Vuelta 2017 stage 11 Lorca - Calar Alto 187,5 km

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Re: Re:

Tank Engine said:
skippo12 said:
The sad thing is that except for Nibali and to a lesser extent Contador no one is even trying to challenge Froome. Orica did a lot of work earlier and was no where to be seen when it mattered most. Zakarin and Kelderman were happy enough to establish a top 10 position and the rest of the group was either way down in the GC or a Sky helper.
That's just right. Orica, Zakarin and Keldermercx should simply press the pedals harder :cool:

yaco said:
De La Cruz was impressive - No puncture at the bottom of the climb and he at least finishes with the Contador group if not better - This is the kind of climb that suit Lopez - He's a very good diesel climber.
Good to see Superman fully back. I was very impressed by De La Cruz, he was really unlucky. Why is he going to Sky :confused: (please don't give me the obvious answer)

ontheroad said:
Froome back to third is 2:30 minutes with a TT to come. Anyone thinking he was slightly in decline after the tour is forced to think again. He is stronger at this Vuelta than he was at the tour. Just compare him to Bardet and Aru who were up there on GC at the tour.

Nibali looking good to take 2nd as he now has over a minute on all other competitiors and is probably a slightly better TT'ist than most other GC men. The only remaining battle is probably for the 3rd podium spot which is a bit disappointing for the race with it being only half way through.
Nibali is not going to settle for second. The Shark will get stronger relative to the Alien as the race goes on, but The Alien has already put time into Nibbles and has the TT to come, so Nibbles will probably have to find 2.5 to 3 minutes on the Alien in the mountains and Sky have the strongest team. A big call, but this race isn't over yet.

I think the Alien was playing it smart by sitting at the back and I wonder how exhausted Moscon was when he dropped (how much of a monster is he?). Bahrain had an obvious gain from pushing at that point and Froome could just react when necessary. He'll be looking to match his closest competitor at the lowest possible cost and that is more or less what he did today and Poels will probably be in top gear for the last week (he never had to hit the front today).
I think we got the point.
 
Re: Re:

Tank Engine said:
tobydawq said:
I think we got the point.
No point, I'm just using a nickname. You know where my username comes from?
G? Voeckler? Marczynski? Dekker? De Gendt? Benjamin?

There are quite a lot of possibilities.

The difference is just that your "nickname" for Froome is quite tasteless and I found it a little unnecessary to repeat it four times in the same paragraph...
 
Re: Re:

DFA123 said:
klintE said:
klintE said:
TJ, Roche, Wooods, De La Cruz to drop down in GC.
Zakarin, Kelderman, Yates shall improve their GC position
Almost. Almost! :)
Although I have to say, TJ and Roche losing significant time today was about the most predictable thing to happen in cycling since Porte failing to live up to expectations in the Tour.
Sadly, you are right.
 
Re:

Breh said:
How realistic is Froome mopping up GC, points and KOM?
Valverde has a good record in the points classifications in recent history (winning or top few spots) when placed high on the GC.

Given the lack of flat stages, it certainly makes it more plausible for that to occur than when a sprinter has a chance at the points jersey.

Of the three, I think KOM is probably the hardest for the team to secure for him, and the least likely.
 
Re:

Valv.Piti said:
I just realised that stage 15 is a lot harder than I thought. Hazallanes + Purche/Monachil and then a 5% drag to Sierra Nevada. Thats a Aprica deluxe!
I have ridden those roads (spent a week there two years ago near Guejar), not all the way to the top of Sierra Nevada ski area, but it is hard terrain. It could also be hotter than Hades. The climb out of Monachil to Purche is not long but is really steep, especially at the bottom (says 8 percent @ 8.5 km, but there's a dip near the top that dilutes it). The Alto de Hazallanas shouldn't be categorized as one climb -- the section leaving Guejar Sierra is super gnarly with sections over 20 percent, but the road into Guejar isn't that hard. I have no idea how the riders will handle it. It would take me all day with six stops for cafe and some LA super juice...
 
Tonton said:
Tonton said:
The last climb could be deadly, but recent history shows that nothing happens early. Guys will drop from the back, some will not come back, we'll peel off the artichoke, no more. Big picture, nothing...maybe the day that TJ is the casualty though.
...better than usual on the prediction side :) ...

Nibali is at the same level as he was in the Giro; week 2 and 3 he will get stronger. But he's still a notch below Froome, at least for now. I don't see Il Squalo gaining the 3 minutes he needs before the ITT. Dawg gets marginal time gains over his opponents every day. His lead is now quite substantial. It's his Vuelta to lose: I don't see it happening. Berto is well within range for a podium spot.

Wilco fares better than I would have thought, and so does De La Cruz. But the race is still young. Terrible day for BMC. Bardet deserved better today, but he'll try again.

It turned out to be a little better of a bike race than I expected.
Good call. though I'd argue that the big picture was completely disrupted. we went from top 9 within 2 minutes to only Nibali within 2 minutes of FRoome.
 
