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Re: Re:

Zinoviev Letter said:
ciranda said:
Lol at the outrage for Brajkovic. He has contacts, good for him. And he was a great cyclist once. He has as much a legitimate place in a good team as ~30 or more now wt riders. The discussion is similar to when Lotto signed Tomasz Marczynski and a number of people thought it was super strange. Shows that it's now established fact that to get a place in a WT team riders have to be a lot better if they are not from some particular countries. And if you already think like that it can seem weird that teams would take (established quality) cyclists like Brajkovic and Marczynski.

There's no outrage. I'm surprised and entertained by Brajkovic's return to the world tour after a couple of unimpressive years in the US, but if I was going to get outraged about the Bahraini hereditary dictatorship's involvement in cycling, I wouldn't focus on the hiring of a clapped out Brajkovic. I just find it bizarre that a guy who couldn't hold down a WT contract two years ago, when he actually had impressive results within recent memory, can get a WT contract after two years of anonymity. UHC is a place where multiple out of favour riders have gone to show that they still have it and then have got back to the WT. It's amusing to see a guy who went there for that reason and then showed that he didn't still have it get a contract.

Marczynski won eight races the year before Lotto hired him. Brajkovic last won anything four years ago. It's not some inexplicable bias against Slovenes to see a difference.

I'd love to express that outrage about the teams owners but we aren't allowed to discuss that in this section of the forum unfortunately.
I expressed surprise about about the signing on Brajkovic for the simple reason he's done nothing over the last 2 season in lower tier stage races, good luck to the guy for having the contacts to get another WT contract
 
Re: Re:

Zinoviev Letter said:
ciranda said:
Zinoviev Letter said:
ciranda said:
Lol at the outrage for Brajkovic. He has contacts, good for him. And he was a great cyclist once. He has as much a legitimate place in a good team as ~30 or more now wt riders. The discussion is similar to when Lotto signed Tomasz Marczynski and a number of people thought it was super strange. Shows that it's now established fact that to get a place in a WT team riders have to be a lot better if they are not from some particular countries. And if you already think like that it can seem weird that teams would take (established quality) cyclists like Brajkovic and Marczynski.

There's no outrage. I'm surprised and entertained by Brajkovic's return to the world tour after a couple of unimpressive years in the US, but if I was going to get outraged about the Bahraini hereditary dictatorship's involvement in cycling, I wouldn't focus on the hiring of a clapped out Brajkovic. I just find it bizarre that a guy who couldn't hold down a WT contract two years ago, when he actually had impressive results within recent memory, can get a WT contract after two years of anonymity. UHC is a place where multiple out of favour riders have gone to show that they still have it and then have got back to the WT. It's amusing to see a guy who went there for that reason and then showed that he didn't still have it get a contract.

Marczynski won eight races the year before Lotto hired him. Brajkovic last won anything four years ago. It's not some inexplicable bias against Slovenes to see a difference.

My point was the reaction was surprise and incredulousness also w Marczynski.

Yes and my point was that your conviction that people here are biased against riders from some countries and don't think that Poles or Slovenes can cycle is weird and delusional.

Ok if you say so but then why single out Janez Brajkovic as a hard to understand signing? I can think of many that are more difficult to explain from this year and past years. I could come up with such a list, maybe others could too.

I mean is Brajkovic likely to be as good support as Stetina who we discussed last time around? Yes.

The old discussion was about Jan Hirt and why big teams are not all over him. One of the best u23s in the last two years, Michal Schlegel, also don't have interest from big teams but he should have if you look at results.

It is boring to say but here it is again: if these guys (others too) had been from any *******-speaking nation they would have multiple offers. I agree the same goes for Belgium, Netherlands, France, Italy, Spain, Germany. Now is this a problem? Some might think no but I do because this structure means a lot of people with talent never get chances while lesser talented do. That reflects real life-life of course. In cycling it means less diversity, I think, and in addition the growth of *****centric cycling seem to contribute to make the sport more boring because it seems that 90 percent of riders from these countries represent a wait for the sprint/last mountain/time trial type cycling.
 
Re: Re:

ciranda said:
Ok if you say so but then why single out Janez Brajkovic as a hard to understand signing?

