Teams & Riders Vincenzo Nibali discussion thread

[Oliver]

What a win! Next: Liege!

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

He has at this point displaced Simon Gerrans as the greatest overperformer of his physical talent in the peloton. He is very good at a lot of things, but is not in the top half dozen riders at anything, including descending. In this age of specialists, he really shouldn’t be able to win as much as he has. Yet look at his palmares. One of the most cunning and canny riders we’ve seen in modern cycling. There’s something truly admirable about that.

 

[Rollthedice]

Re: Re:

good to have squalo around
i really hope he can win liege and then focus on ronde and roubaix after this year.

He never got enough credit really

He keeps getting in smaller exclusive clubs. With two different monuments and all three GTs won he joins Gimondi, Merckx and Hinault.

 

[Carols]

OMFG!!! I just got home an hour ago and watched the final 40KM of MSR! What a cycling God our Nibs has turned into! 4 GTs, 3 Monuments.

Anyone who continues to underestimate Nibali is sadly mistaken. By the time he retires he will be a Legend!

 

[AnatoleNovak]

Re: Re:

Nibali greatest italian rider after Coppi and Bartali?

No.
Gimondi has a way more impressive palmares. Which he gained against Merckx, De Vlaeminck, Zoetemelk, Poulidor, Fuente, an ageing Van Looy and Anquetil, a young Hinault,...

The level in today's peloton is much higher now than in the '70s and there is also a lot more specialization today which makes it very hard to have a palmares as varied as Nibali.

Nibali would destroy Gimondi if they raced together in their prime.

As for palmares:

- They both won 5 (or 4) GTs (Gimondi got the '69 Giro gifted to him, Nibali will most likey get the 2017 Vuelta win)
- Gimondi won 4 Monuments and Nibali won 3 (but his career isn't over yet)
- Gimondi also won the WC

Comparisons between different eras are useless but Girardengo and Binda were no slouch in their time.

 

[Leinster]

Re: Re:

The comparison with Kelly is nonsense. Nibali is a very succesful GT rider who has won and podiumed one day races throughout his ongoing career and this includes one monument won two times. Kelly was a very successful one day and shorter stage races rider who also has won one GT. A more suitable comparison would be with Felice Gimondi. Vincenzo needs to win in Innsbruck bag another GT and a couple of monuments and they are even. It's doable.

A much more realistic comparison! Nibali is no Kelly and Kelly is no Nibali!

So Nibbles is the first to win the Lombardia/MSR "double" (ie, end of one season, beginning of next) since, ummm, Kelly in '91/'92.

 

[Blanco]

OMFG!!! I just got home an hour ago and watched the final 40KM of MSR! What a cycling God our Nibs has turned into! 4 GTs, 3 Monuments.

Anyone you continues to underestimate Nibali is sadly mistaken. By the time he retires he will be a Legend!

I think he's already a legend. One of the handful of very best Italian riders after Coppi and Bartali. And one of the two legends of the current peloton.

 

[Nirvana]

Re: Re:

Nibali greatest italian rider after Coppi and Bartali?

Oh I don't know, maybe indeed.
Gimondi was great. Moser also. Bettini phenomenal. I guess Shark is easily in this company, and he might go above them...

His palmares resembles Gimondi the most.

But still, you can't compare riders of different generations like that.

Moser and Saronni had a more various skillset and way bigger (especially Moser) palmares.
I'd rate them higher than both Nibali and Gimondi.

And don't forget Fiorenzo Magni that was capable to beat Coppi and Bartali and also Gaul in GTs but was also one of the strongest cobbles riders and the only one who won Ronde three times in a row.

 

[Carols]

OMFG!!! I just got home an hour ago and watched the final 40KM of MSR! What a cycling God our Nibs has turned into! 4 GTs, 3 Monuments.

Anyone you continues to underestimate Nibali is sadly mistaken. By the time he retires he will be a Legend!

I think he's already a legend. One of the handful of very best Italian riders after Coppi and Bartali. And one of the two legends of the current peloton.

I'm Old School, I saw Anquetil racing live. I don't toss around Legend easily. There are no current Legends riding right now, not yet, at least IMO. But Nibali is the only one getting close to that status!