Re: Re:

Tank Engine said:
skippo12 said:
The sad thing is that except for Nibali and to a lesser extent Contador no one is even trying to challenge Froome. Orica did a lot of work earlier and was no where to be seen when it mattered most. Zakarin and Kelderman were happy enough to establish a top 10 position and the rest of the group was either way down in the GC or a Sky helper.
That's just right. Orica, Zakarin and Keldermercx should simply press the pedals harder :cool:

yaco said:
De La Cruz was impressive - No puncture at the bottom of the climb and he at least finishes with the Contador group if not better - This is the kind of climb that suit Lopez - He's a very good diesel climber.
Good to see Superman fully back. I was very impressed by De La Cruz, he was really unlucky. Why is he going to Sky :confused: (please don't give me the obvious answer)

ontheroad said:
Froome back to third is 2:30 minutes with a TT to come. Anyone thinking he was slightly in decline after the tour is forced to think again. He is stronger at this Vuelta than he was at the tour. Just compare him to Bardet and Aru who were up there on GC at the tour.

Nibali looking good to take 2nd as he now has over a minute on all other competitiors and is probably a slightly better TT'ist than most other GC men. The only remaining battle is probably for the 3rd podium spot which is a bit disappointing for the race with it being only half way through.
Nibali is not going to settle for second. The Shark will get stronger relative to the Alien as the race goes on, but The Alien has already put time into Nibbles and has the TT to come, so Nibbles will probably have to find 2.5 to 3 minutes on the Alien in the mountains and Sky have the strongest team. A big call, but this race isn't over yet.

I think the Alien was playing it smart by sitting at the back and I wonder how exhausted Moscon was when he dropped (how much of a monster is he?). Bahrain had an obvious gain from pushing at that point and Froome could just react when necessary. He'll be looking to match his closest competitor at the lowest possible cost. That is more or less what he did today and Poels will probably be in top gear for the last week (he never had to hit the front today).
Unless Froome really fades I don't see Nibali taking time off him on the Angliru.
 
Re: Re:

Bolder said:
Valv.Piti said:
I just realised that stage 15 is a lot harder than I thought. Hazallanes + Purche/Monachil and then a 5% drag to Sierra Nevada. Thats a Aprica deluxe!
I have ridden those roads (spent a week there two years ago near Guejar), not all the way to the top of Sierra Nevada ski area, but it is hard terrain. It could also be hotter than Hades. The climb out of Monachil to Purche is not long but is really steep, especially at the bottom (says 8 percent @ 8.5 km, but there's a dip near the top that dilutes it). The Alto de Hazallanas shouldn't be categorized as one climb -- the section leaving Guejar Sierra is super gnarly with sections over 20 percent, but the road into Guejar isn't that hard. I have no idea how the riders will handle it. It would take me all day with six stops for cafe and some LA super juice...
Im possibly hyping that stage a bit too much, but its easily the stage I look forward to the most in this Vuelta now. It has all the ingredients to be great, but on the other hand there still is the possibility of everything staying together until the last 4 km.
 
Re: Re:

Valv.Piti said:
Bolder said:
Valv.Piti said:
I just realised that stage 15 is a lot harder than I thought. Hazallanes + Purche/Monachil and then a 5% drag to Sierra Nevada. Thats a Aprica deluxe!
I have ridden those roads (spent a week there two years ago near Guejar), not all the way to the top of Sierra Nevada ski area, but it is hard terrain. It could also be hotter than Hades. The climb out of Monachil to Purche is not long but is really steep, especially at the bottom (says 8 percent @ 8.5 km, but there's a dip near the top that dilutes it). The Alto de Hazallanas shouldn't be categorized as one climb -- the section leaving Guejar Sierra is super gnarly with sections over 20 percent, but the road into Guejar isn't that hard. I have no idea how the riders will handle it. It would take me all day with six stops for cafe and some LA super juice...
Im possibly hyping that stage a bit too much, but its easily the stage I look forward to the most in this Vuelta now. It has all the ingredients to be great, but on the other hand there still is the possibility of everything staying together until the last 4 km.
Absolutely not, that stage is incredibly hard, but you're right that a lot depends on how it's raced.
 
Nibali tends to do OK on super steep slopes. Apart from Zoncolan 2010 (and obviously the 2011 vuelta, but it's probably better to ignore that whole race) he's never had a seriously bad day. He even almost matched Horner up the Angliru despite attacking at the bottom a couple of times, and being against Horner. His time was 20+ seconds faster than Cobo in worse weather.

Edit: this was to a post on other page
 
Jul 16, 2011
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Re: Re:

tobydawq said:
G? Voeckler? Marczynski? Dekker? De Gendt? Benjamin?

There are quite a lot of possibilities.

The difference is just that your "nickname" for Froome is quite tasteless and I found it a little unnecessary to repeat it four times in the same paragraph...
1. G

2. Fair enough. It's been used before and I haven't seen anyone complain. I guess I did get into the flow and kept using it.