I single out Brajkovic because he's a famous failure, a once very good cyclist who washed out of the WT, botched his second chance at PCT level and somehow ended up back in the WT. He is inherently more notable than many other riders who probably don't deserve a renewal of their PCT contract because (a) he used to actually be good and (b) instead of taking a big pay cut to stay at PCT level he's getting back to the WT because, it turns out, he is well connected.

ciranda said:
I mean is Brajkovic likely to be as good support as Stetina who we discussed last time around?

That can only be answered in another forum.

ciranda said:
The old discussion was about Jan Hirt and why big teams are not all over him. One of the best u23s in the last two years, Michal Schlegel, also don't have interest from big teams but he should have if you look at results.

Jan Hirt has had a pro contract for two years. Schlegel has decent results but hardly ones that make him an astonishing overlooked gem. We are talking about the guy who once podiumed the Tour of Eastern Bohemia, not a guy who has been tearing up the .2s, right? In any case, he only turned 21 during this season and his big result (top 10 at Avenir) only just happened. If he continues getting results he will get a pro contract.

ciranda said:
It is boring to say but here it is again: if these guys (others too) had been from any *******-speaking nation they would have multiple offers. I agree the same goes for Belgium, Netherlands, France, Italy, Spain, Germany. Now is this a problem? Some might think not but I do because a lot of people with talent never get chances while lesser talented do.

It is absolutely true that riders from countries with pro teams, countries with developed cycling infrastructures, countries where major sponsors have important interests, or better still all three, have significant advantages when it comes to getting a pro contract. But these are structural factors primarily, rather than indications of a general culture prejudice. These undoubted advantages do not mean that everyone in the world is prejudiced against other riders. Nor does thinking that Brajkovic, a guy long past his best, is a strange signing mean that therefore I'm prejudiced against Slovenes (or Eastern Europeans in general).

ciranda said:
This reflects real life-life of course. In cycling it means less diversity, I think, and in addition with more *****centrics cycling appears to get more boring since it seems that 90 percent of them represent a wait for the sprint/last mountain/time trial type cycling.

There is some influence on riders from the national cycling scene they came up through, if that scene has a strong culture but ultimately professional riders ride according to their talents and their team's priorities. Wiggins didn't ride like Wiggins because he was an anglophone any more than Menchov rode in the same way because he was Russian. Cycling has become more controlled in recent years and to some extent that correlates with an increase in the number of anglophone riders, but correlation is not causation.
 
Re: Re:

ciranda said:
Zinoviev Letter said:
ciranda said:
Zinoviev Letter said:
ciranda said:
Lol at the outrage for Brajkovic. He has contacts, good for him. And he was a great cyclist once. He has as much a legitimate place in a good team as ~30 or more now wt riders. The discussion is similar to when Lotto signed Tomasz Marczynski and a number of people thought it was super strange. Shows that it's now established fact that to get a place in a WT team riders have to be a lot better if they are not from some particular countries. And if you already think like that it can seem weird that teams would take (established quality) cyclists like Brajkovic and Marczynski.

There's no outrage. I'm surprised and entertained by Brajkovic's return to the world tour after a couple of unimpressive years in the US, but if I was going to get outraged about the Bahraini hereditary dictatorship's involvement in cycling, I wouldn't focus on the hiring of a clapped out Brajkovic. I just find it bizarre that a guy who couldn't hold down a WT contract two years ago, when he actually had impressive results within recent memory, can get a WT contract after two years of anonymity. UHC is a place where multiple out of favour riders have gone to show that they still have it and then have got back to the WT. It's amusing to see a guy who went there for that reason and then showed that he didn't still have it get a contract.

Marczynski won eight races the year before Lotto hired him. Brajkovic last won anything four years ago. It's not some inexplicable bias against Slovenes to see a difference.

My point was the reaction was surprise and incredulousness also w Marczynski.

Yes and my point was that your conviction that people here are biased against riders from some countries and don't think that Poles or Slovenes can cycle is weird and delusional.

Ok if you say so but then why single out Janez Brajkovic as a hard to understand signing? I can think of many that are more difficult to explain from this year and past years. I could come up with such a list, maybe others could too.

I mean is Brajkovic likely to be as good support as Stetina who we discussed last time around? Yes.

The old discussion was about Jan Hirt and why big teams are not all over him. One of the best u23s in the last two years, Michal Schlegel, also don't have interest from big teams but he should have if you look at results.

