Tour de France Tour de France 2023, stage 8: Libourne - Limoges, 200.7k

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theyoungest

Jan 11, 2010
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Rackham said:
It's the Tour. It's how Jumbo races, every year.

Van Aert does some massive pulls in a mountain stage for the GC leader, then he gets the freedom to target specific stages himself.

It sounds great in theory & it actually did work last year, but so far... it's not going well. The team spent energy today which they absolutely shouldn't have done.
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When they don't work for Wout they get criticized as well, probably by the same people, so that's not really what I'm trying to say. But in this specific stage I don't really see the point.
 
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Rackham

Rackham

Jul 16, 2015
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theyoungest said:
When they don't work for Wout they get criticized as well, probably by the same people, so that's not really what I'm trying to say. But in this specific stage I don't really see the point.
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From the backstage videos I've seen over the years (& various interviews), it looks like they write down a bunch of specific stages for WvA before the Tour as 'target stages'.

Today was one of them, considering the harder gradients in the final. And Jumbo have two leaders in the Tour, i.e. Vingegaard & WvA. Both are supported for their respective objectives. Today was WvA's turn to get the team to ride for him.

I'm not judging this tactic (i.e. I've said enough on the subject since 2020), but it's just the way they race. Personally I don't think it's smart considering GC is so tight but hey-ho, I'm not in their team car.
 
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theyoungest

Jan 11, 2010
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Rackham said:
From the backstage videos I've seen over the years (& various interviews), it looks like they write down a bunch of specific stages for WvA before the Tour as 'target stages'.

Today was one of them, considering the harder gradients in the final. And Jumbo have two leaders in the Tour, i.e. Vingegaard & WvA. Both are supported for their respective objectives. Today was WvA's turn to get the team to ride for him.

I'm not judging this tactic (i.e. I've said enough on the subject since 2020), but it's just the way they race. Personally I don't think it's smart considering GC is so tight but hey-ho, I'm not in their team car.
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It's give and take, that's their philosophy and it's brought them a lot. But IMHO you also have to be smart, let the sprinters teams do the chasing.

Wout blames himself, he says he hesitated too long and he had the legs to win. Which is probably true as well.
 
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RobertCrawley

RobertCrawley

Jul 3, 2022
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theyoungest said:
It's give and take, that's their philosophy and it's brought them a lot. But IMHO you also have to be smart, let the sprinters teams do the chasing.

Wout blames himself, he says he hesitated too long and he had the legs to win. Which is probably true as well.
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Wout sure came up fast on Peterson and JtD after he untangled himself.
 
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saunaking

Jul 22, 2010
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Jagartrott said:
I don't know if you saw, but Van Aert was exactly where he needed to be, then got boxed in mainly because Laporte stopped pedaling. The speed with which he came at the end shows that he actually could have won. So to criticize him now, is unfair. Also, 'at the expense of Vingegaards safety' - eh what?
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Van Aert came on so incredibly fast at the end after Laporte's ***-up
 
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GroupDK

GroupDK

Sep 7, 2010
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Trofonios said:
TJV burned too many riders too early in the chase, should have trusted other teams to take part in the chase 10-20k from the finish.
It was worrying sign to see just Hooydonck, Vinge, Laporte and van Aert on the last climb.
Benoot should have been there also, taking over after Hooydonck. Now Vinge was confused when Hooydonck was finished: I shouldn't pull should I? Laporte finally took over but it was too early to have him in front, hell he even had to chase down Campenaerts.

Bad tactics by TJV. Again.
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I reckon it wasnt a chase, more like a burn, where Jumbo went all out (with close to all riders and Jonas in second) on the hill, simply to water out the sprinterfield and drop the strongest sprinters to give WvA an advantage as WvA does seem to come short against the top sprinterguys.

- sadly it didn't succeed and Phillipsen og Petersen were able to hold on.
Need to accept that WvA is simply not the strongest sprinter and you can do everything under the sun, and he will come latter ftw, if people like Phillipsen & Mads Petersen is also there, and got their explosion mojo still in check.

You can bet WvA also got a saying in the tactic that is in play, he aint an infant and will decide a lot on a stage like this and what modus operandi Jumbo Vista fronts..
 
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Hugh Januss

Hugh Januss

Jul 9, 2009
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Didinho said:
Pogi 10th and you see a yellow helmet grinding at the back of the front group. Jumbo no one left to help. Still don’t get this.
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Assuming by yellow helmet grinding away at the back that you mean Vingo? But he finished 18th, 8 places behind Pogi, so now I'm confused. In the group of 40 that finished in the lead time Jumbo still had 4 riders while UAE had exactly one.
 
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Valv.Piti

Valv.Piti

Aug 3, 2015
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Wout van Aert looked to be the strongest rider, but once again not able to capitalize on it.

Honestly really hopes he moves on soon, Im so sick and tired of commentators, experts, forum members etc. questioning everything that Jumbo and Van Aert does. Was the same with Valverde and Movistar, I guess Im great at pick favorites...
 
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laarsland

Dec 23, 2015
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Well, if nothing else from a Clinic-perspective it's assuring to see mountain exploits actually taking a bit of the edge of your sprinting abilities.
 
GroupDK

GroupDK

Sep 7, 2010
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Mads Pedersen late interview with a danish media (EB)
I was only sure when I crossed the finish line, because my legs were completely empty in the last 50 meters
I saw a wheel on my left, but couldn't see the color of the frame, so I didn't know it was Jasper. I could only see the bright deck sides and it's usually either one from Alpecin-Deceuninck or Jumbo-Visma. So I thought, 'Shlt, here they come'.

- Fortunately for me, his legs were just as empty in the last 50 metres,
- I'm just so happy to win. Jasper came very strong and fast at the end. But he probably also hit the wall in the last 50-75 metres, noted Mads Pedersen, who also kept a strong Wout Van Aert behind him.

However, he had to admit that he will stick to the characterization of Van Aert and Mathieu van der Poel as the greatest, while he himself is below the level.
They are the superstars of cycling. They are super good and can win everything. But that doesn't mean it's impossible to beat them.
- I still believe that I am below them, but I showed today that it is possible to beat them in a fair sprint.
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Jagartrott

Jagartrott

Apr 15, 2014
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GroupDK said:
- sadly it didn't succeed and Phillipsen og Petersen were able to hold on.
Need to accept that WvA is simply not the sprongest sprinter and you can do everything under the sun, and he will come latter ftw, if people like Phillipsen & Mads Petersen is also there, and got their explosion mojo still in check.
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Today Van Aert may actually have been the fastest sprinter.
 
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