US prosecutors drop case against Armstrong/USPS

[mewmewmew13]

It's true!

The Armstrong Curling Club

Edit:
OMG, it gets worse!
http://www.livestrong.com/thedailyplate/fitness/exercise/curling/

Much worse...
http://www.livestrong.com/article/554793-how-to-improve-your-curling-slide/

hehe..
slowly taking over the world
one age group at a time

 

[LarryBudMelman]

clearly it was never about whether Armstrong doped, etc, but how, everyone inside the sport knew it, its interesting how this got translated into a real legal investigation. Sometimes there is a disjunction between what counts as legal evidence and what humans actually do. That being said, I don't give a hoot whether Armstrong doped or not, whether he's a good person or not. Whether he or doping is good for pro cycling, really, who cares. His organization has raised hundreds of millions of dollars for cancer research. This is the real story and not what happens in a relatively rarefied and brutal sport of cycling (yes, I have participated at relatively high levels in said brutal sport).

Were you doping? Are you doping? Did you do your research?

Your facts are incorrect. Neither Armstrong nor his foundation, nor any of that stuff, raises money for cancer research. Look it up. The foundation is all about awareness--and increasing the value of the Livestrong brand.

Evidently he wasn't aware.

 

[LarryBudMelman]

108 signatures (still) on the "overwhelming evidence" petition. Do only 108 people want the President to violate the secrecy of the Grand Jury?

From "Certain Indictment" to "Improper Influence;" What will the "Talking Points" morph into next? Is Fabiani still manipulating threads in the Clinic?

This thread sure has been fun!

I'm not sitting on a fence! Armstrong's a scum doper, no better than any of the zillion other scum doper cheats in the pro peloton.

The lowest form of scum!

My personal opinion is that Armstrong is a loathsome creature (lower than Papp or Landis or even Rasmussen). I'd like to see an indictment that requires proof that he was a doper

Dude, even YOU know that Armstrong is a loathsome creature. Why would you think he's above criminality?

The fact that there's only 109 signatures shows how effective his PR campaign has been.

People with a sense of right and wrong are dismayed.

You are rejoicing!

 

[Pazuzu]

Perhaps if he came out with it all we could move on.

Thats what we teach our kids isn't it?

That's exactly what has to happen in order to allow things to move on. Mark McGuire, after years of denials, finally came clean and admitted what the rest of us already knew... and guess what? People forgave him and he's been able to move past the doping controversy that had been hanging from him like and albatross. Lance can do the same thing. Man up and admit it. Say he did it in order to compete with other dopers/PED users (which wouldn't be untrue). Apologize for misleading people and dedicate himself to cleaning up the sport so today's riders don't find themselves in the terrible situation of either having to dope or fall out of contention. Were Lance to undertake this courage act, the sport of biking would be immasuabley better for it and ultimately, so would Lance.

Lance, it's not too late to redeem yourself.

 

[MarkvW]

119 Have Signed the Extreme Hater Referendum

119 people have signed the "overwhelming evidence" petition seeking to override grand jury secrecy! 24,881 to go!

 

[jackwolf]

I really don't see the Republicans pushing the issue unless a very damaging smoking gun emerges...like emails that show something improper going on between the Armstrong camp and somebody high in the Department of Justice, or something like that. It's just not worth it politically to pursue Armstrong. Going after the cancer fighter is not going to score points with the electorate and continuing a costly prosecution of a sports figure isn't going to resonate with Republican voters concerned with financial austerity. Something will have to come out that directly points to serious corruption in the Obama administration, otherwise it's not worth making an issue.

The cancer fighter myth is 50% debunked. A couple of articles more and a bit of airtime and it could be dead and even exposed as the scam it is. I agree with you the difficult part would be to link the whole thing to corruption in the Obama administration. They could always blame it on Birotte. If there's enough pressure, they would have to re-open the case, though. The Republicans want either to expose the corruption or a guilty verdict right before the election. It's not about justice any more; it's all political. I don't know what the outcome will be, but I'm pretty sure this is not the end of it.

 

[DirtyWorks]

.... His organization has raised hundreds of millions of dollars for cancer research. This is the real story ....

