-les-Bains-Vittel 207 km

[GuyIncognito]

Re:

Laura Meseguer
@Laura_Meseguer
Sergeant, Lotto: "Greipel is pissed by the attitude of Sagan...He has just told me: 'Sagan is not my friend anymore'

What the hell is this? ''Not my friend anymore''.

I can't bear the cringe.

He's referring to yesterday.
It wasn't widely reported because Greipel managed to stay up, but Greipel claims Sagan elbowed him

 

[perico]

Re:

Laura Meseguer
@Laura_Meseguer
Sergeant, Lotto: "Greipel is pissed by the attitude of Sagan...He has just told me: 'Sagan is not my friend anymore'

What the hell is this? ''Not my friend anymore''.

I can't bear the cringe.

What a dork.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Cavendish is from this era, and everyone's been putting up with his crap on the road. Nothing happens to him.

2013 was just 4 years ago. This has double standards written all over it.

This was a kneejerk decision from the commissaires. Bloody virtue signaling. As rhub said, shot themselves on the foot.

Got to agree with this. Worse has happened, but in this quite debatable case, the jury decides to make a statement.

I guess the argument is that Cavendish should really have been DQd in the past for some his actions. Just because he wasn't doesn't mean that you have to stick with that precedent forever.

With so many trains and GC riders all buzzing around at the end (plus a strange fascination in recent GTs for unnecessarily technical finales) I think a clamping down on changing lines and contact in sprints is long overdue.

 

[loge1884]

Re: Re:

Cillian Kelly‏ @irishpeloton 30s31 seconds ago
More
Djamolidin Abdoujaparov was never disqualified from the Tour de France

This!

He should have been though. And undoubtedly would have been in this era, with a supposedly greater focus on rider safety.

Rider safety would be no sprints. The two don't go together. Sorry.

THIS ....

 

[MartinGT]

Re: Re:

What happend to Kittel BTW? Was he taken down in the first crash?

.@marcelkittel didn't crash, but couldn't contest the sprint as he was slowed down by the first crash. #TDF2017

Thanks.

 

[arvc40]

Re:

Laura Meseguer
@Laura_Meseguer
Sergeant, Lotto: "Greipel is pissed by the attitude of Sagan...He has just told me: 'Sagan is not my friend anymore'

What the hell is this? ''Not my friend anymore''.

I can't bear the cringe.

I know mate !, But Greipel is an Angel.

 

[jonovision_man]

Re: Re:

A disqualification is against the UCI's own rules...

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/68/12-DIS-20170701-E_English.pdf

10.1.Deviating from selected lane, endangering
other riders
1st offence: relegation to the last place in his group, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 30’’ in general class.
2nd offence: relegation to last place in the stage, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 1’ in general class.
3rd offence: elimination + 200

This post deserves attention.

So, for yesterday's elbow he should've lost the stage win plus points and 30 secs on GC. For today's elbow he should lose 2nd in the stage, more pts and another minute on GC.

It shouldn't be a DQ until the 3rd time.

Deviating from a lane and elbowing someone in the head are two different offences.

jono

 

[Irondan]

Daniel Benson‏ @dnlbenson 1m1 minute ago
More
Dimension Data are preparing as if Cavendish starts tomorrow but member of the management is still unclear if sprinter will race.

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Robbie McEwen‏Verified account @mcewenrobbie 6m6 minutes ago
More
I agree with the expulsion of @petosagan from @LeTour. The DQ yes, but kicked off the Tour!?! NO.

That makes no sense.

Clearly he is saying that the expulsion is the right thing to do, but getting kicked off is completely wrong.

Aye, to me Expulsion is to be kicked off the Tour.

Yeah it is, I was making a joke about it

 

[animir]

another slow motion,
sorry, now is the link correct
https://disq.us/url?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstreamable.com%2Fj7gqb%3AHAMHfNly-APz_hM2ZzMrn23YvTw&cuid=3823454

 

[Irondan]

Neal Rogers‏Verified account @nealrogers 31s32 seconds ago
More
Periodic reminder: Race organization, in this case ASO, does not make decision on things like DQ, that’s always up to UCI race jury #TDF2017

 

[GuyIncognito]

Re: Re:

Has there ever been a race thread with a higher ratio of post-race to during-race commentary than this one?

Not that I can remember, but the Tour has a lot of history here in the Forum so there could be other times too.

Levi vs Cunego maybe?

 

[MatParker117]

"We applied article 12.104, irregular sprints, in which case commissaires are allowed to enforce a judgement to disqualify a rider and amend a fine."

 

[Lance Armstrong]

Re: Re:

A disqualification is against the UCI's own rules...

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/68/12-DIS-20170701-E_English.pdf

10.1.Deviating from selected lane, endangering
other riders
1st offence: relegation to the last place in his group, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 30’’ in general class.
2nd offence: relegation to last place in the stage, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 1’ in general class.
3rd offence: elimination + 200

This post deserves attention.

So, for yesterday's elbow he should've lost the stage win plus points and 30 secs on GC. For today's elbow he should lose 2nd in the stage, more pts and another minute on GC.

It shouldn't be a DQ until the 3rd time.

