UAE Tour 2022, February 20 - February 26

[hayneplane]

Yeah, i get that it is because people want riders to be more rounded to win a Grand Tour. But in my opinion if you look at the list of recent GT winners they are almost always quite well-rounded riders capable of riding good ITTs, Climbing well and having a good punch.

Personally I think that it is much harder to make significant time gaps on mountain stages (especially because those are not individually raced) than it is to make significant time gaps on a TT. So even with the decreasing amount of TT kilometres, the well rounded riders still have a very significant advantage over the less rounded riders. In my opinion increasing the number of TT kilomtres would even decrease the chances of the best rounded rider winning the GT, because the advantage for a Great TT-er and reasonable climber would become too big over a reasonable TT-er and Great Climber.

Maybe but that is mainly for me down to Pogacar and Roglic actually being better climbers than 'pure' climbers like Landa. This means that they are already ahead rather than making up for their climbing level with all the other aspects of their skillset.

 

[Tim Cahill]

It's for the major businesses, politicians and oligarchs to take the brunt of sanction, whilst questions around Gazprom's ongoing sponsorship are legitimate I'm not sure going full Armstrong on random riders because of their team is such a good play, especially since the winner isn't even Russian. Well done to him.

 

[yaco]

Far too many political posts in this thread which should be removed - The bigger picture is the peleton has been lackadaisical in it's approach to this race and there overall performance has been unbefitting of a WT race.

 

[Bolder]

Disrespect to Ukraine by the peloton to give Gazprom such a prominent place in the last two stages. Probably even succesful. Hopefully Lapeira or the Bardiani guy finishes it.

Well, it is the UAE tour. if the UCI wants to police the peloton for ties to countries with questionable human rights records or bad actors on the world stage, we'd be racing only in Norway with sponsorless jerseys.

Mods: Anyway, I don't think the political commentary is a bad thing. This is low day for those of us in Europe.

 

[greyclouds]

Far too many political posts in this thread which should be removed - The bigger picture is the peleton has been lackadaisical in it's approach to this race and there overall performance has been unbefitting of a WT race.

I don't think that any of the comments seen here today are "far too political" given the current European context.

 

[Bye Bye Bicycle]

Far too many political posts in this thread which should be removed - The bigger picture is the peleton has been lackadaisical in it's approach to this race and there overall performance has been unbefitting of a WT race.

Au contraire: I find it quite fitting how the peloton treats this race. It's a *** race in a *** country and no one cares about it anyway.

 

[Mayomaniac]

The Gazprom riders have been in breaks the whole week and worked their asses off for this win. There's not a single team deserving a stage here more than them, regardless of who owns their sponsor.
Chapeau to Vacek (who proves to be a much better rider compared to his brother) and his teammates.

This, Mathias Vacek was also inside the top 10 during the first half of the TT, the guy's pretty strong.

 

[BlueRoads]

If one thinks this topic is too controvers or not important enough at the moment... I would rather be banned from the forum forever if it should hold up these rules.

 

[Volderke]

I wouldn't mind if Gazprom sponsored every single team in cycling... This way, I know my gas bills is money well-spent!

 

[Ricco']

What a shame. A team who never wins anything of relevance has to win now of all days. When they shouldn't have even a valid license from UCI in place anymore.

 

[yaco]

If one thinks this topic is too controvers or not important enough at the moment... I would rather be banned from the forum forever if it should hold up these rules.

We have specific sub-forums to discuss these issues - It's a bit like we have the Clinic.

 

[greyclouds]

We have specific sub-forums to discuss these issues - It's a bit like we have the Clinic.

War, in any place, is NOT like the Clinic. I'm going to leave this here and not argue anymore with you. Mods, please delete if need be.

 

[BlueRoads]

We have specific sub-forums to discuss these issues - It's a bit like we have the Clinic.

What's wrong with you?

 

[yaco]

BEX will be disappointed in how they only failed to deliver Groenewegen to one sprint final in four attempts - He was fast enough to win a stage - A missed opportunity for the team.

 

[Escarabajo]

Not in the Tour anyway !

You are relentless. The Tour is different now. Nothing compared to the TT and hard mountains of the past. I am not what you are talking about.

 

[jmdirt]

I love it when the winner comes from a break! I really like it when its the first win for a young racer!

 

[Netserk]

Pleasant to watch a mostly symbolic and peaceful fight on the roads. Compartmentalisation has its benefits.

 

[RedheadDane]

I just think it's important to keep things separate.
The riders on Gazprom have nothing to do with the situation in Ukraine, so why should they - as long as they have a team - not be allowed to race, and potentially win?
Of course, it's entirely possible that Gazprom-the-company ends up getting to many sanctions the team folds, but until then I see no reason they shouldn't race; I'm certainly not gonna hold it against a 19-year-old Czech guy.

