US prosecutors drop case against Armstrong/USPS

[DirtyWorks]

Goober, I am rapidly losing faith in your claimed insider status.

Goober's information does not corroborate to anything being published. There is no merit to his claims. I could see VeloNews publishing something Goober could use as vindication. But they did the crazy Betsy interview disguised as Wonderboy propaganda so they don't have any credibility as a legitimate media source.

 

[DirtyWorks]

No way am I drinking the corruption Kool-Aid. The Sour Grape flavor isn't my taste.

So, there was no need to hire Fabiani then. Right?

 

[Velodude]

Velodude can you please let SOCALL Scott and I have some room to post whatIF's?


Are you saying that Novitz will sue LA for monetary reasons?

Do you think Tyler and Tugboat will sue LA for monetary reasons?

Well I can not wait for those lawsuits. This is going to get very interesting.

I was going to prepare a point by point response then I noticed your "location"

PS: CN does not permit 5 or more images in a post. So I deleted one of your "eek's". Just in case I am accused of quote post tampering.

 

[MarkvW]

So, there was no need to hire Fabiani then. Right?

So, Lance Armstrong should just be expected to roll over and endure an investigation and damage to his valuable reputation. Right?

You are actually arguing that Lance's hiring Fabiani establishes federal corruption? Whatever.

 

[Anonymous]

My personal opinion is founded on a much lower burden of proof than a federal criminal case. It is also devoid of any of the careful evidentiary analysis that goes into the evaluation of a crimnal prosecution. My opinion turned rock solid with Simeoni after seeing the way that Armstrong absolutely crushed his highly-doped contenders (and even more evidence afterward). None of that is "overwhelming evidence" of a crime, but it's overwhelming enough evidence for me, a fan. I can boo the SOB, and still accept the possibility that the feds couldn't make a good enough case (and root for a good WADA/USADA hearing).

This was a two year investigation. It kept on because (obviously) the feds kept needing to investigate and get more evidence.

No way am I drinking the corruption Kool-Aid. The Sour Grape flavor isn't my taste.

So, in summary, he raced doped to the gills. He probably had to pay for the dope and I'm thinking he didn't write a check for it.... had to transport the dope from locale to locale... probably by plane and probably across international borders.

Yeah, the Feds probably could not make much of a case

Lessee, Holder and Breuer were both partners in the same firm before their current gigs... Lehane, Fabiani et, al... all the things you already know....

You can put the doping aspect together by virtue of LA's behavior towards Simeoni and his demolition of 'highly doped contenders' and yet you cannot see any possibility of Birotte's decision being something other than lilly-white. Interesting to say the least

But you are probably right. Nothing to the corruption angle. Zip, zilch, nada, nut-in.

 

[Anonymous]

So, Lance Armstrong should just be expected to roll over and endure an investigation and damage to his valuable reputation. Right?

Sure, defend away.

Could have hired many, many other lawyers. Curious as to why he chose the 'connected' ones? I mean since he's innocent and all.

 

[skippy]

This forum is starting to remind me of the 1950’s , when the working women in the factory towns, would lean on their fences yakking to each other , whilst their weekly washing was flapping on the backyard clothes line .


ee mabel did you see so n so walking down ta street yes’day wiv that ol coot , reminds me of her cuzin .
Nah that wer her new fancy boy !

Ooh luv got to get on , the rent man will be here shortly for the xmas club money . Hope the mine keeps busy so we can put a bit aside for a knees up !

Guess the 21st century equivalent of the garden fence is the forum ?

Wonder if the 120+ on that “ desperate dan petition “ are reconsidering , maybe bloomsberg will help them ? In the “ Reader Discussion section there is the offer “ Sponsored Link , buy a link “! maybe grease the pole !

Wonder if Juan Pelota should sign on “ pour l’encouragement des autres “! I am sure there would be some of his 3M + followers seeking to see him cleared ? Whole thing has become such a yawn that I doubt Lance bothers to visit and no longer wastes time speculating on the IP’s of his hysterical fan club . The mud thrown lately is of such poor value I doubt the most thin skinned of us would waste time or money seeking retribution

BTW , moderators i don't appreciate having to do several rounds ofthe houses to post a comment ! Logging in once used to be enough !
Not only do the " Ads now consume a Mb each page refresh but loadinga page is about 3 times more with the latest ads ! Low b/band of 16its/sec adds to the difficulties !

 

[Polish]

But you are probably right. Nothing to the corruption angle. Zip, zilch, nada, nut-in.

Agree that the corruption angle is nonsense.

But if there WAS any corruption, the Feds would come out looking very bad.
A heck of a lot worse than HWMNBN.
Lance would not be the one going to jail yikes.

 

[Race Radio]

Does the "End" of this investigation mean Johan is allowed back in the US?

Funny how despite this being "Over 9 months ago" Johan still missed California, Utah, Colorado. All super important races for their sponsor......or did the "Over" not apply to The Hog?

 

[MarkvW]

So, in summary, he raced doped to the gills. He probably had to pay for the dope and I'm thinking he didn't write a check for it.... had to transport the dope from locale to locale... probably by plane and probably across international borders.

Yeah, the Feds probably could not make much of a case

Lessee, Holder and Breuer were both partners in the same firm before their current gigs... Lehane, Fabiani et, al... all the things you already know....

