Tour de France Tour de France 2021, Stage 3: Lorient - Pontivy, 183.9 km

[Carrick-On-Seine]

I think the problem is the tour itself, it has got so much attention and anyone who gets yellow or win a stage is a hero in his country. Also, in history there were always road captains/bosses in the peloton, who calmed things down when it got wild, but now, there is less respect from young riders (not always a bad thing). So many riders taking unnecessary risk to win a stage/get yellow. It would definitely help to include prologue every year, so the yellow jersey would be out of reach for most after stage 1.

There's also a few guys who can go for GC that have good form in recent classics (Pog, Roglic and Ala) so the other GC teams who are not so used to little northern roads are pretty stressed because they know there's potential to lose a heap of time on such stages.

 

[Red Rick]

roglic didnt lose that much time, last year pogacar lost time early as well, there is still time to make up...but yeah Kelderman will win this tour

Pogacar didn't do a 3 round wrestling match with French asphalt.

 

[zlev11]

funny how I got jumped on for saying Roglic was "bodychecked" and then Roglic goes and uses the same exact words.

it was pretty clear from the replay shown on TV (NBC showed it about 4 times so maybe that was why it was so clear to me), there was not much to decipher from that. Cobrelli moves over and then Roglic goes flying off the side of the road.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1409570188786286596

View: https://twitter.com/laflammerouge16/status/1409570188786286596?s=20

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Sounds like a dreadfully qualified apology full of excuses for taking a Top Contender basically out of the race .

But you have no idea it was on purpose.

You have no idea if Colbrelli was pushed himself, and it was a chain reaction.

Let's accept that we do not know all the facts yet.

 

[zlev11]

that said I don't think you can tell intent, I don't want to see Colbrelli penalized beyond a time and/or points penalty

 

[Broccolidwarf]

funny how I got jumped on for saying Roglic was "bodychecked" and then Roglic goes and uses the same exact words.

it was pretty clear from the replay shown on TV (NBC showed it about 4 times so maybe that was why it was so clear to me), there was not much to decipher from that. Cobrelli moves over and then Roglic goes flying off the side of the road.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1409570188786286596

View: https://twitter.com/laflammerouge16/status/1409570188786286596?s=20

I think most assumed that the word "bodycheck" implies intent

Looking at your video, you see a rider in a white helmet, to Colbrelli's right, move left (right on-screen) at the same time, and further you cannot see what goes on to HIS right.

Without a heli shot, it is impossible to assign blame.

 

[jmdirt]

Should UCI mandate collar bone protectors?

could you provide a link for them?

 

[Volderke]

Would you kindly share a link to this video?

It's the Sporza video, on Sporza (possibly geo-restricted).

Anyway, this is Colbrelli's take, which makes sense: movements in the peloton, Colbrelli to the left, Roglic from behind, contact between the two of them almost entangling, Roglic crashing unfortunately.
To claim Colbrelli did a bodycheck (intentionally or not) is more than a few bridges too far.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1409585186254163971

View: https://twitter.com/BHRVictorious/status/1409585186254163971?s=20

https://twitter.com/x/status/1409585188191936532

View: https://twitter.com/BHRVictorious/status/1409585188191936532?s=20

https://twitter.com/x/status/1409585190398140456

View: https://twitter.com/BHRVictorious/status/1409585190398140456?s=20

 

[Carols]

funny how I got jumped on for saying Roglic was "bodychecked" and then Roglic goes and uses the same exact words.

it was pretty clear from the replay shown on TV (NBC showed it about 4 times so maybe that was why it was so clear to me), there was not much to decipher from that. Cobrelli moves over and then Roglic goes flying off the side of the road.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1409570188786286596

View: https://twitter.com/laflammerouge16/status/1409570188786286596?s=20

Yeah that is what I saw also! It's hard to see but if you watch it a few times you can see Cobrelli's helmet move pretty far left and Roglic go flying off the road. Followed by Colbrelli's nasty gesture at him

 

[Extinction]

But it will always be a question balance.

