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Tour of California vs. The Giro

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soOpOSMthanks! said:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/messicks-masterplan-for-the-tour-of-california

What do you guys think? I think Messick is being a bit too optimistic, I don't foresee next years field to be anything like previous years. Granted that you'll get a nice field of big name American riders, but in terms of big names...it's gonna go down drastically.

And while we are on the subject of California, or the US for that matter...maybe I'm not looking good enough, but why is the US so into crits? Seems like every local race I look into is a criterium :confused:

Some american teams and riders will be in CA. First tier Euro teams will be at the Giro, 1 of the three 'grand tours' in the world today. Some continental teams from Europe will be there also but only if they can't get an invite to the Giro.

TV? Most are going to watch the Giro, I know I will. If he thinks this 'tour' will be a serious competitor to the Giro, a race that has been followed religiously for almost a CENTURY by the center of cycling(Europe) he is nutz...

Crits are the cheapest to put on, better spectator sports for non tifosi.
 
Mellow Velo said:
Cav to Cali, not the Giro?
Not chance in hell.
Major difference in ranking points, not to mention more opportunities.
You'll find the gradual shift will be going in the opposite direction.

Well, there is always the posibility that Columbia takes Greipel to the Giro and Cavendish to the Vuelta if Cavendish for example is in the same frame of mind as Hushovd and views the Vuelta as a good lead up to the Worlds.
 
Mar 11, 2009
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Make up my mind? I'm a faceless internet cycling pundit! Why in heaven's name should I? :rolleyes:

I loved watching the Giro this year (for a stinking change) and also being on the roadside for ToC.

...and in years past, I was also a roadside hick for the TdG (Tour de Georgia).

I was trying for a bit of sarcasm, but rereading my note I can see I was seriously off the mark.
 

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Aug 17, 2009
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Tour of California

I know most who post are extremely knowledgadble about pro cycling.

What I see good about the tour of California is that the European riders who compete will be hellafit when they arrive.

Of course the Italians will have there best at the Giro.

Manx man will dominate wherever he chooses, a track sprinter who rides road always fit: a spectacle.(HO HUM) Give Tyler Farrar a reason to exist: so what.

It would be good if Lance competed in the Tour of California but if he chooses not to that is OK.
Grand Tours are postcards to the world advertising the beauties of their country.

The hype about grand tour status is just that, hype. So what Le Tour was a bore #1 race in the world.

If the Tour of California promotes California and advertising Amgen/Rabobank/Cycling--- good.

It will then continue to exist and evolve.
 
Sep 25, 2009
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tour of cali will become a pleasant memory if it attempts to seriously compete with the giro manoman.

not that i have anything against it, it's just that the sport is still too euro centric and no amount of the us corporate money will change the situation soon.
 
Jun 16, 2009
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For the guys preparing for the tour they would ride Calafornia. The riders not doing the tour would ride the giro. You won't get many Italians at Calafornia and you won't get many Americans in Italy. Simple...
 
i think the switch is good from the point of view that maybe some of the top americans will actually take part in worlds this next year

i know that DZ for example said he was skipping worlds because he had been racing since february at the tour of california...maybe with a later start of the season the top americans will race longer
 
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auscyclefan94 said:
For the guys preparing for the tour they would ride Calafornia. The riders not doing the tour would ride the giro. You won't get many Italians at Calafornia and you won't get many Americans in Italy. Simple...

Ding ding ding.... we have a winner. Agree totally. And if I'm a DS with some riders that I want to focus on the Tour then I might want to send them to Cali instead.
 
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Astana1 said:
Ding ding ding.... we have a winner. Agree totally. And if I'm a DS with some riders that I want to focus on the Tour then I might want to send them to Cali instead.

It's a 1 week tour which has a bit of everything and only goes for 1 week. perfect for the tour guys.
 
Astana1 said:
Ding ding ding.... we have a winner. Agree totally. And if I'm a DS with some riders that I want to focus on the Tour then I might want to send them to Cali instead.



Yes, I'll conceed that a number of English speaking riders may like to do Cali.
Why they didn't pick Mid April, which is more or less devoid of stage races, is beyond me.
Lots of riders not involved in the classics, or would prefer to ride a stage race.

Armstrong noted the May conflict between the Giro d'Italia (May 8-30) and the Tour of California (May 16-23, previously in February); "RadioShack is an American sponsor but the Giro is good preparation for the Tour de France." The Tour of California will already suffer from less world media exposure going head to head with the Giro; Armstrong racing the Giro would be a huge blow to the American race.


Another issue, is getting the logistics in place mid-season. I have wondered how team buses etc, get out to Cali and back. The race might last just a week, but...........
 
auscyclefan94 said:
For the guys preparing for the tour they would ride Calafornia. The riders not doing the tour would ride the giro. You won't get many Italians at Calafornia and you won't get many Americans in Italy. Simple...

