Tour de France 2017 stage 4: Mondorf-les-Bains-Vittel 207 km

[Supimilian]

Re: Re:

Gotta agree with the disqualification.

That really wasn't Sagan's fault

Highly debatable.

 

[rehy90]

Re:

It's a tough decision and they've now set a precedent for clamping down.

Unfortunately you can review the incident a million times but when you see an elbow come out and a rider crash into the barriers with the world watching, they felt they had to make a call.

the elbow has no connection with this crash. It was the outcome of the crash, not the reason of it. The more I watch the video, the more assured I am that Sagan should have not been relegated at all. It was the sprinting accident. You cant just watch the two riders, you have to watch the situation as a whole. And they were all moving to the right. Sagan and Mark were just following the fastest guy.

 

[Irondan]

Re: Re:

Cillian Kelly‏ @irishpeloton 30s31 seconds ago
More
Djamolidin Abdoujaparov was never disqualified from the Tour de France

This!

He should have been though. And undoubtedly would have been in this era, with a supposedly greater focus on rider safety.

But can we really compare Sagan with a "Homicidal Sprinter" in the first place?

The Tour never acted back then and they overreact now.

 

[Hayabusa]

Disagree with the DQ but he deserved to be punished. Shocked people are blaming Cavendish in this...

 

[Pricey_sky]

Re: Re:

It's a tough decision and they've now set a precedent for clamping down.

Unfortunately you can review the incident a million times but when you see an elbow come out and a rider crash into the barriers with the world watching, they felt they had to make a call.

the elbow has no connection with this crash. It was the outcome of the crash, not the reason of it. The more I watch the video, the more assured I am that Sagan should have not been relegated at all. It was the sprinting accident. You cant just watch the two riders, you have to watch the situation as a whole. And they were all moving to the right. Sagan and Mark were just following the fastest guy.

In my opinion without the elbow Cav probably stays upright. So it was the last factor. Albeit amongst a host of others factors I admit.

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Gotta agree with the disqualification.

That really wasn't Sagan's fault

Highly debatable.

I was talking about the first crash, which was quoted initially but edited out - in that one it seemed to me the fdj rider just slowed and backed into Sagan and he wasn't really able to move left or right because of other riders around him. It was just unfortunate.

 

[GuyIncognito]

Personally I feel about Sagan the way a lot of people felt about Renshaw in 2010. He kept pulling stunts and getting away with it to the point where I am genuinely shocked they did anything, as it seemed he could do whatever he wanted and never get punished.

Gotta agree with the disqualification.

That really wasn't Sagan's fault

Highly debatable.

I was talking about the first crash, which was quoted initially but edited out - in that one it seemed to me the fdj rider just slowed and backed into Sagan and he wasn't really able to move left or right because of other riders around him. It was just unfortunate.

Edited out because it was the wrong video link. The first crash is probably Kristoff's fault, leaves the FDJ guy with nowhere to go.

 

[BigMac]

Re:

A disqualification is against the UCI's own rules...

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/68/12-DIS-20170701-E_English.pdf

10.1.Deviating from selected lane, endangering
other riders
1st offence: relegation to the last place in his group, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 30’’ in general class.
2nd offence: relegation to last place in the stage, point
classification penalty equal to the points awarded to the first
place of the stage, 200 + 1’ in general class.
3rd offence: elimination + 200

This post deserves attention.

 

[Jungle Cycle]

Sagan punished to show what wont be allowed.. so now we are left with a infuriated Bouhanni for the sprints...

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

So it's good to see for once they have backed up their words, by setting an important precedent, even at some probable cost to their organisation and biggest race.

Who profits from this decision? A Frenchman. Must be a coincidence.

I think it is a coincidence. Demare may well not win the green jersey anyway, and it's not exactly a major prize. I think the UCI and ASO will be a lot more bothered about the sponsors, host towns and TV companies knocking on their door questioning why a star rider has been excluded. It's definitely a brave decision, similar to throwing Nibali out of the vuelta a few years ago and one that, for me at least, restores a tiny bit of faith in the UCI.

 

[Irondan]

Robbie McEwen‏Verified account @mcewenrobbie 6m6 minutes ago
More
I agree with the expulsion of @petosagan from @LeTour. The DQ yes, but kicked off the Tour!?! NO.

 

[Tonton]

Re: Re:

Cillian Kelly‏ @irishpeloton 30s31 seconds ago
More
Djamolidin Abdoujaparov was never disqualified from the Tour de France

This!

He should have been though. And undoubtedly would have been in this era, with a supposedly greater focus on rider safety.

Rider safety would be no sprints. The two don't go together. Sorry.

 

[asdfgh101]

Re: Tour de France 2017 stage 4: Mondorf-les-Bains-Vittel 20

I thought the original punishment was along the right lines but should have been more severe such that a Green Jersey win (-200pts) or taking the Yellow Jersey (-2 minutes) were more or less completely out of the window.

