Vuelta a España 2011

[LaFleur]

I was on the Xorret del Catí when good old Rein went crack... Poor guy. I'll take it.

However, if I say I'm confident Kittel will get a podium place and he doesn't and then I have to sport a Kittel avatar,then you're kind of rubbing it in that I failed, right?

Ok.. since I'm not a native speaker, then I have no idea what "sporting a Kittel avatar" means, but I will rub it in a bit ...

 

[El Pistolero]

Ok.. since I'm not a native speaker, then I have no idea what "sporting a Kittel avatar" means, but I will rub it in a bit ...

sporting - involving risk or willingness to take a risk; "a sporting chance"; "sporting blood"
adventuresome, adventurous - willing to undertake or seeking out new and daring enterprises; "adventurous pioneers"; "the risks and gains of an adventuresome economy"
4. sporting - preoccupied with the pursuit of pleasure and especially games of chance; "led a dissipated life"; "a betting man"; "a card-playing son of a *****"; "a gambling fool"; "sporting gents and their ladies"
betting, card-playing, dissipated
indulgent - characterized by or given to yielding to the wishes of someone ; "indulgent grandparents"

 

[Fetisoff]

Sporting a Kittel avatar basically means having Kittel on your avatar.

 

[hrotha]

Yeah, sorry Pisto but in this context it's more like sporting a moustache.

 

[The Hitch]

sporting - involving risk or willingness to take a risk; "a sporting chance"; "sporting blood"
adventuresome, adventurous - willing to undertake or seeking out new and daring enterprises; "adventurous pioneers"; "the risks and gains of an adventuresome economy"
4. sporting - preoccupied with the pursuit of pleasure and especially games of chance; "led a dissipated life"; "a betting man"; "a card-playing son of a *****"; "a gambling fool"; "sporting gents and their ladies"
betting, card-playing, dissipated
indulgent - characterized by or given to yielding to the wishes of someone ; "indulgent grandparents"

This is the most sense ive seen in an El Pistolero post in weeks

 

[Waterloo Sunrise]

sporting - involving risk or willingness to take a risk; "a sporting chance"; "sporting blood"
adventuresome, adventurous - willing to undertake or seeking out new and daring enterprises; "adventurous pioneers"; "the risks and gains of an adventuresome economy"
4. sporting - preoccupied with the pursuit of pleasure and especially games of chance; "led a dissipated life"; "a betting man"; "a card-playing son of a *****"; "a gambling fool"; "sporting gents and their ladies"
betting, card-playing, dissipated
indulgent - characterized by or given to yielding to the wishes of someone ; "indulgent grandparents"

'sporting' in that context means wearing, not any of the things you've pasted above.

 

[icefire]

This is the most sense ive seen in an El Pistolero post in weeks

He surely copied it from a web dictionary

 

[Winterfold]

a full km at 17.6% average I knew the Angliru is ridiculous but that is insane

ACF - I think Sky's team looks like they are serious about supporting Wiggo and not much else, Sutton for the one or two sprints or some breaks.

In all their PR the bosses were certainly talking like they are expecting him to fully go for it and not blouse or chuck his toys out on a bad day.

It is time for him to man up to his leadership role for a full three weeks, but it will be hard for him.

That said, him and Menchov can gain some big time on that TT, especially with a bit of wind.

 

[Descender]

Sporting a Kittel avatar basically means having Kittel on your avatar.

Exactly lol. Didn't mean to spark a discussion.

 

[Parrulo]

so i just read on a portuguese newspaper machado saying that he feels like he can be in contention . . .

he could reach the high end part of the top 10 if the stars align but i doubt it will happen.

 

[luckyboy]

Woah didn't realise there are a full 21 days between the end of the Vuelta and the Worlds RR.
Cav + co probably gonna ride on til Madrid then..

 

[ingsve]

Woah didn't realise there are a full 21 days between the end of the Vuelta and the Worlds RR.
Cav + co probably gonna ride on til Madrid then..

It's not it's only 14 days. Vuelta ends on the 11th and Worlds is on the 25th.