It is boring to say but here it is again: if these guys (others too) had been from any *******-speaking nation they would have multiple offers. I agree the same goes for Belgium, Netherlands, France, Italy, Spain, Germany. Now is this a problem? Some might think no but I do because this structure means a lot of people with talent never get chances while lesser talented do. That reflects real life-life of course. In cycling it means less diversity, I think, and in addition the growth of *****centric cycling seem to contribute to make the sport more boring because it seems that 90 percent of riders from these countries represent a wait for the sprint/last mountain/time trial type cycling.

If these guys are good enough they will be picked up by a team. Talents get tested (or at least invited to do so) all the time by big (development) teams. If they're not picked up there often is a good reason behind that. There are enough examples of riders from the more traditional cycling countries that seem to have the abilities to move up a level but don't. That just gets noticed less because the pool of riders coming from the bigger countries is so much bigger. Of course there are some *** riders that get picked up mainly because they come from a certain country (like Marczynski), but if you're good enough you will almost always get picked up no matter where you're from.
 
Feb 7, 2013
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“Some people love to judge others based on their past weaknesses, mistakes and failures, but expect those same people to judge them by their current improved conditions. So what happen to the golden rule of treating others as you would expect them to treat you?”
― Edmond Mbiaka
 
Re: Re:

claude cat said:
TMP402 said:
claude cat said:
Drapac riders Will Clarke and Tom Scully to join Brendan Canty at Cannondale-Drapac next year.

Which leaves only 14 remaining Drapac riders! Some merger.

Source: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cannondale-drapac-announce-canty-clarke-and-scully-signings/
Peter Koning is with Aqua Blue
Lachlan Norris & Gavin Mannion go to UnitedHealthcare
Graeme Brown retires.
The others are not quite up to pro-conti level.

What about Brenton Jones, no news about him?

Not exactly WT material yet, but a good PCT sprinter, would see him at UnitedHealthcare for example.
 
Re:

claude cat said:
Drapac riders Will Clarke and Tom Scully to join Brendan Canty at Cannondale-Drapac next year.
TBH, there were 3 or 4 Drapac riders I would sign before Scully and Clarke. Maybe Lowdens is not quite ready for a WT level, but at least he has a chance to become something decent in the future. Brenton Jones' results seem a tad more convincing to me as well, especially considering the fact how Cannondale lacks sprinters even for smaller races.

Now Cannondale only needs to sign Jonathan Clarke from UHC and confusion guaranteed. :D
 
Re:

PedalCastro said:
https://twitter.com/AquaBlueSport/status/789033652265086976

Aqua Blue will announce the remaining 5 riders tomorrow. One appears to be Larry Warbasse from IAM

Chris Opie liked their tweet too.

Being one of the best sprinters of One Pro Cycling, it was strange to see him finish his season in the end of August in a .2 race (which he won) and not being selected for any of the flat races that were raced after that. Being an anglo rider, I guess he could be in too.
 
SKSemtex said:
No contract for Devolder?

I wish Bora can find some extra money. He would be just perfect fit for Sagan.
He said he was in talks with one team recently. He wants at least another classics campaign to prove he's not done yet. I can follow him, because he was quite good as a domestique for Cancellara / Trek.
 
Apr 27, 2011
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Re: Re:

Ricco' said:
PedalCastro said:
https://twitter.com/AquaBlueSport/status/789033652265086976

Aqua Blue will announce the remaining 5 riders tomorrow. One appears to be Larry Warbasse from IAM

Chris Opie liked their tweet too.

Being one of the best sprinters of One Pro Cycling, it was strange to see him finish his season in the end of August in a .2 race (which he won) and not being selected for any of the flat races that were raced after that. Being an anglo rider, I guess he could be in too.

Would be another very decent signing for them.
 
Re: Re:

Jolene said:
Rollthedice said:
A young talent confirmed until 2019 at Movistar, Alejandro Valverde.

Great pick, just hope they don't over race the poor kid... :D

I heard from a junior scout and one of his teammates that he had decent endurance and a good engine. On top of that, he should have some good versatility that allows him to contribute in various terrains. Lets see, hopefully will turnout to more than just a filler on a WT-squad, I like the prospects of him.