Tour de France Tour de France 2022: Stage 12 (Briançon – Alpe d’Huez, 165.1k)

[Moondance]

I mean... we have no idea what his finances are like... maybe he needs the money

 

[madthebad]

Not that simple, people have good days and bad. The group's time up the Alpe was quite fast today, historically. I think the late attack by Pogi was inevitable, they knew it, and they responded well. If he'd have shown any weakness earlier they'd have attacked. I didn't see any.

I think that Jumbo failed to capitalise today and it might end up biting themback like in 2020 .
Of course Pogacar looked much better than yesterday , but for sure he still had weaknesses and didnt fully recover after yesterday . Pogi's attacks were the attacks of a wounded lion today .
Jumbo had the momentum and the vastly superior manpower today . They hadit mostly due to the gruesomeness of these 2 stages , maybe UAE will look much better in the Pyrennes with shorter climbs and less difficult stages , they might even end up with Majka launching Pogacar into attacks on the last climb .
I think they should have went full gas today , especially Vingegard .

 

[inri2000]

I say I would not be surprised if he retired because he's a 4-time Tour champion with a lot of pride. He's proven he can have great days on the bike after his horrendous crash, but I can't imagine him continuing to pedal if he doesn't realistically have chances to win GTs. Would he really stick around to win a spring classic or be a domestique, even for the money?

He's doing what he loves and getting paid handsomely for it so I don't think he would stop unless his body is crumbling. I'm 41 years old and I don't ever plan to stop playing (amateur) football unless it's starts causing me pain.

In the case of Froome, I'm sure they can plan his race calendar to best fit his current declining level, don't forget Chris Horner (extreme example) continued to ride at the top level well into his 40's.

 

[Escarabajo]

I think the only chance for Pog is the rain in the Pyrenees.

He wasn't going to do anything today after yesterday. Any reasonable coach would tell him to take it easy and avoid losing time. This is not a problem at all.

 

[madthebad]

He's doing what he loves and getting paid handsomely for it so I don't think he would stop unless his body is crumbling. I'm 41 years old and I don't ever plan to stop playing (amateur) football unless it's starts causing me pain.

In the case of Froome, I'm sure they can plan his race calendar to best fit his current declining level, don't forget Chris Horner (extreme example) continued to ride at the top level well into his 40's.

you have to respect the hustle though , making Israel ISN pay him that huge amount of money in return for nothing .

 

[MartinGT]

Bjerg suffered today, even Ewan took over him

 

[YavorD]

That was a bit disappointing, but I also think this is the reason people have to like Pogacar even when he's dominating. If he was in Jonas' position, he would attack..no matter what.

Anyway, I hope we'll have a great battle though it seems hard to imagine.

Most of the people seem to underestimate stage in Saturday (?), but I think Mende is a perfect climb for Pogacar and this stage may have a massive psychological effect. If Vingo stays casually with him, we may declare Tour pretty much as over, unless something unexpected happens. If, however Pog takes 15-20 seconds, we have game on.

 

[Zoef-Lightning]

Congrats to Pidcock and I am glad to see Froome finally get something.

But I think the theory Pog’s tactics yesterday of being overconfident chasing every move by Vingo and Roglic on the Galibier and then paying the price is now proven. It wasn’t his form or being overweight as some claimed. Great recovery by him today. He will keep trying.

I see him taking time back at Vingegaard. He's also more explosive. But without a bad day of Vingegaard, I don't think Pogacar can regain two minutes befor the time trial.

 

[inri2000]

you have to respect the hustle though , making Israel ISN pay him that huge amount of money in return for nothing .

I agree that they overinvested, by a lot, but a third place on Alpe d'Huez is not nothing.

 

[Lequack]

LOTS of climbing left to go. You may certainly be right, but not a guy I'd bet against.

Yes but its only going to get hotter. I am betting this is the warmest Tour on record.