 

[gregrowlerson]

Hearing that the Angliru's final 6.5 kms average 13% (!!!!!!!!!!), I reckon that it's potentially an even tougher climb than Zoncolan, which averages 12% (slightly less) for 10 kms (so for longer). The Angliru also has the 6 kms at about 6.5% as a warm up to its horrible second half, giving it it's 9.9% total average. That 17.6% full km also contributes to it's argument as being the toughest climb. Opinions?

 

[will10]

Angliru is a completely different climb to Zoncolan because of the steep ramps and easier sections in between. Zoncolan is relentlessly steep but the ramps on the Angliru are even steeper. I wouldn't want to guess which is tougher, they're both awesome climbs, let's leave it at that

 

[Havetts]

Angliru is a completely different climb to Zoncolan because of the steep ramps and easier sections in between. Zoncolan is relentlessly steep but the ramps on the Angliru are even steeper. I wouldn't want to guess which is tougher, they're both awesome climbs, let's leave it at that

Theyre both awesome climbs which tops I wont reach by bike !

 

[El Pistolero]

It's not it's only 14 days. Vuelta ends on the 11th and Worlds is on the 25th.

Good, my vacation only ends till after the Worlds! How easy we students have it these days.

 

[El Pistolero]

so i just read on a portuguese newspaper machado saying that he feels like he can be in contention . . .

he could reach the high end part of the top 10 if the stars align but i doubt it will happen.

In the Vuelta a rider like him can get in the low end of the top 10. Without bad luck of course.

 

[The Hitch]

Hearing that the Angliru's final 6.5 kms average 13% (!!!!!!!!!!), I reckon that it's potentially an even tougher climb than Zoncolan, which averages 12% (slightly less) for 10 kms (so for longer). The Angliru also has the 6 kms at about 6.5% as a warm up to its horrible second half, giving it it's 9.9% total average. That 17.6% full km also contributes to it's argument as being the toughest climb. Opinions?

nah Zoncolan Ovaro is worse. You get steep km in Zoncolan too, just not if you start counting kilometers from 0. Forget 17, one 1000m section between 6km and 8km on Zoncolan just misses 20%

You say 6.5km at 13% is tougher than 10k at 12%.

But Zoncolans middle section is 5km at 15.3%. The next km is 13% meaning 6km at 14.9 % compared to Angilirus 6.5km at 13%


I also personally think its worse having the supertough gradients at the beginning and middle.

Because that way the riders go into the "easier" 9% sections of Zoncolan with absolutely no momentum, the steeper sections already having done the damage,

On Angry Lu on the other hand the pack can go quite fast up the relatively flat by comparison first half, letting fireworks only start towards the end of the climb.

Of course Angiliru loses on almost every statistical comparison. It has a lower average gradient - 9.9 vs 11.9. A lower maximum gradient - 23% vs 26.5% and less kilometers in 10%+ gradients - 6 vs 8. Angiliru is longer however by almost 2km and hence has a higher alltitude gain, but only just 1248 vs 1210, and Zoncolan does take place at a higher alltitude

 

[theyoungest]

nah Zoncolan Ovaro is worse. You get steep km in Zoncolan too, just not if you start counting kilometers from 0. Forget 17, one 1000m section between 6 and 8k just misses 20%

You say 6.5km at 13% is tougher than 10k at 12%.

But Zoncolans middle section is 5km at 15.3%. The next km is 13% meaning 6km at 14.9 % compared to Angilirus 6.5km at 13%


I also personally think its worse having the supertough gradients at the beginning and middle.

Because that way the riders go into the "easier" 9% sections of Zoncolan with absolutely no momentum, the steeper sections already having done the damage,

On Angry Lu on the other hand the pack can go quite fast up the relatively flat by comparison first half, letting fireworks only start towards the end of the climb.

The Zoncolan seems relatively steady in comparison to the Angliru. I think for the non-pure climber types the Angliru is definitely harder, because of the changes in rhythm. The gaps also seemed bigger on that climb, the two times I've seen it, than on the Zoncolan, but maybe I'm wrong.

 

[El Pistolero]

Contador also called Angliru harder, for what it's worth.