EXCEPT, that's not story. The simple fact of the matter is they do not fund cancer research. You must not have been paying attention in the Livestrong orientation?

I feel like I've written this post before. A little help: you should dig through some of the older threads and try to spin something new up.

 

[DirtyWorks]

If there's enough pressure, they would have to re-open the case, though. The Republicans want either to expose the corruption or a guilty verdict right before the election. It's not about justice any more; it's all political. I don't know what the outcome will be, but I'm pretty sure this is not the end of it.

The problem here is this story doesn't fit the Red Team model. Red team wants the same luxury to end cases when Fabiani calls them, so I don't see how one of the Red Team characters would turn it into an election issue. Finally, the utter failure to capitalize on the Solyndra story is an important example of how the Red Team just plain messes up a slow-pitch.

With Fabiani is still on retainer, I would be pleased to see some action, but not likely.

 

[DirtyWorks]

That's exactly what has to happen in order to allow things to move on. Mark McGuire, after years of denials, finally came clean and admitted what the rest of us already knew... and guess what? People forgave him and he's been able to move past the doping controversy....

Except McGuire wasn't *requiring* his teammates to dope.
Except McGuire wasn't buying the dope for his entire team for a period of years.
Except McGuire wasn't sponsored by a Federal agency.
McGuire is Baseball, a sport that has LOADS of money to spend to manage their reputation. Cycling already has a well-deserved doping reputation and is classified as a very minor sport in the U.S. Some cycling dude doping in france and gets caught is just a collective American shrug.

 

[DirtyWorks]

119 people have signed the "overwhelming evidence" petition seeking to override grand jury secrecy! 24,881 to go!

There you go rewriting the facts. That sorry excuse for a petition only wants an explanation. "Because we said so.." pretty much covers it.

 

[MarkvW]

There you go rewriting the facts. That sorry excuse for a petition only wants an explanation. "Because we said so.." pretty much covers it.

The petition says "overwhelming evidence." There has been no demonstration of overwhelming evidence. The petition also says that there is an "appearance of collusion." Those two statements are unsupportable.

 

[frenchfry]

It's true!

The Armstrong Curling Club

Edit:
OMG, it gets worse!
http://www.livestrong.com/thedailyplate/fitness/exercise/curling/

Much worse...
http://www.livestrong.com/article/554793-how-to-improve-your-curling-slide/

My parents live just a few km from Armstrong. Nice town, great cheese. Probably only a matter of time though before Live$trong lawyers get on them to change the name.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4BTjNBDbkg

Curling is a great "sport", though much maligned by those who don't know it. It isn't easy not to spill your beer while sliding down the ice.

 

[JRTinMA]

It is clear by now that many witness, investigators, and prosecutors were shocked that evidence was ignored and the case was shelved. If you feel the same I suggest checking this link.

https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitio...-credible-evidence-crime-given-under/dBnnkGDr

Don't worry RR there is always a slow down on these things right after the HUGE surge on day 1 and 2. I hear we should expect a big surge again on Tuesday.

 

[JRTinMA]

What is obvious is that the investigation was slammed shut due to politics.

<snipped for brevity>

THAT is what gets to me.

You give the clinic way to much credit. If you really look at what is said about the clinic in publications it comes with a hug and a punch. Nobody is taking this place serious, and its pretty much lost any respect it had remaining with the decisions of the last few weeks. CN should be having the discussion if its time to turn out the lights.

 

[MarkvW]

Extreme Hater Referendum at 120 Signatures

120 people have signed the petition that asserts overwhelming evidence of Armstrong's guilt and the appearance of collusion. Looks like the extreme haters need to create more 'awareness' of their petition! Maybe 'Outside' can write an article publicizing it? Perhaps another Tyler-Lance meeting at an 'Outside' event?

At any event, President Obama cannot explain the charging decision without discussing the admissible evidence and he cannot discuss the admissible evidence without violating GJ secrecy.

 

[Race Radio]

Don't worry RR there is always a slow down on these things right after the HUGE surge on day 1 and 2. I hear we should expect a big surge again on Tuesday.