 

[Unchained]

He wasn't going to do anything today after yesterday. Any reasonable coach would tell him to take it easy and avoid losing time. This is not a problem at all.

agreed..w Roglic carrying water, and questions about his shoulder strength..can he put 100% on the bars out of the saddle,Kuss..way back..so they could try to get him a stage but why risk it..I see Pog putting 1-2,minutes into anybody going uphill if he is feeling good..today he jumped unsuccessfully,but he did get up and stand on it....maybe next time he gets a gap..

 

[Lequack]

Pogacar said: "I know what happened yesterday. Too many attacks, I was a little bit stupid to follow everything. I was feeling good in the Galibier, I did a bit too much. It won't happen again"

I hope this is not the en of attacking Pog.

 

[Lorzenz08]

LOTS of climbing left to go. You may certainly be right, but not a guy I'd bet against.

Yea but you know with a team as strong as Jumbo, I think Pogacar will be able to move the needle only in the last few km of the only 2 remaining mountain stages, and the TT.

 

[Cookster15]

I see him taking time back at Vingegaard. He's also more explosive. But without a bad day of Vingegaard, I don't think Pogacar can regain two minutes befor the time trial.

True Vingegaard is still in the box seat to defend. But if Pog can have a bad day so can Vingo. He should keep trying which not only puts Vingo under pressure but also JV which you never know.

The 3rd week hasn't started yet. We also saw what happened at the Giro. And I will remind again, Pog is still nearly two years younger than Vingo which means natural progression is still in Pog's favor all else being equal.

 

[Lorzenz08]

Pogacar said: "I know what happened yesterday. Too many attacks, I was a little bit stupid to follow everything. I was feeling good in the Galibier, I did a bit too much. It won't happen again"

I hope this is not the en of attacking Pog.

Not at all, it's just he needs to be attacking Pog in the final climb.

 

[GroupDK]

I think that Jumbo failed to capitalise today and it might end up biting themback like in 2020 .
Of course Pogacar looked much better than yesterday , but for sure he still had weaknesses and didnt fully recover after yesterday . Pogi's attacks were the attacks of a wounded lion today .
Jumbo had the momentum and the vastly superior manpower today . They hadit mostly due to the gruesomeness of these 2 stages , maybe UAE will look much better in the Pyrennes with shorter climbs and less difficult stages , they might even end up with Majka launching Pogacar into attacks on the last climb .
I think they should have went full gas today , especially Vingegard .

He is tired' and who wouldn't be after the best stage in years with the play Vingegaard made yesterday at the final, where he showed the world that Pogacar is human, and managed to take almost 3 minutes in like 5km.. on Pogacar.. and Vingegaard was all alone on the final climb..
Yesterday, on the final climb it did not look that good for Jumbo Vista (entertaining with all their attacks, for sure, but also somewhat problematic in the final).... Vingegaard all alone, while Pogacar had Majka to lean on in the final.
But gladly Vingegaard had diamonds in the leg and attacked, and Majka tried briefly to close Vingegaard's move for Pogacar, but then saw Pogacar were in trouble.
Primoz Roglic was sadly destroyed yesterday.. and came in 11½ minutes... and completely knackered his GC with and went from like a tad over 2 minutes behind Pogacar to now almost 14 minutes..(so a very expensive day)
Jumbo Vista can be grateful that Jonas could finish it yesterday with an unreal final climb,.
.
Jonas also did it in 2021 TdF, but that was briefly and where you could see Vingegaard showed that Pogacar was not invisible..
It has been Vingegaard that both in 2021 and 2022.. has been up to Pogacar level in the mountains and at times also showed inferior signs..
I reckon Vinegaard was tired today and who wouldn't be in this heat and after the epic stage-final, he managed yesterday.... It's g0d dang fr3aking Pogacar he is fighting.. That is as potent as it gets.

Jonas dropping Pogacar 2021 tdF with a pace that is unreal.. look at the stats.