Deviating from a lane and elbowing someone in the head are two different offences.

jono

Sorry but there was no elbow to the head. Cav bumped into Sagan and lost his balance. He was already going down when Sagan "elbowed" him: https://mobile.twitter.com/TheLegendMito21/status/882269127708221440/video/1

 

[GenericBoonenFan]

If they're gonna DQ Renshaw for headbutting they might aswell kick out Sagan for that!

 

[Irondan]

Re: Re:

Has there ever been a race thread with a higher ratio of post-race to during-race commentary than this one?

Not that I can remember, but the Tour has a lot of history here in the Forum so there could be other times too.

Levi vs Cunego maybe?

Or Froome's windmill ride up the Mont Ventoux.

 

[deValtos]

Re: Re:

Has there ever been a race thread with a higher ratio of post-race to during-race commentary than this one?

Not that I can remember, but the Tour has a lot of history here in the Forum so there could be other times too.

Levi vs Cunego maybe?

Wasn't that the Tour de Suisse even which made that even more impressive. :lol:

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Maybe there is something more to the first crash as well involving Sagan.

There is a video of it, Sagan could be the reason. Not clear cut but it looks like he is going for a small gap between two riders and both of them goes down and causing the crash. Look a couple of pages back.

The way I saw the first crash it wasn't Sagan's fault. The FdJ rider, whoever it was bumped into Sagan from the left and just bounced off him causing the crash. Had Sagan moved a little to the right, maybe the crash would've been avoided, but can't blame him for holding his line there.

I agree. The fdj rider was going quite a bit slower than everyone around him and Sagan was already in place when he bumped into him. Of course he could've held off his movement by five or ten seconds and it would've been avoided but you can't expect the guy in front of you to slow down.

Edit, not blaming the fdj guy at all as he was forced into Sagan. Just unlucky

 

[Carols]

Re: Re:

Has there ever been a race thread with a higher ratio of post-race to during-race commentary than this one?

Not that I can remember, but the Tour has a lot of history here in the Forum so there could be other times too.

Levi vs Cunego maybe?

LRP getting a wheel from Gerrans. It went on for weeks.....

 

[Irondan]

Re: Re:

Has there ever been a race thread with a higher ratio of post-race to during-race commentary than this one?

Not that I can remember, but the Tour has a lot of history here in the Forum so there could be other times too.

Levi vs Cunego maybe?

LRP getting a wheel from Gerrans. It went on for weeks.....

He he, who could forget that gem...

 

[jonovision_man]

Re: Re:

A disqualification is against the UCI's own rules...

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/68/12-DIS-20170701-E_English.pdf

10.1.Deviating from selected lane, endangering
other riders
1st offence: relegation to the last place in his group, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 30’’ in general class.
2nd offence: relegation to last place in the stage, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 1’ in general class.
3rd offence: elimination + 200

This post deserves attention.

So, for yesterday's elbow he should've lost the stage win plus points and 30 secs on GC. For today's elbow he should lose 2nd in the stage, more pts and another minute on GC.

It shouldn't be a DQ until the 3rd time.

Deviating from a lane and elbowing someone in the head are two different offences.

jono

Sorry but there was no elbow to the head. Cav bumped into Sagan and lost his balance. He was already going down when Sagan "elbowed" him: https://mobile.twitter.com/TheLegendMito21/status/882269127708221440/video/1

Shoulder, elbow, upper arm, whatever. He shoved Cav into the barrier using his upper body. This isn't hockey.

jono

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Has there ever been a race thread with a higher ratio of post-race to during-race commentary than this one?

Not that I can remember, but the Tour has a lot of history here in the Forum so there could be other times too.

Levi vs Cunego maybe?

LRP getting a wheel from Gerrans. It went on for weeks.....

Thought it was Clarke?

 

[luckyboy]

Re:

A disqualification is against the UCI's own rules...

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/68/12-DIS-20170701-E_English.pdf

10.1.Deviating from selected lane, endangering
other riders
1st offence: relegation to the last place in his group, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 30’’ in general class.
2nd offence: relegation to last place in the stage, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 1’ in general class.
3rd offence: elimination + 200

Only other thing this can be is:

30. Acts of violence
30.1.Among riders:
200 per offence + 1’ penalty per offence in stage races
Elimination for particularly serious aggression


But the commissaire said in the video that the exclusion is because Sagan 'endangered his colleagues seriously in the final sprint', which sounds a lot like the first regulation I posted, and it the 1st offence penalty matches what we already saw happened.

So either this is a 'particularly serious aggression' (lol) or they just bypassed the first regulation's '3rd offence' rule.

 

[PeterB]

Re:

"We applied article 12.104, irregular sprints, in which case commissaires are allowed to enforce a judgement to disqualify a rider and amend a fine."

Which says this:

Moreover, the Commissaires Panel may, in particularly serious cases, eliminate and fine a rider with 200 on the first offence

So they perceived this as a "particularly serious case". It is arguably not further defined, what constitutes particular seriousness of the case.

 

[DFA123]

So the Tour de France, with one of the crappest routes you will ever see, has now lost the two most talented riders on the startlist, within four stages.

What a race!