Transfers "Rumours & Reality" and Young Guns

[python]

5 spaniard on astana more than before

if i did my math right astana will have 4 quality spaniards in addition to contador

de la fuente, cobo, plaza and (still discussed) zubeldia. berto shouldn’t be too unhappy.

 

[Publicus]

if i did my math right astana will have 4 quality spaniards in addition to contador

de la fuente, cobo, plaza and (still discussed) zubeldia. berto shouldn’t be too unhappy.

I think that is right, but who's going to get these kids across the cobbles so that AC can do his thing in the mountains?

 

[Mellow Velo]

I think that is right, but who's going to get these kids across the cobbles so that AC can do his thing in the mountains?

Gorazd Stangelj could come in useful, here.
Other than that, Vino and a couple of the big Kazakhs.
Caisse can be relied on to lend a helping hand, too.

No one has mentioned AC's mate, the now unfortunately named Jesus....Hernandez, in this case.
Another man for the mountains and there are a lot more mountains, than there are cobbled sections.

 

[Publicus]

Gorazd Stangelj could come in useful, here.
Other than that, Vino and a couple of the big Kazakhs.
Caisse can be relied on to lend a helping hand, too.

No one has mentioned AC's mate, the now unfortunately named Jesus....Hernandez, in this case.
Another man for the mountains and there are a lot more mountains, than there are cobbled sections.

I hadn't forgotten about Sweet Baby Jesus, but I worry that in their efforts to build a team of mountain goats, they forget that they have to be able to get to the mountains. 2004 is looming large in my mind (Mayo). But it sounds like they may have a body or too that they can use to control the front of the race (which is where AC will need to be).

 

[Beech Mtn]

if i did my math right astana will have 4 quality spaniards in addition to contador

de la fuente, cobo, plaza and (still discussed) zubeldia. berto shouldn’t be too unhappy.

Plus Hernandez and Noval. Vino said it would be a team of Kazakhs and Spaniards, and they seem to have delivered. Not to mention all the new signings. Can't wait to see a complete, official Astana roster - the team that once looked like picked-over bones seems to be shaping up nicely for 2010.

 

[Buffalo Soldier]

Maribel Moreno the female Spanish cyclist?

El intercambio de SMS lo realizaba con corredores como Mancebo, ya implicado en la Operación Puerto, y con otros que nunca han dado positivo, como Dani Moreno, Luis León Sánchez, Alexander Kolobnev y Luis Maté.

..........

 

[Rominger]

Same as he's done in his countless road seasons so far: nothing worth mentioning.

Cyclo-crossers don't go well on the cobbles, as those races are always very long and hard, and mostly about endurance. They do well in short intense efforts.

They tend to do well in hard, short stages, no matter if those stages are mountainous, hilly or flat. Albert's few forays into road cycling are a prime example.

Oh I don't know some guy who won paris roubaix a few times and beat a guy named Merckx to do it was a bit of a crosser on occassion.

 

[issoisso]

Oh I don't know some guy who won paris roubaix a few times and beat a guy named Merckx to do it was a bit of a crosser on occassion.

We're talking guys who make a career out of cross and then switch to road.

And even if we weren't the fact you had to dig back 40 years for an example proves my point

 

[Rominger]

We're talking guys who make a career out of cross and then switch to road.

And even if we weren't the fact you had to dig back 40 years for an example proves my point

Ah, in that case its a real shame you aren't the one advising his DS or he'd never get a chance

 

[issoisso]

Ah, in that case its a real shame you aren't the one advising his DS or he'd never get a chance

That's called a chewbacca defense. Countering with something completely unrelated that seems at a quick glance to be a logical conclusion of the above, when it's actually completely out of left field.

When did I say anything like that? When did I say cyclo-crossers shouldn't get a chance? I said the opposite. That they're quite good at certain types of racers and even gave examples.

So, keep on pretending that I said cyclo-crossers are awful, keep on pretending I said they shouldn't get a chance, etc. etc. If it makes you feel all fuzzy inside

"Roger de Vlaeminck was awful. he's the worst rider I've ever seen". Happy now?

ridiculous...