Sorry to be so negative, again. I want the race to succeed, but I think it's been put in an awful timeslot.

Few guys preparing for the Tour will ride Cali.
A small number do ride Catalunya, so, if they aren't Spanish or French, they might travel. Some may be ordered to ride.
Most hybernate from mid-April and reappear in June for their one pre-Tour, Tour.
Cali is too early for most. The Dauphine/Switzerland, filling the preparatory slot.
 
Mar 18, 2009
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Mellow Velo said:
Sorry to be so negative, again. I want the race to succeed, but I think it's been put in an awful timeslot.

Few guys preparing for the Tour will ride Cali.
A small number do ride Catalunya, so, if they aren't Spanish or French, they might travel. Some may be ordered to ride.
Most hybernate from mid-April and reappear in June for their one pre-Tour, Tour.
Cali is too early for most. The Dauphine/Switzerland, filling the preparatory slot.

Catalunya is now in late March. That's why California was able to move to May: a spot was open
 
Already? Is next season's RR calander out? Haven't looked.
Poor old Catalunya. Third move on just over as many years. Filling the void of Settimana Catalana?
May well die a quick death there.
Oh well, sacrifices have to be made in Pat's globalisation quest.
Is stage racing banned in mid-April?
Pais Vasco isn't exactly financially sound, at the moment, if that were to fold....
 
Jul 23, 2009
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Rupert said:
I will look at the route, there are long, hard climbs (more long than steep) from the South that end at Big Bear, I haven't ridden the approach form the North but I'm told it's an interesting climb... We ought to hear from someone from the area, I've ridden he Death Ride twice and Big Bear twice but don't know about much more than those climbs.

Did the Death Ride and Climb to Kaiser this year and have ridden up into the Sequoia Park a few of times. We have climbs in California that rival anything on the planet in my opinion. Note: Kaiser is on a level above Death Ride.
 
May 7, 2009
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I also don’t agree with Messick’s logic (i.e. the season “ends with the Tour”). That sounds like defeatism at its worst to me. With the Vuelta moving to spring, wouldn’t late summer be the perfect time for the Tour of Cali? The climbs up in the Sierras would be opened, no Giro conflict, a late season “important” race, what’s the problem? All this ignored because of the stupid idea that “the season ends with the tour”.
 
Wrecktangle said:
ToC is the top US race by a bunch. In compairison the Tour of Georgia (who?) was a bunch of hicks by the road.

BTW, I live in Cali. :p

At least ToG had a summit/uphill finish something ToC has never had. The mountainous stages they had last year were completely useless since the finishline was like 30 miles from the summit of the final climb. If they make an effort to include a summit finish or at least a final summit that is less than 10k from the finish then they'll be adding some real drama and excitement. Otherwise it will be the LL show until he retires.
 
May 7, 2009
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No way Armstrong will do Giro. It's a revenge thing.

Let's not forget a few things: First, Giro Director Zomegnan went postal on Lance last year when the riders protested stage 9 conditions. Basically called him a wussy. Lance doesn't forgive or forget things like that.

Second, he's 38 with four kids-- he doesn't travel to Europe unless it's nessessary. The Tour of California will give him a much warmer welcome, cut his travel and prep him just as well. And it's a US sponsor in their first year. I'd bet my titanium Serotta he does the Giro.

See my blog post on the matter at Twisted Spoke: http://walshworld.wordpress.com/
 
Jun 27, 2009
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So...Catalyuna is being moved? If that's the case California should get plenty of big names. But the field won't be as distinguished as previous years--May is a key training/racing month and a tough month for travel across the Atlantic. Armstrong will be much more likely to win, obviously.
 
Mar 11, 2009
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The Giro is such a great race.
The TOC is a good race.
The logic of Messick seems so out of wack. Some of the things these people say ....
My vote is Giro.
 
Mellow Velo said:
Another issue, is getting the logistics in place mid-season. I have wondered how team buses etc, get out to Cali and back. The race might last just a week, but...........

The non-American PT teams don't bring their Euro-buses, they make do with campers. IIRC, in 2009, only Garmin and Astana (and maybe Columbia) had buses. Saxo and QuickStep definately had large campers. Didn't get any pictures of the LiquiGas and Rabo set ups, but I'm pretty sure they had campers, too.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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CentralCaliBike said:
Did the Death Ride and Climb to Kaiser this year and have ridden up into the Sequoia Park a few of times. We have climbs in California that rival anything on the planet in my opinion. Note: Kaiser is on a level above Death Ride.

There some long climbs in California, but none have the gradient of say a Ventoux or most of the Alps
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Mellow Velo said:
Another issue, is getting the logistics in place mid-season. I have wondered how team buses etc, get out to Cali and back. The race might last just a week, but...........

They rent RV's and the TOC sponsor Toyota lets them us a bunch of cars with racks