3. I guess Froome as a person seems rather other worldly to me, but I've nothing against him.

4. What about "Preying Mantis"? (I use that from time to time, but it's longer :eek:).
 
Re: Re:

Tank Engine said:
tobydawq said:
G? Voeckler? Marczynski? Dekker? De Gendt? Benjamin?

There are quite a lot of possibilities.

The difference is just that your "nickname" for Froome is quite tasteless and I found it a little unnecessary to repeat it four times in the same paragraph...
1. G

2. Fair enough. It's been used before and I haven't seen anyone complain. I guess I did get into the flow and kept using it.

3. I guess Froome as a person seems rather other worldly to me, but I've nothing against him.

4. What about "Preying Mantis"? (I use that from time to time, but it's longer :eek:).
Has anyone ever noticed that cycling fans have to give a nickname to every cyclist. Some make sense (El Pistolero, Smiling Assassin), others not so much (Terminator), and some are just lazy but necessary in making sure every cyclist has a nickname (G, Nico). Cycling fans - so strange
 
Chapeau Superman! :)

So Froome has more then 2 and a half minutes on everyone but Nibs. To be close on time to Froome before the ITT will take team work or an alliance. (What's with Froome's World War 2 motorcycle googles?! :D )
 
Re: Re:

Robert5091 said:
Asturiano said:
According to Contador, Chris wasn't good and he asked Nieve to stop but he could recuperate himself.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/froome-takes-a-huge-step-in-vuelta-a-espana-bid/

"I told Nieve to go for it on GC and thought maybe they were not going to chase him, but the race opened up again."
"At no moment was I afraid of being dropped," Froome emphasised.
Froome's saying he was content to wheel suck ... who'd ya believe?
Berto was on his wheel so I guess he heard it... I believe him, why would he say it otherwise, nothing to gain from lying about it.
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
Robert5091 said:
Asturiano said:
According to Contador, Chris wasn't good and he asked Nieve to stop but he could recuperate himself.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/froome-takes-a-huge-step-in-vuelta-a-espana-bid/

"I told Nieve to go for it on GC and thought maybe they were not going to chase him, but the race opened up again."
"At no moment was I afraid of being dropped," Froome emphasised.
Froome's saying he was content to wheel suck ... who'd ya believe?
Berto was on his wheel so I guess he heard it... I believe him, why would he say it otherwise, nothing to gain from lying about it.
The two episodes happened at different moments and they are not mutually exclusive.
 
Jul 14, 2015
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Not sure how it matters if he was good or not given he finished in front off all his GC contenders and gained time. If that is his bad climbing..
 
Looking at the gc, the fight for the podium might become very interesting. Froome is ofc the huge favorite for the win and Nibali will quite likely get 2nd, considering his decent TT and a good gap to 3rd. However behind that the race is extremely close with Chaves, De La Cruz, Kelderman and Zakarin within 6 seconds, and Aru is less than 30 seconds away from the podium as well. Moreover you have guys like Lopez and Contador a bit further behind which have to be considered as possible podium contenders as well, since Contador will probably attack like crazy and is only so far behind because he was sick, while Lopez looked like the strongest climber of the whole race today.

So even if Froome keeps on dominating, there is still a lot to look forward to.
 
Re: Re:

Tank Engine said:
4. What about "Preying Mantis"? (I use that from time to time, but it's longer :eek:).
FWIW, it's praying mantis, because with its little front legs it looks like it's praying. :)
They are fascinating to look at but I have a bad relationship with those critters, nearly made me pee my pants TWICE, those buggers get big, I wonder if I don't like Froome because he reminds me of them :)
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
Tank Engine said:
4. What about "Preying Mantis"? (I use that from time to time, but it's longer :eek:).
FWIW, it's praying mantis, because with its little front legs it looks like it's praying. :)
They are fascinating to look at but I have a bad relationship with those critters, nearly made me pee my pants TWICE, those buggers get big, I wonder if I don't like Froome because he reminds me of them :)
:lol:
 
Gigs_98 said:
Looking at the gc, the fight for the podium might become very interesting. Froome is ofc the huge favorite for the win and Nibali will quite likely get 2nd, considering his decent TT and a good gap to 3rd. However behind that the race is extremely close with Chaves, De La Cruz, Kelderman and Zakarin within 6 seconds, and Aru is less than 30 seconds away from the podium as well. Moreover you have guys like Lopez and Contador a bit further behind which have to be considered as possible podium contenders as well, since Contador will probably attack like crazy and is only so far behind because he was sick, while Lopez looked like the strongest climber of the whole race today.

So even if Froome keeps on dominating, there is still a lot to look forward to.
A fight for scraps... not really something that excites me.
I look forward to that as much as I look forward to the fight for 7th place! As in, I don't really care :) even the minor classifications are more interesting, although it looks like Froome is easily winning them all.
Sorry to be such a sourpuss but it does annoy me a bit when a race is decided way too early and people still act as if there's plenty to get excited about - I think usually they also need to convince themselves ;)
 

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