 

[krebs303]

Astana's ProTour application still not in order, Contador free to go

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/astanas-protour-application-still-not-in-order-contador-free-to-go

 

[RdBiker]

Astana's ProTour application still not in order, Contador free to go

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/astanas-protour-application-still-not-in-order-contador-free-to-go

Oooops that turns the tables upside down! Will Astana just fold and let all the riders find other teams?

 

[halamala]

Oooops that turns the tables upside down! Will Astana just fold and let all the riders find other teams?

So is it 100 % sure that AC can leave?

 

[RdBiker]

So is it 100 % sure that AC can leave?

I went and reread the article and actually it's not 100% sure.

"The standard UCI rider/team contract (2.15.139 article 8.1.f) states, "if, on 20 October of the year preceding a year of registration covered by the present contract, the UCI ProTeam has not submitted a registration file containing the essential documents," the rider may terminate the contract "without notice or liability for damages"."

We don't know if Contador's contract is done by the standards. You'd think it would be but you never know what Bruyneel wanted/made him to write in it.

 

[Publicus]

I went and reread the article and actually it's not 100% sure.

"The standard UCI rider/team contract (2.15.139 article 8.1.f) states, "if, on 20 October of the year preceding a year of registration covered by the present contract, the UCI ProTeam has not submitted a registration file containing the essential documents," the rider may terminate the contract "without notice or liability for damages"."

We don't know if Contador's contract is done by the standards. You'd think it would be but you never know what Bruyneel wanted/made him to write in it.

His contract couldn't violate UCI regulations. Astana dropped the ball. If he needs me to, I'd be happy to draft and deliver the notice to Astana (which also opens the door for all of the Spanish riders to leave).

The Velo News article has a more detailed explanation (and confirmation that this provision is indeed required in each contract):

UCI rules include a number of required provisions that must be included in rider contracts. Among those are termination provisions that allow a rider to “terminate the present contract, without notice nor liability for damages,” if certain conditions or circumstances occur.

Included in that list are a team’s bankruptcy, loss of ProTour status and one provision that may serve as the key to Contador’s early exit from the team:

if, on 20 October of the year preceding a year of registration covered by the present contract, the UCI ProTeam has not submitted a registration file containing the essential documents listed in art. 2.15.069bis.

The referenced rule 2.15.169b, added to UCI regulations in July of this year, requires that teams submit documents outlining their proposed budget for the coming year, signed sponsorship contracts, a bank guarantee and signed contracts with at least 12 riders.

Those documents will then be reviewed by the UCI and the accounting firm Ernst & Young to determine if they are in compliance with UCI and ProTour rules, “particularly in terms of their administration and financing.”

http://www.velonews.com/article/99519/astana-s-missed-deadline-may-give-contador-an-out

 

[Mellow Velo]

[In accordance with a new article added to the rules on 1 July 2009 (2.15.169b), the UCI is today publishing the list of teams that by 20 October 2009 had submitted an application file containing the following required documents:

• budget
• the sponsorship contracts duly signed with the main partners
• the bank guarantee
• at least 12 contracts with riders duly signed by the two parties
• for new teams only, a description of the structure of the team together with a copy of the deed of incorporation of the paying agent.

The teams are:

• AG2R La Mondiale
• Française des Jeux
• Footon-Servetto
• Garmin-Slipstream
• Lampre Farnese Vini
• Liquigas-Dommo
• Quick-Step Cycling Team
• Rabobank Cycling Team
• RadioShack
• Omega Pharma-Lotto
• Team Columbia-HTC
• Team Katusha
• Team Milram

This information is being published with a view to keeping all parties concerned informed about the progress of UCI ProTeam registration applications.

The UCI and Ernst&Young will continue to evaluate all applications, including those of teams not in the above list, which have until 20 November to submit their completed applications. The UCI ProTour Council will make a final decision on UCI ProTeam registrations for the 2010 season after the official deadline of 20 November.

............

That sounds like the answer is: not yet.

 

[Anonymous]

wow.. the third contador discussion thread..

spanish reports > http://translate.google.com/transla...rtad/297412.shtml&sl=es&tl=en&history_state0=

anybody going to start a "astana not granted pt licence" thread..