Sure, at one extreme, you could ride an entire stage on the same motorway - or for that matter on a F1 track - from end to end, but it would be incredibly boring (and incredibly hard for spectators to get to, if it's the motorway example).

On the other hand, the more warrying terrain, of warrying quality, you use, the more dangerous the race becomes, but also the more exiting to watch.

I don't think a (wide) 2-lane road is particularly abnormal in cycling, nor particularly dangerous.

It's just that the pressure is so much higher in the Tour, that every riders tries a little too hard.

I agree, it's just that in contemporary pro cycling the speeds and performance pressure has become stratospheric and thus a certain course design is necessary to avoid the worst calamities, which doesn't need to be a Forumla-1 racetrack. Like you said it's finding the delicate balance, which, on the evidence, the Tour organizers have failed to achieve.

 

[zlev11]

Yeah that is what I saw also! It's hard to see but if you watch it a few times you can see Cobrelli's helmet move pretty far left and Roglic go flying off the road. Followed by Colbrelli's nasty gesture at him

i mean it's not even that hard to see. there is one guy moving left until another guy exits stage left, lol.

 

[railxmig]

agreed.

i was always thinking he might top five, but concerned about the amount of time he will ship in the ITTs.

however, a few favorites have dropped or are dropping and he appears to have improved his TT a bit (according to dauphine).

a clear ride might get him into the top five.

With recent development i believe Pogacar has it IN DA BAG unless Roglic is capable of destroying him in TT, which i find doubtful (especially after the crash). For now i doubt Carapaz (which in theory should be the closest to Pogacar) can hold on to the Slovenian. On paper it should be easier for Pog to control the situation and if Rog is still in his proper shape then he will be attacking rather than dating with Pog, giving way less chance of a Carapaz-like upset (and i like upsets).

I was also going to write an essay on changing the run-in to nearby D764 road which is much wider and on paper safer but it would collide with the finishing "straight". Maybe D2 road was a bit safer? it's still a bit wavy and a bit downhill and it would include a passage through a village (Le Sourn). I mean that's Bretagne for you and i still believe it's maybe just as questionable as the start of stage 1, which should be a couple of kms later, after passing through technically challinging passage through Plougastel-Daoulas.

 

[bajbar]

The whole problem is that every team wants to be in the front. When you got 180 riders wanting to be in top 20 positions, people will crash because that is not physically possible. The attitude of riders in the bunch is crazy. Pushing and shoving in the last 60km!!! I am surprised anyone manages to finish at all. Some say that crashes are part of the sport... sory, this today (and Saturday) is not sport for me. Sport is people training hard and competing with eachother to see who is the best. Hoping that you will finish each stage without a career threatening injury and feeling relieved, that you only finished with a bruised knee is NOT a part of sport. And those in charge should do something to make it safer - search for the problems and solve them. Sock length and super tuck were not problems. The way riders are afraid to lose every second IS.

People wonder why there is not nearly the same amount of money in cycling that is in football, basketball or tennis... I say watch todays stage. Which big company would be dumb enough to pay large amounts of money to see a team or rider succeed, when the bigest race in the world is basically a lotery. In terms of end results it would be just the same if we lined up all the riders at the team presentation and started kicking their knees in and sending them home. No other sport has this kind of randomness that can hardly be influenced. Imagine if you started a grand slam in tennis with Nadal, Djoković and Federer and you would randomly push two of them down the stairs to the court so they would break their legs and could not even show what they trained for. It would be exactly like cycling has been these last three days.

 

[topt]

NO. Read again! I am saying that Colbrelli is NOT to blame. I left it open whatever happened, but there is rumour of a bodycheck, and there is rumour of Colbrelli doing something wrong.
Both are not sure.
And if there was a bodycheck, it isn't sure either if it was Colbrelli. You don't leave open the possibility that someone bodychecked Roglic, resulting in Roglic touching overlapped wheels with Colbrelli or the rider, and Colbrelli getting upset because Roglic hit his rear wheel (which is the most likely what happened).
Edit: rewatching footage, Colbrelli could have been next to Roglic, but I see no movement whatever by Colbrelli. Other options are they hooked handlebars, or Roglic was squeezed between Colbrelli and the rider just in front of him overlapping wheels. Either way, accusing Colbrelli because he made a gesture after the crash is a bit lame.

based on what rogla said, yes he is

 

[Carols]

It's the Sporza video, on Sporza (possibly geo-restricted).