We have specific sub-forums to discuss these issues - It's a bit like we have the Clinic.

No we don't. Political discussions is banned everywhere on the forum.

 

[CyclistAbi]

The problem is we rate cycling rather high. Then again what is ongoing now tops that by far. Hence cycling will be tainted by it if we like it or not.

 

[Ricco']

The riders on Gazprom have nothing to do with the situation in Ukraine, so why should they - as long as they have a team - not be allowed to race, and potentially win?

Because cycling sponsorship is a way to promote brands, countries or regimes and to spread their image through the world.

Gazprom is not just one russian company in an ocean of millions of others, is a company owned by more than 50% by the russian state and with strong ties to the russian regime and leader. Their CEO is vice-minister russian for energy and several executives from the company (and the company itself) are on the lists of sanctions being known.

A company can't do business relations because of sanctions but can have an active media presence in the top tiers of world sports whitewashing the actions of their owners?

 

[Cookster15]

Sadly I came here to forget about global events but it is bigger than all of us.

We have specific sub-forums to discuss these issues - It's a bit like we have the Clinic.

There is no sub forum for discussing the "P" word. But reading these comments made me look up Gazprom - now I completely understand why the discussion. Might be best to leave it to the mods.

 

[AlfaLum]

Because cycling sponsorship is a way to promote brands, countries or regimes and to spread their image through the world.

Gazprom is not just one russian company in an ocean of millions of others, is a company owned by more than 50% by the russian state and with strong ties to the russian regime and leader. Their CEO is vice-minister russian for energy and several executives from the company (and the company itself) are on the lists of sanctions being known.

A company can't do business relations because of sanctions but can have an active media presence in the top tiers of world sports whitewashing the actions of their owners?

Exactly. There couldn’t be much more of a relation between a company and a state as is the case with Gazprom.

To see a team with such a shirt winning just 30 hours after a regime that is so heavily related to this sponsor decided to attack another country over the head of so many innocent people is just utterly disappointing.

 

[RedheadDane]

Gazprom is not just one russian company in an ocean of millions of others, is a company owned by more than 50% by the russian state and with strong ties to the russian regime and leader. Their CEO is vice-minister russian for energy and several executives from the company (and the company itself) are on the lists of sanctions being known.

And none of that is the riders' fault. You're basically saying these people should be unemployed because of something way out of their control.
But let's say Gazprom-the-company finds themselves unable to fund a cycling team, or UCI says that the sponsor should not be allowed to continue in the sport, but the team is able to find enough funding to still continue, either with a new sponsor, or just under the 'Rusvelo' name. Or the team just decided that riding under the 'Gazprom' name would not be a good idea these days, but of course not having been able to change kit overnight. Would that be okay? Would they need to transfer their license to another nationality?

Again; I will not hold the situation in Ukraine against a 19-year-old Czech guy! I won't even hold it against his Russian teammates, because - for all I know - they're against the war too.

 

[Ricco']

And none of that is the riders' fault. You're basically saying these people should be unemployed because of something way out of their control.
But let's say Gazprom-the-company finds themselves unable to fund a cycling team, or UCI says that the sponsor should not be allowed to continue in the sport, but the team is able to find enough funding to still continue, either with a new sponsor, or just under the 'Rusvelo' name. Would that be okay? Would they need to transfer their license to another nationality?

Yes, it's the riders fault to choose their employers, as in any job. When you are in the job market, you don't mind going to ethically dubious employers or with a questionable track record in their relation with society/environment/working or human rights? It's a factor involved in job choosing. Some people pay more relevance to that, others don't. For the ones who choose to go ahead, they need to be aware of the risk they carry if something goes bad.

And to be clear, the riders don't have any fault in this. But the UCI should have the power to intervene, force the team (which I believe has a strong italian structure already built) to ditch the sponsors if they want to ride. Isn't that what was done with Unibet.com for less important reasons?

Or in F1, when tobacco or alcohol brands are prohibited from showing their brands in some venues.

 

[BlueRoads]

Exactly. There couldn’t be much more of a relation between a company and a state as is the case with Gazprom.

To see a team with such a shirt winning just 30 hours after a regime that is so heavily related to this sponsor decided to attack another country over the head of so many innocent people is just utterly disappointing.

On the other hand it doesn't really matter, does it? Putin just attacks, tells ridiculous stories that can't convince anybody anymore who isn't dead-set on believing them, limits social media now and of course arrests people like he wants to. No whitewashing needed anymore when you got to that point. It's now just the forces of military and economy, I don't know why they even bother to do any propaganda anymore.
In any case, the Gazprom advertising belonged to lobbyism that helped to keep people quiet against the Russian government, I don't think that's of any use anymore. Maybe you could say in Russia itself, but I don't think many Russians care about a stage win of a second division cycling team in the UAE tour.