 

[Supimilian]

Re: Re:

Gotta agree with the disqualification.

That really wasn't Sagan's fault

Highly debatable.

I was talking about the first crash, which was quoted initially but edited out - in that one it seemed to me the fdj rider just slowed and backed into Sagan and he wasn't really able to move left or right because of other riders around him. It was just unfortunate.

As was I. He presses too much.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Cillian Kelly‏ @irishpeloton 30s31 seconds ago
More
Djamolidin Abdoujaparov was never disqualified from the Tour de France

This!

He should have been though. And undoubtedly would have been in this era, with a supposedly greater focus on rider safety.

But can we really compare Sagan with a "Homicidal Sprinter" in the first place?

The Tour never acted back then and they overreact now.

You're quite possibly right. But I would encourage them to be more onthe side of 'over-reacting' than doing nothing and letting the inevitable happen, when it comes to issues of rider safety.

 

[Irondan]

Re: Re:

Cillian Kelly‏ @irishpeloton 30s31 seconds ago
More
Djamolidin Abdoujaparov was never disqualified from the Tour de France

This!

He should have been though. And undoubtedly would have been in this era, with a supposedly greater focus on rider safety.

Rider safety would be no sprints. The two don't go together. Sorry.

Exactly...

Sprinting is inherently dangerous.

 

[Brullnux]

Re:

Personally I feel about Sagan the way a lot of people felt about Renshaw in 2010. He kept pulling stunts and getting away with it to the point where I am genuinely shocked they did anything, as it seemed he could do whatever he wanted and never get punished.

Gotta agree with the disqualification.

That really wasn't Sagan's fault

Highly debatable.

I was talking about the first crash, which was quoted initially but edited out - in that one it seemed to me the fdj rider just slowed and backed into Sagan and he wasn't really able to move left or right because of other riders around him. It was just unfortunate.

Edited out because it was the wrong video link. The first crash is probably Kristoff's fault, leaves the FDJ guy with nowhere to go.

Understood, I think it's just a regular accident and just unfortunate.

 

[loge1884]

the decision is ridiculous ... anyway, it's a loss for Peter Sagan, Bora .... and the TdF ....

 

[Irondan]

Re: Re:

Cillian Kelly‏ @irishpeloton 30s31 seconds ago
More
Djamolidin Abdoujaparov was never disqualified from the Tour de France

This!

He should have been though. And undoubtedly would have been in this era, with a supposedly greater focus on rider safety.

But can we really compare Sagan with a "Homicidal Sprinter" in the first place?

The Tour never acted back then and they overreact now.

You're quite possibly right. But I would encourage them to be more onthe side of 'over-reacting' than doing nothing and letting the inevitable happen, when it comes to issues of rider safety.

I agree that Sagan earned a relegation, loss of points and a time loss. But to change their minds and toss him from the Tour is beyond hysterical.

 

[BigMac]

Re: Re:

Cillian Kelly‏ @irishpeloton 30s31 seconds ago
More
Djamolidin Abdoujaparov was never disqualified from the Tour de France

This!

He should have been though. And undoubtedly would have been in this era, with a supposedly greater focus on rider safety.

Cavendish is from this era, and everyone's been putting up with his crap on the road. Nothing happens to him.

2013 was just 4 years ago. This has double standards written all over it.

This was a kneejerk decision from the commissaires. Bloody virtue signaling. As rhub said, shot themselves on the foot.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Cillian Kelly‏ @irishpeloton 30s31 seconds ago
More
Djamolidin Abdoujaparov was never disqualified from the Tour de France

This!

He should have been though. And undoubtedly would have been in this era, with a supposedly greater focus on rider safety.

Rider safety would be no sprints. The two don't go together. Sorry.

Sure, that's the extreme option. But there has to be some middle ground and some rules - it can't just be a free for all. If the commisaires deemed it to be a deliberate, or at least negligently careless elbow, then it surely has to result in a DQ. If they deemed it as a racing incident that couldn't be avoided, then no action. Rightly or wrongly, they decided it was the former, so I guess the punishment is inevitable then.

 

[mr. tibbs]

Re: Re:

Too harsh.
If they throw out Sagan then Demare should at least lose his stage placing for how he cut in front of Bouhanni and others, but that will never happen.

Yep. Or Sagan when he cut across Dan Martin yesterday. But refereeing, particularly in the age of twitter, is all about overreacting once things happen, not preventing them.

Post of the day.

 

[hfer07]

Re: Tour de France 2017 stage 4: Mondorf-les-Bains-Vittel 20

What the fvck man!!!

.....Sagan expulsion is just the latest reason not to watch Le Tour at all

 

[MartinGT]

Re:

Robbie McEwen‏Verified account @mcewenrobbie 6m6 minutes ago
More
I agree with the expulsion of @petosagan from @LeTour. The DQ yes, but kicked off the Tour!?! NO.

That makes no sense.

 

[perico]

Maybe there is something more to the first crash as well involving Sagan.