 

[Mellow Velo]

wow.. the third contador discussion thread..

spanish reports > http://translate.google.com/transla...rtad/297412.shtml&sl=es&tl=en&history_state0=

anybody going to start a "astana not granted pt licence" thread..

You'd swear he was Lance.
Time for some fevered twitterings.............

 

[Publicus]

[/U]............

That sounds like the answer is: not yet.

That's not correct. The Nov 20th deadline is applicable to the UCI's decision regarding the continuation of Astana's license. The October 20th date relates only to a termination right under a rider's contract. The two have nothing to do with one another--at least that's how I understand the provisions.

 

[craig1985]

Lampre-NGC sign Alessandro Spezialetti (34) and the flukest TdF stage winner in recent years Lorenzo Bernucci (30) both leave LPR Brakes. Spezialetti joins after Damiano Cunego helped him get a spot. I guess it is not what you know, but who you know. Bernucci will join Alessandro Petacchi's lead out train.

 

[Total Package]

Apparently, instead of joining Astana, Cobo (Footon-Servetto) will sign with Caisse d'Epargne

 

[journalguy]

That's not correct. The Nov 20th deadline is applicable to the UCI's decision regarding the continuation of Astana's license. The October 20th date relates only to a termination right under a rider's contract. The two have nothing to do with one another--at least that's how I understand the provisions.

I think you're absolutely right from a legal perspective. Any Astana rider whose contract contains the language that the UCI added to its model contract in July has the option to terminate his contract. But one thing we don't know is whether multi-year contracts signed before that new language was adopted are nevertheless subject to it for some reason, or were required to be amended to include it. If I'm not mistaken, Contador has a multi-year contract that predates the new language.

 

[Publicus]

I think you're absolutely right from a legal perspective. Any Astana rider whose contract contains the language that the UCI added to its model contract in July has the option to terminate his contract. But one thing we don't know is whether multi-year contracts signed before that new language was adopted are nevertheless subject to it for some reason, or were required to be amended to include it. If I'm not mistaken, Contador has a multi-year contract that predates the new language.

The standard language has to be included in ALL contracts. The question is whether the modification to the regulation applies to existing contracts and I would argue that it does. Why? Because the provision was inserted to correspond with a modification to the licensing requirements in January 2009 which required existing licensees and new licensees to submit essential documents by October 20. The fact that those modifications applied to existing licensees means that the modification should apply to existing rider contracts. Otherwise, there would be no penalty for a licensee for failing to comply with the new regulation. At least that would be the argument I would make.

 

[journalguy]

The standard language has to be included in ALL contracts. The question is whether the modification to the regulation applies to existing contracts and I would argue that it does. Why? Because the provision was inserted to correspond with a modification to the licensing requirements in January 2009 which required existing licensees and new licensees to submit essential documents by October 20. The fact that those modifications applied to existing licensees means that the modification should apply to existing rider contracts. Otherwise, there would be no penalty for a licensee for failing to comply with the new regulation. At least that would be the argument I would make.

You could very well be right. We'll probably know for sure very shortly, when some of the affected riders exercise their right to terminate their contracts.

 

[Anonymous]

im wondering what impact this ruling has on team sky.. not from the point of view of their own license as it has pretty much been accepted, i guess its just crossing of t's and dotting of i's, but as far as their signings go...

theyve been very quiet on the signing front having named no more riders really since the initial british burst, i wonder if perhaps they have a few people they where waiting on to see if they could escape on the 20th...

who have Saxo, Caisse, or Astana got that they might want..

Im going to stick my neck and out and say sky might make someone an offer they cant refuse... someone like cancellara with 2 years left might be tempted to take financial security and a four year contract.. who knows..

on a side note, and i have alluded to this is the contador thread but food for thought nonetheless.. isnt it convenient that Caisse d'Epargne, and Eusktaltel-Euskadi are in the same boat.. effectively we have a whole bunch of spaniards free to cancel contracts.. interesting situation if contador goes to a new team..
almost suspicious... :? alternatively, AC can stay at astana, and let the khazaks raid caisse and euskaltel of the spanish riders that AC wants.. perfect result for him...