Anyway, this is Colbrelli's take, which makes sense.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1409585186254163971

View: https://twitter.com/BHRVictorious/status/1409585186254163971?s=20

https://twitter.com/x/status/1409585188191936532

View: https://twitter.com/BHRVictorious/status/1409585188191936532?s=20

https://twitter.com/x/status/1409585190398140456

View: https://twitter.com/BHRVictorious/status/1409585190398140456?s=20

Thanks. Obviously we need a helicopter shot to know what happened. But I feel better that Cobrelli apologized at least. Roglic may not know anything except that he was shoved off the road and most likely between Injuries and Time loss has lost the TdF.

 

[topt]

Where did you read this?

Accoring to this article, he is ok and they only had to do some stitches..

[Update] Roglic laat gehavende lichaam zien: 'Mummie gaat van start'

(28 juni) Primoz Roglic is hard ten val gekomen in de slotfa

www.indeleiderstrui.nl

Daniel Dwarswaard twitter

 

[jmdirt]

One thing I will toss in here just for more to chew on: just because a rider has the power to weight to ride in the TdF, doesn't mean that they are great bike riders. Yes, they spend hours and hours on their bikes, but some of them never develop "the feel".

 

[Broccolidwarf]

based on what rogla said, yes he is

I mean, Colbrelli's statement was posted a full 7 minutes before your post - are you calling him a liar?

Based on what?

 

[topt]

Tweet unavailable.

hm, I made a printsceen, I would upload it if I knew how

 

[titan31]

Lot of riders complaining about today on twitter (cyclingnews have an article with it all). Be surprised if more doesn't happen here

 

[Carols]

i mean it's not even that hard to see. there is one guy moving left until another guy exits stage left, lol.

Well my eyes are old, I had to find Cobrelli's helmet and watch it move at least 2 lanes left as Roglic went flying out the left.

 

[topt]

I mean, Colbrelli's statement was posted a full 7 minutes before your post - are you calling him a liar?

Based on what?

Based on what Roglic said

 

[spalco]

It's the Sporza video, on Sporza (possibly geo-restricted).

Anyway, this is Colbrelli's take, which makes sense: movements in the peloton, Colbrelli to the left, Roglic from behind, contact between the two of them almost entangling, Roglic crashing unfortunately.
To claim Colbrelli did a bodycheck (intentionally or not) is more than a few bridges too far.

Ah, the handlebars touched, that makes sense.

The 'bodycheck' alone shouldn't be enough to throw off a pro cyclist as violently as roglic there.

Very unfortunate.

 

[Broccolidwarf]

I agree, it's just that in contemporary pro cycling the speeds and performance pressure has become stratospheric and thus a certain course design is necessary to avoid the worst calamities, which doesn't need to be a Forumla-1 racetrack. Like you said it's finding the delicate balance, which, on the evidence, the Tour organizers have failed to achieve.

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree ASO got it wrong today.

They did yesterday, with that horrible chicane right after the start, but the route today was fine IMO.

The road could have been twice as wide, but you would still have the same effect, just with more riders involved, it is inevitable when you have 15 sprinters AND their trains, all wanting the same positions.

An important point also is, that it is not necessarily safer with a finish on a wide road, because you get a lot of side to side movement in the peloton, at high speed, which can be just as dangerous as riding 6 abreast on a smaller, more technical road, at lower speed.

It is highly situational.

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Based on what Roglic said

Roglic just said he got hit by Colbrelli - which Colbrelli's statement confirms - and Roglic did not claim intent.

There is no need for inventing drama.