It is not my petition, as I mentioned it was sent to me by a person burned by the investigation.

I would not expect many signatures but some might see it as a way to voice their frustration with a flawed process.

 

[Cloxxki]

It is not my petition, as I mentioned it was sent to me by a person burned by the investigation.

I would not expect many signatures but some might see it as a way to voice their frustration with a flawed process.

Kindly tweet it a few times (I did once), you might send it viral ;-)

Let's come up with a catchy hash tag?

 

[LarryBudMelman]

You give the clinic way to much credit. If you really look at what is said about the clinic in publications it comes with a hug and a punch. Nobody is taking this place serious, and its pretty much lost any respect it had remaining with the decisions of the last few weeks. CN should be having the discussion if its time to turn out the lights.

Yeah, because doping is no longer an issue in sports.

One of the reasons Armstrong's doping got a collective shrug of the shoulders is because the solution to everything for everybody in life is now a pill.

BTW, it looks like GL is #122.. Good for him!

 

[LarryBudMelman]

It is not my petition, as I mentioned it was sent to me by a person burned by the investigation.

I would not expect many signatures but some might see it as a way to voice their frustration with a flawed process.

I expect guys behind curtains and with their voices altered, unnamed sources, will voice their frustrations by dropping some major bombs on the pharmstrong camp...

 

[JRTinMA]

I would still laugh at them. Andy wins the 2010 Tour, not 2011. Bert will appear later this year, his suspension ends before the Vuelta.

Good ‘ol hog, still batting .500 on his better days.

Stephens, I respect your posts, and agree with some of the points you make, but I’m just curious. Are you content with the way things have worked out? That Tyler, Floyd and now Contador have had their careers destroyed or severely damaged for doing nothing more than LA did? Does the arbitrary nature (to give LA the benefit of doubt) of who gets caught and who doesn’t not bother you in the slightest?

I ask the same question of JRTinMA and other LA defenders here. Polish, I know, is very good with inequality before the law. It doesn’t bother him in the slightest that LA got away the same stuff that is destroying not only careers but in some cases even lives.

I was never an LA defender, thats another clinic myth. Truth is, I never had much in the game other than trolling the trolls but I gave that up. Cycling is ripe with fraud; the riders, the governing bodies, the drugs, the payoffs and the coverups. The only difference between Indurain and LA is humility.

Every person in this whole mess made a personal choice to cheat, dope or help somebody dope. They are responsible for their own decisions, I just choose to care about real inequity and injustice against people not empowered to decide. What goes on in cycling is a joke and yet I choose to love it for what it means to me. Getting muddy in the fall.

 

[JRTinMA]

Kindly tweet it a few times (I did once), you might send it viral ;-)

Let's come up with a catchy hash tag?

You can blame Whitney Houston, she ruined any chance this had. Americans are fickle...look a balloon!

 

[BotanyBay]

I view internet petitions as a ChickenS*** way to voice disdain. 45 years ago, when a generation was upset about something in particular, they got up off their posteriors and took to the streets. Today, we just lob virtual tennis balls over the virtual wall. Yielding only "virtual disdain". We don't even have the guts to call people on the phone anymore (instead preferring the "drive-by-shooting" technique of the text message). We couldn't possibly be bothered to slap a stamp on an actual letter.

What's Facebook? A way to deal with your friends without actually having to deal with them. A way to convince yourself that you've got all of these really great connected/re-connected friendships, when in reality, they're pretty shallow. Go through your friends list. Ask yourself if you'd actually call them on the phone and have a half-hour conversation with them after work today. Would you? Could you? How many people on that list would have check-marks next to their name? Many? Less than 10?

A physical letter (or a physical "presence") is much harder to ignore than a virtual bucket filled with virtual outrage. A virtual bucket is quickly dispensed with the virtual fire-hose of the "delete key".

Intimate communication works much better than virtual. If you communicate virtually, you're not really communicating. You're just rationalizing.

The reason I don't do internet petitions is because it's just a farcical method of expressing a group's dislike of a situation. Internet millions are non-existent. It'll buy you about as much mileage as "Chocolate Rain" buys a music career.

And yes, I realize that I'm going to get ripped on this one.