You can put the doping aspect together by virtue of LA's behavior towards Simeoni and his demolition of 'highly doped contenders' and yet you cannot see any possibility of Birotte's decision being something other than lilly-white. Interesting to say the least

But you are probably right. Nothing to the corruption angle. Zip, zilch, nada, nut-in.

If you could prove a case with thoughtless snarky remarks, Armstrong would be languishing in prison right now.

 

[LarryBudMelman]

You figured?

I figured that was your source for "looked into". But this has no indication of whether they looked or are still looking. And this article you reference is based on something Armstrong's lawyer said.

How's that? I didn't know it was my source until I did a google search. I waste as little time on you as possible.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

If you could prove a case with thoughtless snarky remarks, Armstrong would be languishing in prison right now.

But Mark, how are you now sure that Armstrong was the target?
I thought you said we could not know he was a target or if he was he was one of a number of targets....

I think its fair to say that LA will be a 'target' of USADA.

 

[Anonymous]

If you could prove a case with thoughtless snarky remarks, Armstrong would be languishing in prison right now.

I guessing the Feds had a fair amount more than thoughtless and snarky remarks. I'm guess they had a strong case which is what puzzles me about your position.

With the quality of your legal mind I'd expect you to be more curious. Too much to hope for I suppose.

 

[MarkvW]

Agree that the corruption angle is nonsense.

But if there WAS any corruption, the Feds would come out looking very bad.
A heck of a lot worse than HWMNBN.
Lance would not be the one going to jail yikes.

The "overwhelming evidence of crime" myth depends on the "federal corruption" myth. It's myth stacking. Mutual myth reinforcement.

"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."

 

[Race Radio]

The "overwhelming evidence of crime" myth depends on the "federal corruption" myth. It's myth stacking. Mutual myth reinforcement.

"This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."

Is anyone arguing there was corruption? I don't think there was anything illegal in Armstrong hiring someone to lobby on his behalf. This is America, that is how things are done.

 

[MarkvW]

I guessing the Feds had a fair amount more than thoughtless and snarky remarks. I'm guess they had a strong case which is what puzzles me about your position.

With the quality of your legal mind I'd expect you to be more curious. Too much to hope for I suppose.

I've no doubt that parts of their cases were very strong, like the parts that relate to doping, but all it takes is one little weak spot on one element, and the whole house of cards goes down. Like the statute of limitations, like predicate offenses, like admissible statements made in furtherance of a conspiracy . . ..

You're suggesting corruption based upon a guess that the feds had a strong case. That means that you're guessing that the feds are corrupt. I don't want to make that guess.

 

[MarkvW]

Is anyone arguing there was corruption? I don't think there was anything illegal in Armstrong hiring someone to lobby on his behalf. This is America, that is how things are done.

If you believe that Birotte's decision was an honest one, then why are you attacking it? You have no access to the evidence gathered. What's your legal basis for concluding that his considered legal opinion was wrong?

 

[MarkvW]

But Mark, how are you now sure that Armstrong was the target?
I thought you said we could not know he was a target or if he was he was one of a number of targets....

I think its fair to say that LA will be a 'target' of USADA.

Putting words in my mouth again, Maserati? Been there; done that. Still don't know if he was a target. Have a wonderful day!

 

[Race Radio]

If you believe that Birotte's decision was an honest one, then why are you attacking it? You have no access to the evidence gathered. What's your legal basis for concluding that his considered legal opinion was wrong?

I am sure you know there is a difference between corruption and lobbying. I don't think he or Breuer did anything illegal. They just chose to listen to their buddies not their investigators/Prosecutors.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Putting words in my mouth again, Maserati? Been there; done that. Still don't know if he was a target. Have a wonderful day!

I am having a great day, thank you. Which words did I "put in your mouth"?

 

[MarkvW]

I am sure you know there is a difference between corruption and lobbying. I don't think he or Breuer did anything illegal. They just chose to listen to their buddies not their investigators/Prosecutors.

You've just described a corrupt act. I don't think you could find any prosecutor in the US who would disagree.

 

[MarkvW]

I am having a great day, thank you. Which words did I "put in your mouth"?

Sorry. Not going into the Maserati vortex today.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Sorry. Not going into the Maserati vortex today.

So, I didn't put any words in your mouth.
Thank you.

 

[Anonymous]

I've no doubt that parts of their cases were very strong, like the parts that relate to doping, but all it takes is one little weak spot on one element, and the whole house of cards goes down. Like the statute of limitations, like predicate offenses, like admissible statements made in furtherance of a conspiracy . . ..

You're suggesting corruption based upon a guess that the feds had a strong case. That means that you're guessing that the feds are corrupt. I don't want to make that guess.

Hmmm, so which part of there case, in your opinion, was weak?

That means that you're guessing that the feds are corrupt.

Oh I don't think it's too awfully far-fetched. Given the amount of stink around this whole sordid affair I'm guessing it's the most likely possibility. Much more likely than any case weakness you might be able to think of.

After the dust settles watch for Birotte to get either a big promotion at DOJ or an even more lucrative offer from a law firm (Covington??) with ties to Breuer/Holder.

 

[MarkvW]

Hmmm, so which part of there case, in your opinion, was weak?

The grand jury proceedings are secret.

And there's no way I'm going to get in a discussion in this forum over speculative facts. I've been accused of being a Livestrong fanboy enough.

And I don't think there's as much of a stink as you think. The Extreme Hater Referendum is still at 129 signatures.