 

[The Hitch]

The Zoncolan seems relatively steady in comparison to the Angliru. I think for the non-pure climber types the Angliru is definitely harder, because of the changes in rhythm. The gaps also seemed bigger on that climb, the two times I've seen it, than on the Zoncolan, but maybe I'm wrong.

What changes in rythm? The Angiliru has its easy gradients on one side of the climb, and then its hardest gradients on the other side of the climb. Exactly like Zoncolan just that the higher gradients are greater and last longer on Zonc.

Sure in those severe km on Angiliru the climb gets slightly easier then slightly steeper constantly but thats exactly the same on Zonc.

And theres a lot of factors other than severity of the climb that contribute to time gaps. Gap got bigger gaps than Plateau de Beille for example.

Zoncolan is relentlessly steep but the ramps on the Angliru are even steeper.

Nah, Zoncolans ramps are steeper Higher maximum grades, higher average grades and i repeat - 14.9% for 6km vs 13 for 6.5.

Contador also called Angliru harder, for what it's worth.

And Gibo called Zoncolan harder, for what its worth.

Course Gibo won on both, Contador has not.

 

[El Pistolero]

But Angliru has a full km at 17.5%, Zoncolan doesn't

Zoncolan is protected by trees on either side, Angliru isn't. I don't know the temperature, but I'd put my money on it being a lot warmer at the Angliru as well... Angliru has many bends, Zoncolan doesn't. Angliru has that killer km of 17.5km at the near end, that kills legs off. The Zoncolan eases off near the end, the Angliru remains hard from the moment you get to the steep parts. And on top of that, the climb is also longer.

Also it doesn't matter if you have won on both, as long as you have ridden them both.

I doubt Gibo would have won on Angliru if the Spanish fans were as tasteless as some of the Italian tifosi.

 

[hrotha]

Why would you assume Angliru is warmer? Even if it is, it wouldn't be hot enough to actually make it harder. It's Asturias. It rains more often than not, and the temperature is mild even in summer.

 

[just some guy]

Again unsure if posted

RadioShack line up for the Vuelta:
Riders; Jani Brajkovic, Matthew Busche, Markel Irizar, Andreas Klöden, Geoffroy Lequatre, Tiago Machado, Nelson Oliveira, Sérgio Paulinho & Haimar Zubeldia

 

[The Hitch]

I don't know the temperature, but I'd put my money on it being a lot warmer at the Angliru as well..

True and not neccesary an argument in favour. If you read post stage comments what the riders were really complaining about on Zoncolan this year was the cold. Together with having to climb the Zonc it was torture.

Though its not like theres usually sun when they go up Angirilu. That time Heras won was horrid weather. You should know better than anyone it wasnt blisttering heat when Contador won.

But Angliru has a full km at 17.5%, Zoncolan doesn't

Yes it does. Dont you read what i said. The Zoncolan has a kilometer of nearly 20%.

Angliru has many bends, Zoncolan doesn't. Angliru has that killer km of 17.5km at the near end, that kills legs off. .

Yep it kills the legs of just as they are about to finish.

Zoncolan kills the legs off with 6k still to go.

The Zoncolan eases off near the end, the Angliru remains hard from the moment you get to the steep parts. /QUOTE]

Yes youve made this " its hardest at the top" cry a few times now and i keep telling you its worse to have the hardest sections in the middle. Rather than crack the rider as they are about to cross the finish line, it cracks the riders with half the climb still to go.

Especially since Zoncolans "easier" sections are like the hardest sections of climbs like Alpe, Ventoux, Tourmalet.

Not to mention that the hardest sections of Zoncolan are longer and harder than Angirilu.

And Zoncolan ends on an 11% which is about the Max gradient for most TDF hc climbs, so "eases off" doesnt tell the whole story.

the climb is also longer

Its longer by 1.5 k but significantly less steep.

I guess Galibier is the hardest climb then, cos you know, its longer.


And before anyone points it out, yes i do see the funny side of us ferociously debating the superiority of climbs, the way most posters do riders, but since im not Italian and hes not Spanish its not as sad as it may seem.