- and Jonas managed to gain ½ min on Pogacar before the decent, but Jonas was alone, and Wan Aert all in the front and Pogacar could lean on the other riders closing the gap to Jonas on the long decent.
So its really not that surprising that Jonas does it again here in 2022... also likely why Pogacar title him as the best mountain rider.

View: https://youtu.be/Y-X3hqBg7wM?t=300

I reckon Vingegaard is toasted after yesterday, and in this heat and after 3x HC it makes sense, and Its likely also a task for him to be riding in the yellow-jersey, and getting familiar with this pressure, and all the attention.
so it makes sense for him, to take it easy and become familiar with the situation and if Pogacar should show further signs of weakness then capitalize but first and foremost don't lose.
His and Jumbo Vista main goal today... were to be ajour with Pogacar possible revenge, and not losing seconds, - and also why they had an interests in letting other taking the stage, as Pogacar are a faster sprinter then Jonas' as we saw a few stages ago.
Jonas Vingegaard & Jumbo V. played it beautiful today and Sepp Kuss showed the class he contains, same with Wan Aert...
TJV went deep yesterday and lost one of their co-captains and only have one horse in the race now, so its make sense not getting too bold, but instead control it as much as possible, now that they have the Yellow and Green with a decent margin..

 

[Cookster15]

Yea but you know with a team as strong as Jumbo, I think Pogacar will be able to move the needle only in the last few km of the only 2 remaining mountain stages, and the TT.

The team didn't save Carapaz at the 2022 Giro or Roglic at the 2020 TdF. I think its safe to assume Pog is a stronger rider than Jai Hindley (so far). And week 3 starts on Monday. Of course Vingo is in the box seat but as of today I don't think he's as safe as some are suggesting. Today was a great recovery by Pogacar after yesterday. It was a confirmation yesterday was about overconfidence and unnecesarily burning matches. Hopefully he learned from that and we see a big fight.

 

[Mayomaniac]

Ciccone still did better than during his last attempt, where he died as soon as the road went uphill. If he's improving, he could still win a stage here.

He isn't far behind in the KoM classification and had Gastritis during the first week. If he's still improving that one and a stage win could be a nice goal for him.

 

[roundabout]

Top 3 riders on the stage were ones who bridged to the original group.

Value of doing nothing on the Galibier (uphill and downhill) was exactly nothing

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Pogacar may finish ahead of Vinge all mountain stages except yesterday but without dropping him and losing the race as a result. Kinda similar to the second half of last Tour (except that this time It was Vinge who struct the decisive early blow).

 

[ashhutch1997]

Yes but its only going to get hotter. I am betting this is the warmest Tour on record.

Hottest since 2003? I remember that one being a scorcher

 

[Lorzenz08]

Pogacar may finish ahead of Vinge all mountain stages except yesterday but without dropping him and losing the race as a result. Kinda similar to the second half of last Tour (except that this time It was Vinge who struct the decisive early blow).

Agreed, unless Vinge also happen to have a bad day, I really don't see Pogacar take a minute or more in mountain stages.

 

[Netserk]

Great win by Pidcock! I would have preferred an all-out GC battle for the stage win, but I think it's one of the better breakaway wins on Alpe d'Huez.

 

[Cookster15]

Hottest since 2003? I remember that one being a scorcher

Yes in 2003 France I think endured a similar heatwave. This was the year Lance was put under the most pressure due to dehydration. I am not sure if this year is worse?

The forecast for Monday is 39C in Paris. The tour climbs the Aubisque and Hautacam that day. Of course it will be cooler over 1,000 metres in the Pyrenees than in Paris but still very hot for climbing.

 

[Netserk]

Yes in 2003 France I think endured a similar heatwave. This was the year Lance was put under the most pressure due to dehydration. I am not sure if this year is worse?

The forecast for Monday is 39C in Paris. The tour climbs the Aubisque and Hautacam that day. Of course it will be cooler over 1,000 metres in the Pyrenees than in Paris but still very hot for climbing.

Hautacam (and Aubisque) is in a week from now, on Thursday.