 

[Carols]

Re: Re:

The comparison with Kelly is nonsense. Nibali is a very succesful GT rider who has won and podiumed one day races throughout his ongoing career and this includes one monument won two times. Kelly was a very successful one day and shorter stage races rider who also has won one GT. A more suitable comparison would be with Felice Gimondi. Vincenzo needs to win in Innsbruck bag another GT and a couple of monuments and they are even. It's doable.

A much more realistic comparison! Nibali is no Kelly and Kelly is no Nibali!

So Nibbles is the first to win the Lombardia/MSR "double" (ie, end of one season, beginning of next) since, ummm, Kelly in '91/'92.

Cool . Still Kelly is No Nibali .

 

[ColonelKidneyBeans]

Re: Re:

What a rider. He better go all the way in Liege now, too.

He usually races Liege, but remember that's Valverde's playground.

It has only been Valverde's playground since riders stopped making serious early moves. That might change again with Nibali this year.

Exactly, a great Nibali could make it super interesting and very hard for Valverde to win! I get why he wants to race Pais Vasco, but he is a very mediocre one week stage racer at this point, I'd really prefer him to prioritise Flanders over Pais Vasco.

I think that he is a mediocre weeklong stageracer at this point because of the way he treats those races as pure preparation, and often show at those with lackluster form and no big motivation to go for the win, because he knows he doesn't have what it takes at that point of time, but right now he actually is on pretty good form so he could nab a good result, even if Pais Vasco is probably the race which suits him the less.
As for this victory, i'm speechless, i always thought that if someone could pull this of, it would be him, but i also didn't think he would be able to, the last 5km were stressful, i don't remember anything the commentators said :lol:

 

[SafeBet]

I honestly believe his problem in one week races is not lack of form (not always at least). He treats those races as a high level training and I'm convinced he decides not to go over threshold. I can't believe he was as strong as he was today while not being able to top10 Tirreno just a few days ago. Not possible, sorry.

 

[Eli]

OMFG!!! I just got home an hour ago and watched the final 40KM of MSR! What a cycling God our Nibs has turned into! 4 GTs, 3 Monuments.

Anyone you continues to underestimate Nibali is sadly mistaken. By the time he retires he will be a Legend!

I think he's already a legend. One of the handful of very best Italian riders after Coppi and Bartali. And one of the two legends of the current peloton.

I'm Old School, I saw Anquetil racing live. I don't toss around Legend easily. There are no current Legends riding right now, not yet, at least IMO. But Nibali is the only one getting close to that status!

Oh wooow..How about Valverde?

 

[Rollthedice]

Juat realized that there's a distinct possibility he might end up with three monuments this year.

 

[Sestriere]

Re:

Juat realized that there's a distinct possibility he might end up with three monuments this year.

Do we already know something about the Lombardia route? Will they alternate back to Bergamo this year and, if so, will it be the finish that Chaves won on? I'd imagine he would be favourite there (with the Como finish he'd be anyway...)

 

[Ivan_Basso_77]

Today once again we saw why Vincenzo is a great and likeable rider. An amazing display. Next objective - Liege. Valverde'd better be ready.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

Juat realized that there's a distinct possibility he might end up with three monuments this year.

Do we already know something about the Lombardia route? Will they alternate back to Bergamo this year and, if so, will it be the finish that Chaves won on? I'd imagine he would be favourite there (with the Como finish he'd be anyway...)

I haven't heard what Lombardia's route is this year.

Also we all know Valverde is the favorite for LBL.

 

[ColonelKidneyBeans]

Re:

I honestly believe his problem in one week races is not lack of form (not always at least). He treats those races as a high level training and I'm convinced he decides not to go over threshold. I can't believe he was as strong as he was today while not being able to top10 Tirreno just a few days ago. Not possible, sorry.