 

[Oldman]

I view internet petitions as a ChickenS*** way to voice disdain. 45 years ago, when a generation was upset about something in particular, they got up off their posteriors and took to the streets. Today, we just lob virtual tennis balls over the virtual wall. Yielding only "virtual disdain". We don't even have the guts to call people on the phone anymore (instead preferring the "drive-by-shooting" technique of the text message). We couldn't possibly be bothered to slap a stamp on an actual letter.

What's Facebook? A way to deal with your friends without actually having to deal with them. A way to convince yourself that you've got all of these really great connected/re-connected friendships, when in reality, they're pretty shallow. Go through your friends list. Ask yourself if you'd actually call them on the phone and have a half-hour conversation with them after work today. Would you? Could you? How many people on that list would have check-marks next to their name? Many? Less than 10?

A physical letter (or a physical "presence") is much harder to ignore than a virtual bucket filled with virtual outrage. A virtual bucket is quickly dispensed with the virtual fire-hose of the "delete key".

Intimate communication works much better than virtual. If you communicate virtually, you're not really communicating. You're just rationalizing.

The reason I don't do internet petitions is because it's just a farcical method of expressing a group's dislike of a situation. Internet millions are non-existent. It'll buy you about as much mileage as "Chocolate Rain" buys a music career.

And yes, I realize that I'm going to get ripped on this one.

Thank you. My wife and I discuss our relative use of "social media" and I avoid FB, etc. She has "friends and relatives" that firmly fall into your description. It is extremely boring to view the details of someone's virtual life whether it's their "epic ski run" that comes with video as opposed to actually having a life. Here in Microsoft land she had an observation: "when did so many young men grow double chins?" It is a different world from the real one.

 

[LarryBudMelman]

I view internet petitions as a ChickenS*** way to voice disdain. 45 years ago, when a generation was upset about something in particular, they got up off their posteriors and took to the streets. Today, we just lob virtual tennis balls over the virtual wall. Yielding only "virtual disdain". We don't even have the guts to call people on the phone anymore (instead preferring the "drive-by-shooting" technique of the text message). We couldn't possibly be bothered to slap a stamp on an actual letter.

What's Facebook? A way to deal with your friends without actually having to deal with them. A way to convince yourself that you've got all of these really great connected/re-connected friendships, when in reality, they're pretty shallow. Go through your friends list. Ask yourself if you'd actually call them on the phone and have a half-hour conversation with them after work today. Would you? Could you? How many people on that list would have check-marks next to their name? Many? Less than 10?

A physical letter (or a physical "presence") is much harder to ignore than a virtual bucket filled with virtual outrage. A virtual bucket is quickly dispensed with the virtual fire-hose of the "delete key".

Intimate communication works much better than virtual. If you communicate virtually, you're not really communicating. You're just rationalizing.

The reason I don't do internet petitions is because it's just a farcical method of expressing a group's dislike of a situation. Internet millions are non-existent. It'll buy you about as much mileage as "Chocolate Rain" buys a music career.

And yes, I realize that I'm going to get ripped on this one.

I concur for the most part. I signed the petition and I called about 30 people and wrote emails to about 10 more.

I think I posted LeMond signed, I might have deleted that post....

We've discussed what we think is going to happen though so we'll see if the media does their job...

Acutally if the 25k sigs were received it might enable the powers that be to do a cursory "explanation" and be done with it.

A followup big story on CBS would be much more effective.

I don't think meaningful change can happen incrementally within any system. An outside jolt is always needed.

 

[LarryBudMelman]

I was never an LA defender, thats another clinic myth. Truth is, I never had much in the game other than trolling the trolls but I gave that up. Cycling is ripe with fraud; the riders, the governing bodies, the drugs, the payoffs and the coverups. The only difference between Indurain and LA is humility.

Every person in this whole mess made a personal choice to cheat, dope or help somebody dope. They are responsible for their own decisions, I just choose to care about real inequity and injustice against people not empowered to decide. What goes on in cycling is a joke and yet I choose to love it for what it means to me. Getting muddy in the fall.

Hey troll! The word you're looking for is rife.