Tirreno this year was a special case i believe, he was basically screwed for GC after the TTT, basically i think he went full gas on the murito to assess his form (he did well there by his standards), followed on the MTF and didn't go over threshold during the last KM like you said and then called it a day. But i think he should try a bit more in weeklong stage races, adding a few more would do wonder to his palmares, even if those races are not as prestigious as they used to be IMHO. And who knows, if he does well there, at liege/flanders/lombardia and the tour he might have a shot at world n°1 this year, that would be nice too (i'm half kidding, valverde will be very hard to beat like every year)

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Juat realized that there's a distinct possibility he might end up with three monuments this year.

Do we already know something about the Lombardia route? Will they alternate back to Bergamo this year and, if so, will it be the finish that Chaves won on? I'd imagine he would be favourite there (with the Como finish he'd be anyway...)

I haven't heard what Lombardia's route is this year.

Also we all know Valverde is the favorite for LBL.

We won't know the favorite until the weather report comes out

Nah but LBL with 7 man teams will be a lot more interesting for starters.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

Juat realized that there's a distinct possibility he might end up with three monuments this year.

Do we already know something about the Lombardia route? Will they alternate back to Bergamo this year and, if so, will it be the finish that Chaves won on? I'd imagine he would be favourite there (with the Como finish he'd be anyway...)

I haven't heard what Lombardia's route is this year.

Also we all know Valverde is the favorite for LBL.

We won't know the favorite until the weather report comes out

Nah but LBL with 7 man teams will be a lot more interesting for starters.

LOL, ok, you have a point about the weather forecast.

 

[SafeBet]

BTW why are you guys convinced he will ride Pais Vasco? It's been years since the last time he did this race and I don't really see a point in riding it.

 

[Rollthedice]

Re: Re:

Juat realized that there's a distinct possibility he might end up with three monuments this year.

Do we already know something about the Lombardia route? Will they alternate back to Bergamo this year and, if so, will it be the finish that Chaves won on? I'd imagine he would be favourite there (with the Como finish he'd be anyway...)

I haven't heard what Lombardia's route is this year.

Also we all know Valverde is the favorite for LBL.

I highly doubt that an Italian race organizer will change a route on which an Italian rider won it two times recently. As for LBL, sure Valverde is the favorite but he will have to ride for the first time against a Nibali who actually targets the race and who will be supported by a strong team this time. Add some rain, an early attack by the likes of Gilbert, Bardet or Wellens and Valverde will have his hands full.

 

[Carols]

OMFG!!! I just got home an hour ago and watched the final 40KM of MSR! What a cycling God our Nibs has turned into! 4 GTs, 3 Monuments.

Anyone you continues to underestimate Nibali is sadly mistaken. By the time he retires he will be a Legend!

I think he's already a legend. One of the handful of very best Italian riders after Coppi and Bartali. And one of the two legends of the current peloton.

I'm Old School, I saw Anquetil racing live. I don't toss around Legend easily. There are no current Legends riding right now, not yet, at least IMO. But Nibali is the only one getting close to that status!

Oh wooow..How about Valverde?

What about him? Great rider; Legend Not. But his story isn't done yet.

 

[ColonelKidneyBeans]

Re:

He has at this point displaced Simon Gerrans as the greatest overperformer of his physical talent in the peloton. He is very good at a lot of things, but is not in the top half dozen riders at anything, including descending. In this age of specialists, he really shouldn’t be able to win as much as he has. Yet look at his palmares. One of the most cunning and canny riders we’ve seen in modern cycling. There’s something truly admirable about that.

While i agree that he has surpassed his talent many times, i think you are underselling him saying that he isn't on the top half dozen in anything, his climbing on hard mountain stages is a bit underrated, his TT in the third week of a GT is very very good and his stamina has gotten incredible as he got older, who else could do what he's done today or at lombardia last year? He is a machine even on the flat after a long day in the saddle

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

BTW why are you guys convinced he will ride Pais Vasco? It's been years since the last time he did this race and I don't really see a point in riding it.

It was always in the program, funnily enough, Milano-Sanremo wasn't. It's his final prep race before the Ardennes which he is targeting. It was also the problem with riding Ronde, which he would've liked, but it finishes on Sunday before the Monday start of Pais Vasco. Apparently they managed to solve the logistics of arriving in time for the start the stage race and ride De Ronde on April 1st.